E scooters are illegal? - right!!

[jacspatoutthecat]

So if they are illegal why do so many older kids teens have them. I have a 15 and 14 yr old and all their friends have them. They are everywhere round here, and my kids are desperate for one. AIBU to say no??? Parents buying these scooters are breaking the law!!!

Yes and no. Legal to own one, illegal to ride it on any land that isn't privately owned and with the owners permission. So unless you have a huge garden or something, bit pointless to have one.

@Macncheeseballs

Jesusinthecabbagevan, I think 'it wouldn't kill you to walk you lazy bugger' about plenty of drivers

Oh, me too!

That was meant to be a , I'm not trying to chat you up...

They mainly seem to contribute to anti-social behaviour. There's a 20-ish guy where I live who loves haring around the pavements and narrow alleyways on his. Unfortunately he's more likely to break the legs of an elderly person than go under a bus himself. Cars are a problem but people are not using these as car replacements.

www-bbc-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48106617.amp?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQHKAFQArABIA%3D%3D#aoh=16186484386352&amp_ct=1618648286134&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s

@EsmaCannonball

They mainly seem to contribute to anti-social behaviour. There's a 20-ish guy where I live who loves haring around the pavements and narrow alleyways on his. Unfortunately he's more likely to break the legs of an elderly person than go under a bus himself. Cars are a problem but people are not using these as car replacements.

This is so true. I think the government intention was for them to maybe be used as an alternative to cars but they are just a plaything for kids and teens.

They are very popular and also legal where I live and people definitely do use them as car replacements. Of course they are also especially popular with people who cannot drive a car, like older teenagers, and those who are unable to cycle or walk far.

I think they are very practical and a great idea that will ultimately improve our towns and cities. The only thing that bothers me is when they are parked in the middle of the pavement or bike path, but that is becoming less and less of a problem as the systems become more efficient and people get used to this new mode of transport.

Of course some people will be injured using them - that is just statistical inevitability. I can guarantee you people will also continue to be injured by every other mode of transport including walking. But cars are by far the most dangerous vehicles and if we can reduce the number of those we will all be safer overall.

@elephantoverthehill

OK, I will play the thick card, because I don't understand how these scooters charge up. Can anyone explain it please?

www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/05/charging-electric-scooters-is-a-cutthroat-business/560747/

I think there needs to be recognition that scooters and other small sized means of transport have a role, and then a legal and planning framework to go with it. Same as cable cars (in useful places, not the one to nowhere in London), bike hire schemes, funicular railways and personal 'pod' transport as is found at Heathrow T5 car park.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-56502641

If you rent one out insurance is included, at least it was when there was a trial in my city

The trial got cut short though as ppl were not keeping within the agreed areas

Another thing that can't be policed like cyclists on the pavements or on the road in the dark with no lights

They're not a problem where I live. I've not seen any on roads etc but I do love the idea of being able to move more cars off the road.

Why can't we treat them like bicycles? Cycle riders don't have insurance. Can use the public road and are allowed to cycle without helmets if they want to. Seems like we should be working out a way that we can get more people on scooters and out of their cars for short journeys.

Rather than calling for more regulation and crack downs by police, we should be having a debate about how we can enable their safe use.

They are common (as rentals) in a city I visit a lot in the USA. I view them as quite dangerous. Litter as well. Daft fad that will fade quickly, I hope.

Kerberos -- many cyclists do have relevant insurance, but it's not legally required, I think legal requirement is what you mean.

Cyclists can be fined for being on pavement even if the cycle is hired.
but ok, how could scooters could be safer:

If routinely allowed on pavement: cap speed at 3mph.
They need to have a device on handlebar you must hold constantly or the brake kicks in.
A portion of the rental fee needs to go into a compensation fund for any rider who hits someone else (or property) while on it.
The rental charge must keep running (meter keep charging to the renter) until they are left in designated drop off points, not just dropped at a random location strewn in the footway like litter.

I'll think of more points!

I don’t care if people use them I just don’t want them on the pavements

I just know that they are very dangerous. Someone was killed on one near where I work almost two years ago, and the silence on the cordoned off road was so very sad. Every time I see someone on one now I think that people don’t realise how vulnerable they are on them.

