Aibuly lax re night dryness

[LoudNowSing]

Dd has just turned five. She's been out of nappies during the day since she was 2.5, but is still in a pull-up at night. About 3/4 days a week, she's dry in the morning.
I've seen it said on here several times that overnight dryness is hormonal, and that if she doesn't have the whatever hormone, then there's no point in trying to teach her to be dry overnight...but still, she is 5 now. Am I being unreasonably lax in not making more of an effort with her in this regard?

We did try for a bit last summer when she had a run of being dry every morning, and she was fine for about ten days/two weeks, then started wetting the bed every night again. Eventually we caved and reintroduced the pull-up.

Are we doing her a disservice in just waiting for her to be ready, though? She doesn't seem to care either way herself.

Everyone I know lifts their children of 4 or 5 when they go to bed themselves, at about 11pm.

I have a 5 year old DS and a 6 year old DD. Both are still wetting the bed and it's driving me nuts.

Since Xmas we've been putting washable absorbent pads on the beds. Reducing liquid before bedtime and lifting them two hours after we put them to bed. Most of the time at least one of them is wet in the morning. I'm constantly being told to just persevere with it but I'm often tempted to give up and put them both back in pull ups

My two were 6 or 7 before we could ditch the Drynites. One thing I will say though is WORMS! When our two start going through bed wetting patches, I always give them worming tablets and it seems to sort them out.

Now I wonder how much of their late training was actually due to worms and not hormones.

In a similar position with DC4 (aged 5) who is also in a pull up still. Difference is that he is rarely dry in the morning and generally ends up in our bed in the night, and as he is good at coming in without waking us initially, I'm loath to take the pull-up away!

His older 3 sibs were all dry aged 3, so I just think he's not ready. I will have a word with GP/school nurse once some sort of normality returns but it's reassuring to know we're not alone. I'd rather him not be concerned about it for now.

Posted on an earlier thread about this topic: My story and advice in full:

Could it be black current juice or other cordials with artificial sweeteners that is causing it?

I was a Ribena junkie as a kid and my parents never made the connection between blackcurrent juice/ cordials and my late bed wetting.

They were not cruel about it in any way and let me wear night nappies to bed so as to avoid soaked sheets (there were no Pull-Ups or DryNites then), with occasional periods of “trying without”. I wore nappies to bed far older than your DD is now.

Fast forward and both DD’s had the same issue as me and I just assumed that they had inherited my bladder issues.

I didn’t want to stress either of them out and they both wore DryNites without getting embarrassed or upset (the fact that they go up to age 15 and say so on the pack helped, I think!)

Then a friend told me about blackcurrent juice and how it irritates the bladder causing it to empty by reflex and how other cordials and “juice drinks” with artificial sweeteners have the same effect.

We experimented, initially for just a week, with just water and milk.

It was like a miracle cure. Almost overnight the bed wetting stopped and after a few nights of dry DryNites we donated the remaining supplies to the food bank.

We added fresh fruit juices back into the mix as an experiment a few weeks later and that didn’t cause any problems but neither have cordials any more, and neither has wet the bed since.

My eldest was eleven at the time and had never been dry.

We had already done the whole experimenting without the DryNites for a few nights, cutting out fluids after 6pm, even the alarm thing (which we ditched after less than a week because it woke us all up) and GP hadn’t identified any issues. Both are NT, no disabilities or anything like that.

So if she has cordials (blackcurrent juiced and Fruit Shoots are the worst) try going to just water and milk for a week and see if it becomes your miracle cure too.

I wish my parents had known this as they would have saved hundreds of pounds on night nappies if they had stopped me having Ribena and had I tried this earlier I might have also saved hundreds on Pull-Ups and later DryNites!

I’ve posted this on other posts here because I’m a bit of an evangelist- it was like a miracle cure for mine and I hope it is for yours too.

Good luck!

Thanks for that, Worra. Dd doesn't drink anything other than water, milk and apple juice though. I've just checked the apple juice to be sure, and there's no artificial sugar/substitute in it.

*Woolie, my apologies !

She doesn't have worms either. At least, she's not scratching her arse, so I'm presuming not.

In the same boat. My little one was dry in the day at 2.5 but has a pull up at night now aged 4 and it’s still wet in the morning. I think it’s generally 1-2 wees in there. Going to try near the 4.5 mark to make a few changes and go from there but I’m not hugely worried about it just yet

My middle child wasn't dry at night until he was 6. Every night his pull ups were absolutely soaking, in fact they often leaked they were so full so we had to put absorbent sheets (can't remember what they're called sorry!) under him as well. He clearly wasn't producing adequate ADH - the hormone which leads to us producing less bolume, more concentrated urine at night. In fact I had booked an appointment with the GP to discuss getting some desmopressin tablets to help as we were having to turn down sleepovers and he was very worried about going away on the school residential when he got into year 3. His younger brother was also dry at night before him so it was really bothering him.
But about a week before our appointment he had a dry night and that was it. It was like a switch had been flipped and he had no more than very occasional accidents after that.
I don't know how typical his story is, but it was very clear to me when he started producing adequate ADH. Whilst we were having wet beds even with a pull up on I felt there was no point in trying anything but as soon as the massive amounts of overnight urine stopped it was very easy.
Your situation sounds different. If your child is dry for around half the nights it would suggest to me that this isn't entirely hormonal - though obviously I'm no expert. With my other 2, once we started getting fairly frequent dry nights I stopped putting them in pull ups but it was really obvious that the middle one was different. In your circumstances I would probably feel it was time to have a concerted effort, but perhaps seek some professional advice first ?
Hope you get things sorted out soon.

@LoudNowSing

Hmm. Answer 7 here does seem to suggest we should be making more of an effort though.

