... to feel worried about not keeping DD in mainstream?

[Jourdain11]

A bit hypothetical, as we're not yet even sure what options are going to be on the table, but this seems to be the way things are moving at the moment.

I'm worried that her options will be so limited further down the line and I'm actually unsure whether the environment will even be helpful to her (she gets very stressed and overwhelmed by noise, change of routine, etc. etc.).

I'm worried that I'm being a pushy mother, however, and allowing my wish for my child to "achieve" to outweigh what is good for her!

There is no right or wrong answer to this. Although (as an ex teacher) I would say that there are many many children in mainstream school who would hugely benefit from specialised education, but remain in mainstream because their parents are not open to any other possibility.

That's an interesting perspective, thank you!

I don't want to be close-minded, but I'm also cautious of making a decision which might be difficult to reverse, if you know what I mean...

From experience of a couple of kids at my children’s school it is really difficult to get a space at a specialist school - even if mainstream is really obviously not working.

So if you do get a place then it is pretty likely that it is the right thing.

An obvious question to ask is “if specialist doesn’t work, how easy is it to move back to mainstream?”

Cynical me suspects the answer would be “you want to move back to mainstream? How lovely and cheap sounding. Tomorrow?”

Being academically able is of little use if you can't function in everyday life. DS1 is academically able but can't cope in mainstream.

Specialist provision now doesn't mean it always has to be that way. If, down the line, DD is able to move back to MS then that can happen.

How old is your DD?
Does she have an EHCP and has she had recent Educational Psychologist assessments/reports done. These are usually helpful in identifying suitable provision. My son has autism and is in an ASD base within a mainstream school.
I also worry myself stupid about the future but try to keep a lid on my catastophising and just deal with the immediate problems but its tough.

The special school will be happily pushing your child into mainstream if that suits .
They need the places for those who will benefit from the additional resources
And they would arrange phased and supported move.
Special school may just be what she needs.
It s not a lesser option
If her needs can be better met
Visit all options

"she gets very stressed and overwhelmed by noise, change of routine, etc. etc." mainstream will struggle to support this in my experience

If she gets allocated specialist provision jump on it. I wish it had been an option for ds. Would have saved so much heart ache simply because of the stress and noise and change of routine etc. And god the "fun" activities in mainstream that remove structure and routine, and are more chaotic and loud.

You can review and change. Easiest at key stages like when they move school anyway eg primary to secondary but always with ehcp annual review

my son has attended both special and mainstream schools.

My view is you find the right school and not worry about whether its called special or mainstream

We happened to have an exceptional mainstream secondary school. It was small ( 500 children) with a strong pastoral and nurturing ethos, very inclusive. There is no way I would have sent him to the local school which was overscubscribed. Nothing wrong with the school, it was just massive and overwhelming.

I think there are a lot of misconceptions about special provision. There are different types of provision for a start. One of my friends kids was out of school for two years because she couldn’t cope with the environment. She is funny, bright and doing well in a special unit.
My son has ASD is adopted and was massively behind when he came to live with me at age 7. He was already in special education and had made big gains from age 4 ( he was in quite a state when he was taken into care). In the first year of his new special school he caught up several years. Without the years in special education he would not be where he is now.
He got a decent set of GCSEs and is now in college and getting merits and distinctions.

The other thing I would say is think very carefully around your expectations of what ‘achievement’ is. Achievement does not have to be about A levels and universities.
And she won’t achieve much if she is thoroughly miserable in the wrong environment

I know two families who switched their children from mainstream to specialist schools . Both report it was the best thing they possibly could have done and their children have thrived there. Also they both wish they had done it sooner but hung on in mainstream because of similar concerns to yourself . Also don’t discount narrowing her options both the children I know have achieved so much more than they could ever have achieved in mainstream in regards to education and are so much happier.

I was worried about DD going to a special secondary school after mainstream primary, now I wish I had done it years ago. She’s achieved more since being there (even with lockdown) than the whole of primary school put together! It is a big step and I agree, it’s harder to get children back into mainstream once you’ve made the move to special but not impossible. Have you visited available schools? Is she unhappy where she is? What does the current school say? And Ed psych? Have an open mind, listen to what everyone says but be aware of their own agendas. Good luck!

Surely it depends on what exactly her heads are?
At the moment it sounds like smaller classes which would naturally be more quiet and easier to manage.

I'd visit schools and think about what she needs.

I've seen kids I initially thought would struggle in mainstream make great progress and I've seen kids whose parents refuse to entertain specialist provision have a very isolated experience of school that certainly would have been better off in special school.

Very much depends on what is available locally, there are some fantastic inclusive mainstream schools and there are many mainstream schools that go out of there way to avoid catering for children with SEN. There are some amazing special schools and there are some that have low expectations of their pupils.

