Compulsory college lecture in Easter Holidays?

[itsgettingwierd]

Ds is doing a T level.

I appreciate these are new and with lockdowns etc they are having to adapt a new course a lot. A big part of it is industry placement which they've obviously not been able to do.

The course lead isn't very clear in her communication.
She's also quite negative and spends inordinate amounts of time moaning at the students about what they don't know rather than spending the time teaching them these concepts or re visiting them. (I heard this during home schooling)

Many a time ds has got into a state because she's messaged on teams on a Sunday afternoon saying they need to be online Sunday 10 minutes later for information. We've often been out or he's not in his computer and missed it.

She then tells them all off and saying they should be operating at industry standard.

We are on Easter holidays until next Friday. Usually on Fridays they have a lesson which an industry leads end of the morning until lunch. They've been told they'll have it this Friday and must attend.

Issue is she's changed the time to first thing and ds can't attend because he has a prior commitment with his sport which is returning next Monday.

He has said he will do his sport and I've supported this.

I've explained no employer would expect you to be readily available during AL or your days off so you aren't failing to meet industry standard.

But ds is equally concerned as it's a 2 year course but with 2 separate grades for each year she may stop him doing year 2.

So AIBU (or is he?) to say he cannot make a different time to usual lesson time and not prioritise a lesson during his holidays over a prior commitment (and this isn't just a sport he's aiming for this years nationals and to get on the Olympic talent programme).

His sport doesn't take precedence over college during term time as training is early mornings and late eve and he always completes his assignments on time.

TIA

I’m just bumping this for you. Questions that spring to mind- a T level has industry standards. Is your son expected to be available every Friday? In which case he shouldn’t be booking anything in ‘working’ hours.
Otherwise- I totally agree with you. I’m a teacher & if I sprang a lecture next Friday for my pupils I’d expect some of them to not be available- especially as overnight stays are allowed from 12th- they might be on holiday!

no employer would expect you to be readily available during AL or your days off

Mine does, so this isn’t 100% true. I can count with one hand the amount of times my holidays haven’t been interrupted or changed at the last minute.

However, this teacher sounds particularly annoying and lacks organisation. Why couldn’t she give more notice about these things? If she’s going to change times and add extra sessions as and when it suits her, she could give some notice so the students can try and organise themselves in advance. Your son is NBU.

It seems too short notice to change in my opinion, and I would have said the Sunday contact is unreasonable too, but whether having sessions in the holidays is unreasonable would depend on the course as not all courses have the same 2 week Easter break. If he is expected to be available every Friday as part of his course then he shouldn't be booking anything on Fridays.

The teacher sounds disorganised in my opinion though.

Princess they are always having it drummed into them they are meant to be adhering to industry standards. It's usually when they do things like "be online in 15 minutes" on a Sunday or like next week say they need to attend a lesson and then change the time!

She is incredibly whirlwind. My 10 minutes parents eve appointment I came away wondering what points she was making throughout as nothing seemed to have a direction or outcome 🤷‍♀️

When they signed up to this course they never agreed to work holidays - which in jobs where it's expected you sign a contract to agree it. Or you are doing it voluntarily because your employer makes you feel you should.

And when competitions start again it'll be very usual for ds to be available at all some weekends and neither should he be expected to IMO.

However I also realise I maybe having the wrong attitude agreeing with ds hence me asking here!

That sounds like a nightmare and I'd be looking to support my son in making a complaint. If my employer messaged me on a Sunday afternoon with no notice, I just wouldn't get it til Monday. If they were cross, I'd want them to spell out in writing their policy of availability and reasonable response times.

@LolaSmiles

It seems too short notice to change in my opinion, and I would have said the Sunday contact is unreasonable too, but whether having sessions in the holidays is unreasonable would depend on the course as not all courses have the same 2 week Easter break. If he is expected to be available every Friday as part of his course then he shouldn't be booking anything on Fridays.

The teacher sounds disorganised in my opinion though.

Not every Friday. This is a lesson he has at 11-1 every Friday in term time. They then added one for next week. And now she's saying it maybe 9 or 10am.

They don't even know yet! Although ds can make 10.20 ish onwards so 10 may not be too much of an issue.

@PerspicaciousGreen

That sounds like a nightmare and I'd be looking to support my son in making a complaint. If my employer messaged me on a Sunday afternoon with no notice, I just wouldn't get it til Monday. If they were cross, I'd want them to spell out in writing their policy of availability and reasonable response times.

Yes I may be spoilt by having a fairly new boss who made a policy pretty quickly that no emails between 5pm Friday and 7am Monday.

We have to have a RA sent every now and again that's sent Sunday and we get 1-2 weeks warning with a lovely message about how she's breaking her own policy and would we please make sure we read it before work.

I read it 6am with my coffee

Is he supposed to be on industry placement now?

No.

