To be there for the viewings?

[SachaStark]

My landlord is selling the house we live in, and the estate agent is doing about 10 viewings tomorrow afternoon.

AIBU to be present for the viewings? The LL is totally fine with it, but the estate agent seems quite put out.

My reasonings are that, whilst it might be a property to sell to the estate agent, it’s also our home, and filled with our possessions, and I’d rather be in the house to keep an eye on things. Also, why should I inconvenience myself by making myself scarce for several hours? I’ve got a stack of exercise books to mark as it’s half term week (secondary teacher), and I don’t much relish the thought of dragging all those books out and about with me whilst I try to find an appropriate place to work.

If it were an ordinary day without these viewings, that’s what I would be doing, so should I just be able to carry on as normal?

@Whatshouldicallme

Also, I don't think it's usual for sales viewings to go ahead whilst a tenant is in place. When we were renting I remember some of the properties we viewed seemed to still have tenants in place but buying, no. It was always empty or owner occupied. I think you are already doing them a favour by letting them in.

When selling a house, unless selling as a BTL, the seller should wait until it's vacant anyway. Nobody sensible will offer on a house with tenants in if they want to live in it.

It’s really not that unusual for a tenant or owner to be in the house while viewings take place. Having a load of other buyers there is actually more awkward.

@Beeeeeeeeeeeeeep

Nobody sensible will offer on a house with tenants in if they want to live in it

Why on Earth not? I have done this several times without any issue .

If there’s a question mark over whether the tenant will actually leave then that’s different, but this is very rarely the case. It usually doesn’t go on the market until the last month or two of the tenancy, or at least after a tenant has been issued notice.

Don’t forget the easier you make it for the LL to let, the more likely they are to give good will gestures at the end of the tenancy

We fell for this once and then had to fight to get our deposit back.

@Beeeeeeeeeeeeeep

Yes, this is what I thought as well. We are in London so quite a few properties we viewed were formal rentals but always vacant. It doesn't seem usual at all to sell on in London with tenants in place. Maybe it's regional?

Be there. Protect your possessions, be welcoming, perhaps even answer the odd question that the estate agent might not know or even be expected to know.

If you were out of the house apart from the risk of a thief, the times given may not be stuck to. You have no idea whether or not the estate agent is a good timekeeper or not.

[quote DelilahTheParrot]@Beeeeeeeeeeeeeep

Nobody sensible will offer on a house with tenants in if they want to live in it

Why on Earth not? I have done this several times without any issue .

If there’s a question mark over whether the tenant will actually leave then that’s different, but this is very rarely the case. It usually doesn’t go on the market until the last month or two of the tenancy, or at least after a tenant has been issued notice.[/quote]
You were lucky then. Tenants don't always leave at the end of the notice period. There is no way I would offer on a property until it was vacant.

I can’t believe the ignorant comments from some PP. I think the lowest point was
if the tenant wants this then they can pay for an extra month or two of the house being unoccupied after they leave, which is how long it usually takes to find new tenants and have them move in. Why should the LL be 8-10% out of pocket

Of course the tenant doesn’t have to allow visits. It is nice, but absolutely not a given. The idea of a tenant being asked to pay for extra months to allow visits after they have left is just hilarious. They are allowed to refuse visits until the last day.

In reality, yes they will usually accept visits as long as the LL and estate agent doesn’t bully them, ie tell them it is happening vs ask them if they would allow it. The tenant specifying certain days/times for the visits is also not them being difficult - they are making you a favour!

@Whatshouldicallme a plausible explanation is that the LL wanted to tidy and paint property after a tenancy. Tbh it depends on your tenants. If I had tenants who didn’t look after it I’d wait and then do it up. Fortunately all my tenants have taken great care of their homes.

Sorry the previous post turned into a bit of a vent
I don’t think it is that off putting to a prospective buyer to have someone in. Serious buyers look past people and furniture. Definitely the case at the moment.
If you don’t want to move, I’d suggest letting the EA know and ask them to serve notice or serve it yourself once you find something. Easier on all fronts. Viewing and selling with sitting tenants is really awkward.

DelilahTheParrot

@Sugarplumfairy65 that’s generous. I always let mine move out early without paying the remaining time on the agreement if they’ve been amenable in allowing viewings that mean it’s a quick transaction. I’m also more likely to waive chargeable items on the inventory. I do this because I know exactly what is coming next and when.

Comes down to the same thing, you and I are both giving a financial benefit to the tenant in return for making the property available.

Only apparently I am a “bad landlord”, a “bully” and a “feudal overlord” grin.

The difference is, I don't put unfair and unenforceable terms in my contracts. When notice is given, I email current tenants and ask them if it's something that they will be prepared to allow.

Landlords on here stating they have contract clauses to try to evade the law and if their tenants have the audacity to ignore this illegal clause and enact their legal rights they’d punish them by refusing to give them a reference and punish the next tenant by upping the rent, SHAME ON YOU!

At least you've been able to have the conversation with the LL. (Off-topic but you've reminded me that) when I was renting, the first I even knew that the LL was selling the house was early on a Saturday morning when an estate agent ushered a couple of viewers into my bedroom while I was still asleep in bed. I was livid.

To the OP, the owner doesn’t mind you being there so the estate agent can wind their neck in.

Morning, thanks for all the responses! It’s interesting reading from all sides.