We live in an e-scooter trial area so they aren't illegal here.

I would quite like to see them made legal, with lots more closure of inner city roads to private vehicle traffic - buses / delivery lorries only etc. I'd love to be able to cycle or use an electric scooter to get to work but the roads are far too busy. Appreciate this is just a pipe dream however, we are as a society fiercely wed to our cars (and I say that as someone who loves driving).

If they were legal and I could use them safely I would definitely have one!

@yeOldeTrout

Kerberos -- many cyclists do have relevant insurance, but it's not legally required, I think legal requirement is what you mean.

Cyclists can be fined for being on pavement even if the cycle is hired.
but ok, how could scooters could be safer:

If routinely allowed on pavement: cap speed at 3mph.
They need to have a device on handlebar you must hold constantly or the brake kicks in.
A portion of the rental fee needs to go into a compensation fund for any rider who hits someone else (or property) while on it.
The rental charge must keep running (meter keep charging to the renter) until they are left in designated drop off points, not just dropped at a random location strewn in the footway like litter.

I'll think of more points!

OK makes sense. I wadnt aware of cycle insurance despite living with a keen cyclist (We have so many bikes...).

So make insurance available for them, then in general I'd love to see more investment in cycle paths in general. This seems to be the sensible place for scooter riders to be?

I do have a belief we live in a country where we've let cars and noisy roads take over too much. And I say that as a firm and committed big diesel people mover car driver. Making space for safe cycling, scooting, horse riding, roller skating and walking would improve how our communities operate in my view.

I think my problem mainly is that parents are allowing their children to break the law by buying them these scooters and allowing them to ride them on public land. I don't want my children to think it is ok to break the law. If they were legal I would be more willing to consider buying them one. Just spoke to a friend who was aware they are illegal but she doesnt' have to take her kids anywhere now as they just scoot and go and she says that trumps the "against the law" card!!

Kerberos quite a lot of cyclists don't realise they are insured to be fair! Most categories of British Cycling membership have 3rd party liability insurance for claims up to £15 million against a rider and Cycling UK membership includes cover up to £10 million. Between the 2 organisations there are about 220 000 members. Then there are others who take out specialist insurance with companies like Bikmo and Pedalsure.
I don't have specific bike insurance as I have BC membership and my home contents insurance has quite good bike cover so I don't really need it, but if you have a lot of bikes it's worth thinking about. My home insurance covers bikes worth up to a total of £15k with a maximum single bike worth £5k for loss, theft or damage anywhere in the world but our previous policy wasn't as good. It's worth checking.

@MrsAvocet

Kerberos quite a lot of cyclists don't realise they are insured to be fair! Most categories of British Cycling membership have 3rd party liability insurance for claims up to £15 million against a rider and Cycling UK membership includes cover up to £10 million. Between the 2 organisations there are about 220 000 members. Then there are others who take out specialist insurance with companies like Bikmo and Pedalsure. I don't have specific bike insurance as I have BC membership and my home contents insurance has quite good bike cover so I don't really need it, but if you have a lot of bikes it's worth thinking about. My home insurance covers bikes worth up to a total of £15k with a maximum single bike worth £5k for loss, theft or damage anywhere in the world but our previous policy wasn't as good. It's worth checking.

Will do. Thanks for the tip! We do have one or two named in our home insurance but many of ours are hand me downs from friends or the "dump bikes" which are bought from the local tip and get refurbished. At its peak we had 23.

I guess I was thinking 3rd party liability insurance specifically.

@ForThePurposeOfTheTape

We live in an e-scooter trial area so they aren't illegal here.

The rental ones are legal, privately owned ones can only be used on your own property. They are legal to own but not to use on public roads or pavements.

Kerebos specialist bike insurance policies will cover 3rd party liability too but membership of BC or CUK is probably cheaper and has other benefits. Most of the BC membership categories also cover legal protection if you're involved in an accident that isn't your fault too. (I'm not sure about CUK as I'm not a member.) It's only about £40 a year so well worth it in my opinion.
Personally I'd have no problem with insurance being mandatory for cyclists and scooter riders but I know that's not a very popular opinion.