I have had children come to my mainstream secondary from special school and done brilliantly and kids who did well in mainstream up to KS3 make a really successful transition to special school.

Don't let anyone set limits on what you're child can achieve. I've worked in special education for 15 years and I've learnt that you can never predict outcomes.

@Jourdain11

That's an interesting perspective, thank you!

I don't want to be close-minded, but I'm also cautious of making a decision which might be difficult to reverse, if you know what I mean...

It may not be difficult to reverse, that depends on the relationships between schools and teachers, education policy in your LA, the ehcp process and much else. DS2 went to mainstream nursery with help, special primary with significant integration into a local mainstream primary, special secondary ditto, then mainstream until end of university. I'd advise talk to other parents on your position, research schools and their practices, ask your ed psych.

Being in a mainstream school could end up being quite traumatic and hinder her ability to learn. It really depends on the schools. But the first priority is that she feels happy and comfortable at school, that will enable her to reach her potential.

I felt exactly the same as you x but honestly switching to special school was absolutely the right thing for my son x he didn't just attend he thrived and his true personality shone x if a place is offered then it really is needed as they do try to keep spaces for those who need them most x

Thank you for all the help and suggestions! At the moment she hasn't been in school at all because she's been too unwell. But we are doing school visits over the next couple weeks and hoping that it will all become clearer. She has a (very new) EHCP and the reports definitely lean towards recommending "appropriate" specialist provision. It's been very heartening and helpful to hear your positive stories and experiences - I just don't know anyone IRL who has been through this process!

Certainly she has struggled a lot in school this year and been very agitated and miserable. I think it's been not helped by the Covid changes, but she hasn't been coping well in class at all, even with support and regular "time out", etc.

I work at a Mainstream school and there are a few
children that shouldn’t be there and can’t cope, they aren’t getting further along educationally, far from it.

Same. I work in mainstream 1:1 with a girl with Down's, and she's 100% in the wrong place. I have voiced my feelings to the Head, but unless it comes from the parents, there's not much you can do.

My daughter is atm having a slow transition into a specialist ASD school. It's just like a mainstream but much smaller, 6 per class. We visited a few schools to get a feel of what's on offer. So far this looks like a perfect fit for our daughter. She did well in mainstream primary to a certain extent but last year became very unwell with her mental health. The pandemic plus the upcoming transition to a mainstream secondary pushed her over the edge and it got as serious as it can 😢. I spent last year desperately trying to get an ehcp (parent lead as she wasn't in school) but I got it. I'm told if she wants to in the future she could try mainstream again. I doubt this will happen though.

I'd say go visit these schools, they were very welcoming of us. Get a feel of what's on offer for your child x

My child is just transitioning into a specialist ASD school. We've had to really fight for it and it took me a long time to get my head round it. It also took a while to find the right place, even after it became obvious mainstream wasn't working. It's not irreversible though and I keep reminding myself that children learn when they are happy and secure - and attending. Everything else is secondary to that.

There's the question:

If she's overwhelmed by MS school and really stressed or anxious is she actually receiving a meaningful education and maximising her learning?

Have you looked into EHCP? It may be it's recommended for small class sizes and so MS independent works for her and if she has an EHCP that states this by law the la must fund it (easier said than done but send groups are extremely helpful in navigating this).

Also if she remains in MS now do you think she'll manage secondary MS? If she remains do you think it'll cause damage which may take time to undo and therefore she misses proper learning opportunity in the meantime?
Do you think with an EHCP and proper support MS could work?

Lots of questions and it's totally overwhelming but IME some children do better out if MS because they are in an environment they can cope with - and therefore learn better.

Get her into special school. Far easier to move into a mainstream later on than the other way round.

My DD is 6 and has complex needs and we are just moving her to special school. It didn't happen sooner because identifying an appropriate provision has been a nightmare.

My experience has been of a DD who I know has a vibrant, life loving, thriving little girl turning into an absolute mess. Who I am being called into school because she is hysterical under a table. Who has spent an hour in a class in a week. Who has spent the rest of her time running away and with her 1-1. She has no friends, she has no concept of how to make/be friends.

As it stands my DD goes to school and is babysat, she doesn't learn or engage socially. She doesn't get the buzz from school. As hard as it has been coming to terms with her needs and specialist provision (because I genuinely feel like it is a grieving process) I know it is ultimately the best thing for her because it doesn't matter how bright or capable she may be, she can't learn in an environment she can't cope with.

It is easier to transition back to a mainstream school than to get them out of mainstream into specialist by far.

It is really tough to come to terms with but it definitely isn't something that will necessarily limit options, the right setting, specialist or mainstream will open options, the wrong will close them.

Local authorities don't suggest specialist provision unless they really think it is needed.............bottom line is keeping a child in mainstream is far cheaper.
Keep in mind that it is far easier to move from specialist provision in the future rather than the other way around.