The LL is a good friend of ours, so I’d feel awful towards him to not allow viewings at all. But, like I said, he’s fine with me being here. We’ve all said that we will be shocked if there aren’t multiple offers today (it’s a very idealistic place right on a quay in Cornwall, sunrise over the water, that kind of thing), as there’s been so much interest. I doubt that me sitting at my table will put people off if they’re as determined as the EA thinks they are.

Like I said, more than happy to allow viewings, and the mood is smiley and welcoming here!... But I really can’t be bothered with the faff of having to clear out for multiple hours at a time when it’s still my home. It’s not even like I think anyone will actually steal anything or whatever, it’s more the thought of going out, and coming back knowing that 10 groups of people have been through your home whilst you’ve been out. Feels a bit ick, you know?

And yes, I’ll be spending the time working. DH is out at work, and we have weekend plans with friends, so I’d really rather not be trying to fit work in/think about work after Friday afternoon. So, if I carry on marking today and use Friday for report writing, then I won’t fall behind 👍🏻 . Surely it’s not that unfathomable that I might want to use normal working hours to work during half term?!

It’s been really interesting reading the different responses.

@Sugarplumfairy65 right right yes. I’m such a terrible person.

This thread has made me much less inclined to offer any financial good will to my tenants at the end of the tenancy when I don’t have to. I let my last tenant off around £2,500 because I knew I had someone moving in.

Proportionately to income that will come at much more of a cost to tenants than it will to me, but look, if people want to do everything by the book then it works both ways.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken no one is saying they’ll refuse a reference.

[quote DelilahTheParrot]@Sugarplumfairy65 right right yes. I’m such a terrible person.

This thread has made me much less inclined to offer any financial good will to my tenants at the end of the tenancy when I don’t have to. I let my last tenant off around £2,500 because I knew I had someone moving in.

Proportionately to income that will come at much more of a cost to tenants than it will to me, but look, if people want to do everything by the book then it works both ways.[/quote]
More threats...

[quote DelilahTheParrot]@Sugarplumfairy65 right right yes. I’m such a terrible person.

This thread has made me much less inclined to offer any financial good will to my tenants at the end of the tenancy when I don’t have to. I let my last tenant off around £2,500 because I knew I had someone moving in.

Proportionately to income that will come at much more of a cost to tenants than it will to me, but look, if people want to do everything by the book then it works both ways.[/quote]
If you relet then you were at no financial disadvantage right? So why do you think you did a great thing by forgiving the rent of the outgoing tenant when you've already got someone else to cover it?

I think you’re right to stay home and carry out your usual tasks. 10 viewings is a massive imposition. It isn’t your role to make the viewers feel comfortable and you have the right to protect your belongings. The EA has no relationship with you, so he/she isn’t acting in your best interests.

I wouldn’t have anyone in the house in the current circumstances. It’s massively intrusive, but more so given the virus that’s circulating still!

We rented between selling/buying. With hindsight, I shouldn’t have permitted viewings at all. It was massively inconvenient with a toddler and newborn. I was helpful to the landlord by answering viewer questions positively about the area. I didn’t tell the viewers that the house was under a major flight path, that the windows didn’t seal properly so the property was difficult to heat, that next door had just had a big renovation approved through planning permission, that the landlord quibbled and delayed any repairs needed (like flushes, boiler breakdown in winter etc), that the quiet country lane we were on was a big rat run if there was any closure/delay on the M25 (not that close or obvious) and finally, that the main train-line to London ran past the end of the garden (hidden behind trees and at a dropped level and not clear if you don’t know the area well). The house was rented for the day after we left.

When we moved out, I ended up having to dispute my landlord’s unfair deductions from our deposit. Asshole. I got my money back from the deposit service, but what a chancer!!

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken and no one is saying they’ll “punish” the next tenant.

The point is that there is a significant financial cost to the LL of a tenant not allowing viewings, which is not built in to tenancy agreements. If it’s something that people come to expect as standard, then the prices will have to reflect that.

[quote DelilahTheParrot]@Sugarplumfairy65 right right yes. I’m such a terrible person.

This thread has made me much less inclined to offer any financial good will to my tenants at the end of the tenancy when I don’t have to. I let my last tenant off around £2,500 because I knew I had someone moving in.

Proportionately to income that will come at much more of a cost to tenants than it will to me, but look, if people want to do everything by the book then it works both ways.[/quote]
Also - if your property is somewhere that lettings are hard to get then you won't lose anything by waiting for your tenants to leave before viewing - you'll have someone in within a fortnight. I assume by your confident statements that you can put the rent up that it's a landlords' market? So void periods are rare?
On the other hand if your area is more of a tenants' market then good luck with whacking up the rent...

@Sugarplumfairy65 because the new tenant didn’t move in until the day after the first agreement ended. I let the tenant go three weeks early so it was empty over that time without income, and I didn’t deduct anything from the deposit despite the fact that there were multiple deductions I could have made.

But yes, go ahead, keep assuming I’m a bad LL.

[quote DelilahTheParrot]@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken and no one is saying they’ll “punish” the next tenant.

The point is that there is a significant financial cost to the LL of a tenant not allowing viewings, which is not built in to tenancy agreements. If it’s something that people come to expect as standard, then the prices will have to reflect that.[/quote]
You would refuse someone a roof over their head, which they are paying for you to have outright ownership of, because they exercised their legal rights. It’s disgusting.

@Beeeeeeeeeeeeeep it’s more that most people aren’t in the position to move within two weeks, usually that they have to give eg two months notice on their existing contract. Typically I’d expect 4-6 weeks between a tenant signing, and a tenant moving in.