To ask how can your vote be secret

[DuckyMcDuck]

If they write the number of your voting paper on the list next to your name? I've often wondered this.

I know it would be a logistical nightmare to try and match them up but it would actually be possible

Is your voting number on the ballot you put thru the slot of sealed up black box?

I count votes. Or rather will be 'verifying' them tonight. Actual vote is different people tomorrow.

God it's just not that important to try to match them up.
The way the votes are handled no one would have an opportunity to match up these things.

Wow, you're bored

Yep they do write your number on, so technically if someone wanted to sift through thousands of votes they could. the ballot box is sealed at the start of the day and I think, the electoral listings are stored elsewhere after the election, I guess to have records in case of fraud. but as PP said even on a poor turnout they will process literally thousands of votes at the count.

Any attempts to link ballot papers to voters is strictly illegal, and the seal on the documents can only be broken by order of the High Court or Parliament.

I was wondering this. They scanned the QR code on the ballot paper today and linked it to my name on the register. Before they've written the number on the paper next to my name. What happens to the list?

@MelissaVonStressel

I was wondering this. They scanned the QR code on the ballot paper today and linked it to my name on the register. Before they've written the number on the paper next to my name. What happens to the list?

I imagine it gets chucked away once the votes are verified and counted. It’s only to stop people voting more than once.

I strongly encourage anyone interested in voter anonymity to apply to be a vote count observer. You will see a huge number of steps taken to ensure anonymity and fair counting.

Normally the atmosphere is quite cheerful, many sweets consumed. Tonight all masked up I hope isn't too weird.

It helps combat voter fraud. Imagine you rocked up and they say ‘you voted earlier!’ They can remove that ballot but I think the police gave to open the box. Mr policeman friend had to do it once.

Our system feels quite antiquated- round here it's still a list with name and address (you don't have to give proof) and crossed out with a pencil and write a number.

I suppose in the event of seeming like there had been fraud they could link it back and check.

With hacking etc I think that paper and pen etc is actually pretty good. There is no computerised connection between who you are and your voting paper.

We've been doing it this way for yonks and I think it's a pretty good system even if seems old school.

The votes are in s locked box and then get counted- I assume the papers with the who is which number are well away.

Anonymous voting has been an absolute here since 1872. It's a sort of total thing in our democracy (even if in other ways it seems screwed!) and to break it would be like swearing at the Queen or something iykwim!

Ex Presiding Officer here. After close of poll the ballot box, voting paper stubs and voter list (the links in the chain of paperwork needed to identify any individual vote) are all separated into different bags. There's a Ballot Account form to fill out and sign, so that every used, tendered and spoiled voting slip is accounted for. When returning the whole lot to the elections dept (this is the little queue of tired, grumpy looking people to the side of the count!) you're not allowed to leave until it's all been checked. To return though to the original question, the three items are stored separately and securely, and can only be opened on a judge's order, eg in case of alleged fraud. They're destroyed after a couple of months.

There was concern about the possibility of voters for fringe parties being identified by Special Branch back in the '80s. Lots of rumour and one or two accounts, but contrary reports too and no official investigation.

These letters to the Guardian sum up some of the concerns and the reason for the cross numbering.

Look up an NGO called Democracy Volunteers who observe elections. They produce a report after the election on how fair it is based on lots of factors so it might address this?

@SparkyTheCat has explained it really well

(I am also a presiding officer /,count supervisor)

Interesting information. I took my newly 18 ds to vote tonight to find his dad had used his vote . Both have the same 1st name but different initial. Dad went with card this am was marked off with pencil and ruler as Ds. We arrived and it caused chaos. Only myself and ds on the electoral roll print out. Dh had been missed off , but they had given him my sons vote. DH is memorable as he's blind so needed brail ballot papers. Que 20mins of chaos while they tried to sort it out which they did. The issue seemed to be about voter numbers now.i understand why. Before anyone asks yes both are defiantly registered to vote and we've been at same address for 25 years.

Well it is secret in that who voted for whom is not published in a newspaper or read out during the evening TV news. Only people involved in the election itself have access to the lists. There’s no way you could find out how any individual voted unless they told you.

In our state we have to write our name, the date, and then sign the ballot envelope. The signature is then compared with that which is held on the driver license database to make sure the ballot has only been used by the person it was intended for. If you don’t have a drivers license you have to provide a sample signature when you register to vote.

It doesn’t bother me. I’m not ashamed of who or what I’ve voted for or against.

OP - have you been listening to the donald?

God, I hope they never switch to signature matching in the UK. Mine is never the same twice.

Another Presiding Officer here - in my experience no-one really asks or questions the cross referencing of the ballot paper and address at the desk, but I do enjoy the people who proudly tell me they are using a pen because if they use a pencil, their vote will get changed. I did once try and explain to one of them how impossible that was, given the fact that the boxes are all sealed before they go in the van, in our area they are expected at the count by 11.00 so if the driver stopped for an hour to somehow unseal the boxes change hundreds of votes, their absence would be noticed and questioned, and that the level of scrutiny at the count that would identify a bunch of rubbed out and redone papers, but to no avail!

@jamimmi I can just imagine the panic that caused!!

The panice was all over thier face's. I actually felt quite sorry for them.

related question from a vote counter ... what happens to all the paperclips and elastic bands? Those items are always brand new at counts, or seem to be. I fear they get incinerated with actual paper ballots.

Tell me they don't get incinerated with the paper ballots.

The amount of plastic & sealing & packaging last night... 5am finish and votes were only verified.

jammimi something similar happened to me at a previous election- I rocked up to the polling station a couple of hours before it closed with my card to find that my name had been crossed off already!
No one in my house with a similar name but presumably mistakes happen, even when everyone is very careful.
There was a bit of a kerfuffle but the stewards didn't seem overly concerned. I couldn't vote properly, but was given a "reserved (?) vote" (I think it was sealed in an envelope, maybe kept separately from the others but might be misremembering).
I was told that my vote wouldn't be counted, unless it was very very close (it wasn't).

Since then I've always got to the polling station early, rather than leaving it until late evening just in case.

Here's a question:
If someone spoiled their vote with a really terrible offensive slogan, would there be grounds to trace them? I would hope not (not that I would ever write anything really horrible) because I think it would go against the very basic principle of anonymity.
But I wondered if it ever would happen, and if so where the line would be? Threats? I imagine variations of "you're all bastards" is fairly common on spoiled papers.
But then I guess they aren't really read anyway.

@Jammimi that does sound like a genuine mixup.

@squishysquirmy that sounds like personation. Sadly it does happen that people turn up and literally steal votes - often organised by the more underhand elements of political parties. Out of interest, do you usually vote? One way they identify people to impersonate is to look through the marked registers for people who've not voted for a while as their the ones less likely to notice their vote has been stolen if you see what I mean.

As PPs have said, the papers and marked registers etc. are kept for some time in case of election petitions. I watched parts of the Birmingham Election Court set up in 2005. What can happen is scary and makes you understand why sometimes the paperwork has to be kept for checking if necessary.

Imagine you rocked up and they say ‘you voted earlier!’

Happened to DH a few years ago. We still don't know what happened, though he was allowed to vote in the end.

In yesterday's vote, they repeated my name back to me incorrectly (not that surprising, given masks in the way), tried to cross off my son's name instead, and tutted at me when I corrected them!

The spoilt papers ARE read. The candidates and agents all have to look at them and agree that they are actually spoilt and not actually votes for them