Explain to me the first amendment united states

[justasking111]

The first amendment seems to me to be quite straightforward, am I out of step with todays requirements for this. Quote below.

"First Amendment Text. The first amendment reads: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

@justasking111
Well for instance the right to bear arms was made before the era of semi automatic machine guns.

It's a basic right - amended by various State and Federal Laws. Depending where you live and whether or not you, for example are a convicted criminal, that right may be modified or withdrawn.

What’s he talking about? A free press is a cornerstone of a democratic society. I actually think he might slowly be losing the plot.

Slightly off to one side of the topic.
To us over here it seems odd that the US relies on the Courts for important decisions.
The abortion situation is governed by a court case Rowe v Wade I think. This allows States to modify.
All European countries have passed laws to govern abortion. Those laws apply to all regions within a Nation.

@nixonten

Slightly off to one side of the topic. To us over here it seems odd that the US relies on the Courts for important decisions. The abortion situation is governed by a court case Rowe v Wade I think. This allows States to modify. All European countries have passed laws to govern abortion. Those laws apply to all regions within a Nation.

Would that were true! The situation in Northern Ireland is much improved, but it does not match the situation in the rest of the UK: commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-8909/

States also have laws governing abortion. They just can't be in contravention of what the Supreme Court has ruled on the right to abortion.

I think it's a crucial and excellent amendment (the first amendment), and I wish it could somehow be brought more to the fore in trying to deal with 'cancel culture'.

Much of what is viewed in the US as "cancel culture" is private action. The First Amendment only applies to government (federal and state) action. So, for example, a private publisher's decision to stop publishing certain books because they find them offensive does not violate the First Amendment. There is a lot of confusion and misunderstanding in the US about this.

I think it's to do with freedom of the press, not on a national level but on a personal - in the UK the royals have an agreement that they don't take photos of their children unless at a public event, in the US there isn't that agreement and they've had a lot of issues... which was predicted when they moved

@nixonten

That's because the US has a federal system. The 10th Amendment to the Constitution limits the power of the federal government and gives the rest of the power to the states or the people. It's a good system for a country as vast and diverse as the US.

What he is probably referring to is the 1st Amendment as a defense in civil defamation suits.

Hmm, I'm trying to work out whether this thread will become a U.S.-bashing or a Meghan-and-Harry-bashing thread (both perennial subjects for lengthy discussion on MN). Or perhaps it will be a two for one special.

The First Amendment guarantees freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, the right to assemble and to petition the government. What's not to like?

As a U.S. citizen, I believe that the First Amendment is essential to the country. It has saved us many times in the past. The Framers of the Constitution were brilliant thinkers, though of course they were men of their time (which is why the Constitution continues to be updated with new amendments).

@SenecaFallsRedux, what about universities? And does the first amendment apply to public schools and community colleges?

It's fascinating.

I think people are rather overstating American support for the 1st amendment. Yes, if you ask people in polls whether they agree with it, an overwhelming majority say yes. But when you ask more specific questions, it's clear that a lot of people think there should be limits on it.

In the 1990s, majorities of people thought it was okay to censor LGBT materials and rock music, that the 1st amendment should not apply to 'offensive' material (in decades past, it was the communists who were the problem too)

In the wake of 9/11, quite a lot of people thought it was okay for the government to suspend the 1st amendment in order to fight terrorism

The issue today is that the 1st amendment protects hate speech. There is nothing like the hate speech laws you have in the UK, where people can be prosecuted for racist tweets or what have you. The KKK can march down Main Street shouting whatever they want and that is completely protected. After seeing what 4 years of Trump did to the country, some people feel like this is a problem.

[quote SpindleWhorl]@SenecaFallsRedux, what about universities? And does the first amendment apply to public schools and community colleges?

It's fascinating.[/quote]
The First Amendment definitely applies to state colleges and universities. There are also situations in which it applies to private colleges and universities that accept public funding.