They haven't started yet because of COVID and it's a WFH rule from government if you can and so understandly any of the placement available who will accept students who are in cannot RA that because it's minimal and necessary. Plus in both lockdowns it's not been allowed anyway.

They are meant to be on normal Easter holidays. It's a term time course that runs alongside our counties term time.

You need to write to the lecturer to express your concern about her lack of planning and the resultant difficulties faced by students when she issues unrealistic or unfeasible timetable requirement at late notice. Timetables are normally planned and released to students by the beginning of term so students can reliably plan holidays, studying, part time jobs, caring responsibilities, and a personal life around them. Usually the only thing that disrupts a timetable is staff sickness, and even then they will try to find someone to cover it. Where there is an additional session at short it should be optional and should not be a part of the core curriculum.

Based on your updates then it sounds even more like she is being unreasonable. I don't know enough about T Levels so wanted to check the term/hours requirements.

Is this through a college? What subject is it please - I don’t think it would be too outing as I’m sure there are loads doing the same subject.

If he is worrying is there a form tutor/ head of year you can go through instead? I’m a teacher and would never contact kids on a weekend unless it was urgent - a kid was entering a competition once and I wanted to check something as she was using me as a reference for example.

Surely he should have a printed timetable?

Teacher sounds very disorganised. I wonder what industry requires someone to be available at 10 mins notice on a Sunday, unless they are rota'd to be on call. Prime minister perhaps? Certainly not the norm in most industries. Antisocial hours yes, bit not unless you are informed beforehand.
Your son also has a commitment to his sport. It's up to him which he wants to do but personally I'd be giving some feedback about how the disorganisation is unprofessional and doesn't meet industry standards

Is your child at a 6th form college or school (sorry, I’m in Scotland, and have never heard
Of t levels). This sounds very unreasonable and the teacher sounds exceptionally unprofessional

I am imagining the character of Jim Royle and his response, to the comment 'industry standard'.

The kind thought is the teacher is out of their depth, leading to the disorganisation and the comments towards your DC and others.

Am I the only thinking it's not a big deal either way. He doesn't start back to his sport this week and attends the class or he misses the class and does his sport. Not that big a deal if he misses his sport.
And not a big deal if he misses his class.

What age is he?

I can't help but wonder what industry this is that has people on call on a Sunday

@LolaSmiles

Based on your updates then it sounds even more like she is being unreasonable. I don't know enough about T Levels so wanted to check the term/hours requirements.

Cant say I do either! And to be fair to the tutors they've planned this huge first year of the course and it's been such a big thing that's been introduced it's not been easy for them having to change the way it's run, teach online for months and also work out how they'll test pupils when there's no previous exam or grading to test against.

Good point by above poster re caring. One of ds classmates is a young carer.

He's year 12.

It's a T level. There is only about 7 t level subjects available so it may be outing.

(Although I've changed day and time and kept sport neutral to try and make sure it's less so than it may have been!)

@Twistered

Am I the only thinking it's not a big deal either way. He doesn't start back to his sport this week and attends the class or he misses the class and does his sport. Not that big a deal if he misses his sport. And not a big deal if he misses his class.

What age is he?

Not at all - I did too

I just told ds to choose and it's his life and his choice.

Then I had an attack of parental responsibility and wondered if I should have said college comes first.

I'm sure it happens to the best of us!

Right, it says here that it’s classroom learning with placements. I would expect it to be within standard classroom hours then.

It states that it is 1800 hours over two years. So based on England school terms that’s 23 hours a week, that includes the placement 315 hours. That means it is achievable within college hours. Obviously the placement would be varying hours! I feel you can easily contact them and say it’s unreasonable to remove his extra curricular/work life balance.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/introduction-of-t-levels/introduction-of-t-levels

Ah I get you now OP! The never ending second guessing and mum guilt!

Few years ago dd refused to have 2 healthy but crooked teeth taken and have a brace fitted. I still wonder if I should have forced it more

I’m a lecturer and would not be teaching in my holidays, nor would I expect students to attend! However in your son’s position I would suggest he asks if the session can be recorded, and that he will watch it back later. Under the circumstances I expect other students may be in a similar position.

If they are using Teams everyone gets a message saying they’re being recorded in terms of privacy issues - I tend only to record things where I need to be able evidence then for external examiners, and just say at the start that I am popping it on to record and is everyone okay with it.

Ok so while course including placements is 23 hrs per week?

Ds currently does 19 hours of the subject a week plus extra maths (were my given the choice) and core English (again no choice)

He does 4 days in college. 3 days 9-4.15 with 45 mins lunch and 1 day 9-1 on-site and 2 hours online in the afternoon. They give them an hour to get home which is their lunch break before being back online which is impossible for students a 45-60 minute bus ride away from home.

Oh and that's with placement which will be every week in the day they aren't in college.