What's the point in protests?

[Jourdain11]

DD2 and I went to Westfield yesterday afternoon and got caught up in the protest as we were leaving. DD (7) was quite fascinated ("I'll tell my class and my teacher all about it after half term!" - hoping she will have forgotten) and I felt a bit of an idiot to have waited till late afternoon to go, so as to "avoid the crowds"

When we got the tube back, there was a lady with a megaphone and many others telling other travellers to take off their masks and set themselves free, etc.

Now, the issue is... I don't disagree with some of their points. I don't disagree with people's right to protest (albeit that I'm a little cynical about their choice of Westfield as a venue). But what does protest, marches, etc. ever actually achieve?

For example - the People's Vote demos. Did they change anything?

Some have argued tht New Labour devalued protest as a form of discussion in 2003 by completely ignoring the Iraq demos (i.e. refusal to engage in any way whatsoever). But even before that - the WSPU protests were not, for example, very successful in obtaining the vote for women. The most you could argue is that their activities brought exposure to the issue, which meant that it was on the post-war agenda.

Aren't there more effective ways of addressing and bringing attention to public issues?

What do you think? Yes = YABU, protest is a valuable form of debate and can change things. No = protest, in our times, is unlikely to effect change.

Yes protests in general are pointless. It takes lobbying to get things done. The real influence on public policy happens in smoky backrooms at the centre of power. I think the right to openly protest is like letting steam from a pressure cooker. If you don’t allow it, the simmering eventually turns to something dangerous. So it only serves that purpose.

It gives some people a day out, they meet like minded people, let off steam etc. Do they change things, probably not.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be allowed, btw! Only that, I don't see that they actually change anything... If people who are attending really want to change things, wouldn't they do better to look for other paths to pursue?

In the immediate, it's about raising awareness. Getting other people to talk about the issue and take action/ make changes.

In the longer term, it's a marker of disagreement that history books would otherwise miss.

They have very little sway politically, ordinary people do not have the influence (money) to do that. But it's better to do something, to voice the fact that you disagree, than to do nothing at all.

wouldn't they do better to look for other paths to pursue?

What do you suggest? The reality is that, without vast wealth or fame, it's nigh on impossible to influence government policy.

Little things: I don't know, not everything has to be a government policy. Start an initiative in your local area to request all businesses to recognise and respect mask exemptions? (Many don't.) Research which MPs are raising these issues in parliament and write to them - there are some who have invited those who are concerned to do so. Petitions, etc.?

Well I'm a lifelong protestor and know they are in the main pointless (Tony Blair looking at you, you bastard- I was one of the million who marched to stop the war that happened anyway). Despite that I still think protesting is worthwhile as it raises the issue.

I can't remember where I read this... But it was that Blair was advised by Alastair Campbell that by not even acknowledging the protests, he would deny them any credence. The article posited that this had essentially set in train a devaluation of protest as a form of intervention, because those in power realised that, in the main, things would just fizzle out if they didn't engage at all.

I think when people protest e.g. How often do people have the complete picture ? Have they studied the issues in depth ? How many groups have been influenced y others ect

FWIW, I'm French and I was living there as a child at the time of the Iraq war. I remember the stuff said in the press about Blair and the war, and I later on I was quite shocked when I realised that people in the UK had actually believed in the WMD.

How I laughed at Blue, the 17 year old who has gone on strike from school (Stacey Dooley sleeps over) until the government passes an environmental law she wants. Her going on strike from school is hardly going to change the world, is it? Has anyone other than her school even noticed? Literally the only one affected is her, she won’t get her a levels, although living as she does means she doesn’t really need any.

The recent protest at McDonalds also made me smile, utterly pointless.

I hadn't heard of this! Poor Blue, she may be destined to be off school a long time...

As a vegetarian since the age of 10, I'd be happy if McDonald's introduced say, A N other veggie option to their menu. But quite honestly... I couldn't care less and I can't imagine that the ultra processed one upon a time a plant burgers are even that much more environmentally friendly.

You can't force everyone to veganism! And quite honestly, I'm sick of decent veggie options being replaced by crappy fake meat options to cater to temporary vegans, but that's another thread...

Is it in Hitchikers' Guide that the philosophers go on strike and wonder why their protest isn't changing anything?