Night dryness is based on hormone production which may not happen until she is 7 years old. You can’t make her produce the hormone. There is nothing you can make more of an effort with.

Don’t worry! I was in the same boat as you 6 months ago when DD3 turned 5. She has been dry in the daytime for years, but could not stay dry at night to save her life. A few weeks ago, it finally clicked. She had been wetting her pull-ups every night, so we weren’t optimistic, but we decided to try her again because we had run out of pull-ups in the house. We restricted water intake after about 5pm for a few days and made a big fuss about doing a big wee before bedtime. She wet the bed once or twice at the beginning, but after that she was dry every night, and she has dry been ever since! I had been fretting about it for ages, wondering if we should visit the doctor, so it has been a big relief.

@LoudNowSing

In that case I would say don’t worry. Neither I nor DD’s were scarred for life in any way by the fact that we wore protection at night into double digits.

DryNites go up to age 15 and are sold in every supermarket for a reason- there must be a lot of kids who need them.

Please don't worry, it is hormonal related and anything you do probably won't help.

I had this with dd2. Dry during day at age 2 but just wasn't dry at night. some nights she would wet twice. I tried everything except refused to give her medication from the doctor at age 8. We just persevered and eventually over the next few years she would still wet perhaps once or twice a week and then age 11 it just stopped completely.

DD1 and DS3 were both no issue at all, dry day and night from the offset, age 2.

Now have the same issue with dd4. Now age 6, but honestly after going through it once I am so much more relaxed about it and am just accepting she will be dry when shes dry. There really is no point stressing about it.

Obviously if its affecting DD emotionally, there are things you can try which in themselves will help her feel more in control even if they don't actually immediately resolve the problem.

My 5 year old still wears nappies at night too. We try him without a nappy every few months. Last time was about a month ago, we didn't let him have more than 1 sip of water all evening and took him out for a wee at 10pm but he still woke up wet at 11pm! We've no idea where all that liquid came from!

I wet the bed until I was 8 and remember how horrible it was waking up cold and wet so I'm happy with leaving him in nappies for now.

My son was wet every single night until 7.5 and never wet the bed since. He can't believe now that he wore a pull-up so long but I am glad we didn't push it. I was similar but had to go through bed wetting, sheet changing etc..

We did try for a bit last summer when she had a run of being dry every morning, and she was fine for about ten days/two weeks, then started wetting the bed every night again. Eventually we caved and reintroduced the pull-up.

Your not lax. You tried and your DD started wetting every night. It might be worth trying again when the weather is warmer, so washing wont be so much of a problem.

I was the same with my son, he was in a pull up untill 5.5 and it was still sometimes wet, one day. I decided to get rid of it, and he has been dry every day since - im convinced he was only wet sometimes as he knew he had a pull up on!

I think you're right. It was the same with DS. Don't think pull ups were available then but his nappy was wet through every morning - never had a dry one. However, when I decided to leave it off (with much trepidation) he never wet the bed - well only about 6 times over the next 3 year. I think he must have just have been doing an enormous pee first thing in the morning!

Hi OP.

I was in the same position as you last year. I called the school nurse and got some advice and...it worked!

In my daughters case she wasnt drinking enough and her bladder muscles were not strong enough to hold it in.

She said an amount (cant remember maybe 2 liters?) to drink daily that worked out to be 6 big glasses of water. Avoid juice. 2 thirds in the morning and 1 third in the afternoon. And in the last 2 hours before bed, small sips only but try and avoid. My daughter had probably only been having one large glass a day. Now we manage 3 or 4 (never managed 6). It worked in about 3 weeks. We had a couple of accidents which I think were more habit than anything else and she has been dry since.

Worth a try?

In my view, it’s both the hormone and learning that if you do need a wee, you wake up and go. But I’m not a scientist!

Yes, you're right. The hormone concentrates the urine, so you can go all night without needing a wee. If the hormone doesn't work very well (which it doesn't as we get older) you can still get up and have a wee in the loo. The problem with children is they both sleep longer than adults (maybe 12 hours to our 8) and also sleep more deeply.

Everyone I know lifts their children of 4 or 5 when they go to bed themselves, at about 11pm.

The only person I knew who did this, had 2 children one year apart and used to lift the 3 year old at 11 pm because his younger sister was already dry at night. I know it is not really encouraged but if they can manage 8 hours rather than 11 or 12 then why not?

Most of the time at least one of them is wet in the morning. I'm constantly being told to just persevere with it but I'm often tempted to give up and put them both back in pull ups.

I think if you have more wet beds than dry ones, persevering is a bit pointless. Following more specific advice on here might help, but otherwise you might as well have wet pull ups rather than wet beds.

Thanks again, everyone who replied. I'm not actually worried about it, just wondering if I should be, IYKWIM.
I was a bed wetter myself and I still remember the fifty trips to the loo before going to sleep, I was that worried about it, and still waking up wet in the morning and feeling humiliated.
She honestly doesn't seem to mind wearing pull-ups, so I think I'll leave her in them for a bit longer and work instead on getting her to drink more during the day.

@LoudNowSing

Aww! So you understand what it was like too? I’m sorry you had it hard. I know many kids still got punished or blamed for it when I was a kid in the 80s.

My parents were the exception letting me have special “child sized” nappies that they had to get from the Chemists.

I’m glad pull ups are now available and acceptable. When I was a Kid my
Parents never made fun of me or
Forced me to
Have the nappies, but there was always a lingering sense that they were for
Babies. I preferred wearing them to
Waking up in a wet bed though.

Hopefully future generations of
Parents will be more easy going.

I think my parents were ok about it. Certainly I don't remember them scolding me or making mean comments about it. I am old, though, and pull-ups didn't exist in my day. It's just not nice to wake up in a wet bed, whatever the attitude of those around you, I think.