I think people are rather overstating American support for the 1st amendment. Yes, if you ask people in polls whether they agree with it, an overwhelming majority say yes. But when you ask more specific questions, it's clear that a lot of people think there should be limits on it.

This is true to an extent, which also brings to mind that the First Amendment and the other amendments that constitute the Bill of Rights are meant to be limits on majority rule. Lots of Americans don't really understand that. But I do think that the concept of it does have high support, especially in the face of a foreign prince who is a guest in our country calling it "bonkers." And for what it's worth, I am on record all over MN as a defender of Meghan and Harry.

Well the whole idea of the 1st amendment is that people are totally free to call it bonkers if they want to. Not just citizens, but anyone.

I genuinely don't see what the fuss is and I don't think most Americans do either, it's the whole Fox News/Daily Mail crew turning it into a big drama

Harry didn't say why he thought it was bonkers but presumably it has something to do with the extent to which tabloids can harass and lie about you, which IS bonkers

Given the UK government's recent attack on the right to peaceful protest, I'd say the First Amendment is looking pretty damn up to date and I wish we had it!

@Purpletomato

Given the UK government's recent attack on the right to peaceful protest, I'd say the First Amendment is looking pretty damn up to date and I wish we had it!

^This

@justasking111
Well for instance the right to bear arms was made before the era of semi automatic machine guns.

What an odd comment. The amendment has nothing to do with the type of arms but the right bear arms. When it was written it referred to militias.

I agree with dreamingbohemian. Presumably he means it's harder to sue the press for defamation when you are a public figure because the 1st Amendment can be raised as a defense. This was not always the case because it was assumed there was no state action in a private defamation suit. The law started to change after the Supreme Court decided a case involving the NYTs and it's reporting on the civil rights movement in the 1960s.

So is American Google free of any censorship. In Europe you can get stuff removed You have the right to be forgotten.

policies.google.com/faq

@SenecaFallsRedux

The Constitution also gets "updated" through judicial interpretation. Probably the latest best example of that is same-sex marriage.

Nice concise answer. The American constitution is fascinating.

I don’t want to Harry bash but you don’t arrive in a country and start criticising their way of doing things. I speak as someone who has lived abroad, including the US.

[quote justasking111]So is American Google free of any censorship. In Europe you can get stuff removed You have the right to be forgotten.

policies.google.com/faq[/quote]
Are we writing an assignment for you OP?
Why does the question keep changing?
The Court of Justice of the European Union obviously has no jurisdiction in the USA.

@dreamingbohemian

Well the whole idea of the 1st amendment is that people are totally free to call it bonkers if they want to. Not just citizens, but anyone.

I genuinely don't see what the fuss is and I don't think most Americans do either, it's the whole Fox News/Daily Mail crew turning it into a big drama

Harry didn't say why he thought it was bonkers but presumably it has something to do with the extent to which tabloids can harass and lie about you, which IS bonkers

Yes, when I was at university we had a whole semester on legalities and whether the first amendment is fit for an internet age.

So for example, if someone describes a fantasy of torturing and raping someone specific in an internet chat group, are they protected by the first amendment?

This was 15 years back, so nothing new or worth getting roused about. With increase in online hate speech such as trolling, death threats etc, it is worth new scrutiny

Of course Harry's statements are protected by the First Amendment. But that doesn't mean that perhaps he should have been a bit more circumspect when even he admitted he didn't understand it. If he was referring to New York Times v. Sullivan and its progeny, that's a valid discussion to have. But it's a good idea to educate yourself before having it.

I think list people are quite nationalistic by instinct, they don’t like being criticised by the “other”

Mm got a hard time here and no doubt PH will get a hard time in the US

But the thing is, as a foreigner you are more likely to notice the absurdities in your adopted Homeland, eg the bizzare and archaic obsession with the RF here and the bizarre and archaic obsession with “freedom of speech”, freedom to bear arms etc in the US