Compensation for birth trauma PTSD

[User334567]

Has anyone been through a claim for birth trauma ? I had awful care in hospital after a traumatic birth it was mostly the care and neglect that caused my PTSD which I had therapy for. I went for a meeting and the hospital apologised and acknowledged the care wasn’t good and a plan for change. It was nearly two years ago (meeting 6 months ago) and I want to get the courage to ask a solicitor if I should pursue a claim for compensation. Any advice on if it’s worth it?

I think the ship sailed on this one.

What would you use the money for specifically related to the ptsd. ?

Think you said you've had therapy

I wish people would stop saying the NHS is "free". Yes it's free at the point of care to each individual patient absolutely agree, but every tax payer in this country pays for the NHS. It isn't magicked out of thin air.

And yes they have insurance and a ring fenced pot of cash for claims. If a solicitor thinks you would have a case, you are as entitled to sue them as any other business. And believe me, it's definitely a business.

Agree with @BuggerBognor!

It's not free and it should and more importantly, must be held accountable for its failings. Accepting sub-par medical attention because it's 'free' and we should be 'grateful' is a dangerous attitude.

I'm not sure OP has a case, but she should not be put off pursuing because the NHS is broke. It's shouldn't be allowed to fuck up because it's a centrally funded service.

I don't think you should do it, not because there is any inherent reason you shouldn't sue the NHS, but because I doubt you have strong legal grounds and will spend money you don't have on further stressing and upsetting yourself.

Have you spoken to a lawyer?

Speak to a solicitor, they can guide you best. Good luck and I'm sorry for what happened to you

Hi OP

Compensation for pain and suffering in the UK is quite low, and punitive damages aren't awarded. You would only really get financial compensation for things like additional costs you've had to pay out or money youve lost as a direct result of your experience. For example if you've had to take time of work unpaid, if you have had to pay for therapy privately because of nhs waiting times etc. If you have lost money or he money would make any issues with your PTSD easier to deal with (for example if you were so bad with it that you really could do with some time off work to try and heal but havent been able to afford it) then I would sue. But if it's because you're pissed off and want to punish them, then I wouldnt as you're just punishing other people who have to use them. Most compensation solicitors are no win no fee and would do an initial consultation and estimate how much you would be likely to receive, without you having to commit to anything.

@Lou98

What would the money change? Would it make your PTSD better?

As above, the NHS is a free service which we should be grateful for. They are already underfunded. Had it been a private hospital you'd paid for then I'd have agreed you were entitled to compensation. However, the hospital have admitted they're at fault and apologised. Money isn't going to change the situation now.

You say you had therapy for the PTSD, presumably this was through the NHS? Surely that is compensation, that made a difference to you?

This attitude really riles me, as someone who is being forced to sell her house to pay for surgery that the NHS has decided it won't fund, because unreasonably I dont want to end up in a wheelchair in a few years.

The NHS is only free if you don't pay tax. I most certainly do, in substantial amounts, and the concept that I should be grateful for the utterly sub standard health care that I am paying for is quite ridiculous in a civilised society. I would be grateful for world class surgery in clean, well staffed hospitals and this treatment to continue until I'm cured. As it is, I'm in Year 3 of a wait to see the only NHS surgeon that specialises in my disease, who is hundreds of miles away from me meaning I have to foot the bill of a couple of hundred quid train fare and a hotel just to see him for half an hour, and know damn well that when I get there I won't be able to have the surgery as my CCG have already knocked me back twice for funding.

And we should be grateful for this? Sue their arses off OP, you never know whats in the future and at least a settlement means you're not relying on the shower of shite that is our NHS going forward

I couldn't bring myself to do it. It was hard enough getting the courage to make a complaint three years on.

However ignore any shit about "don't do it to the poor NHS" though. The NHS did it to me. It apologised and admitted it did wrong. I'm still living with the consequences.

Op

I’m currently attempting to sue the NHS. In my case it is for sexual assault by a doctor.

Here’s what you need to know:
The budget for compensation does not come from the NHS budget
Solicitors will very quickly deal with an initial enquiry- they are easy to speak to and speedy
However they will unlikely take your case as you have to prove causation, the prognosis has to be poor usually and PTSD caused by an incident is very difficult to prove.
It might seem obvious to you that it was your experience caused the harm but you have to prove that on the balance of probabilities.

An apology from the NHS does not mean that it accepted liability. Even my when it says yes the care wasn’t good - the people you spoke to have not said (for instance) this would not have happened had you had a baby at home or in another hospital etc. Hence they aren’t saying “yes our substandard care left you in need of therapy” though it might seem like it to you. Legally it’s a different matter

I am sorry you suffered, but the hospital have apologised, and put in plans for the future, so you know none else will suffer

What do you think the compensation will do? It can’t change what happened and going through the process to get it you will have to be prepared to possibly,y revisit everything again

You would be better off getting counselling if you haven’t already and moving forward that continuing to rake up the past

The NHS is not free - we pay for it through our taxes. If it falls short, it should be held to account and that includes civil liability and compensation if its failings cause harm to patients.

That said, OP, you need to be clear on the nature of the harm you are claiming for. If you/your baby have physical injuries (and ongoing needs as a result of those injuries) as a result of your experiences, you may have a claim. Psychiatric harm is much more difficult to claim for and, as someone said above, damages tend to be low.

@Hadjab

Unless you or your child suffered actual physical harm which has resulted in the need for 24hr care, I would say no, don’t sue the NHS, it can’t afford it.

Why only actual physical harm? Mental health harm, such as PTSD, can be extremely debilitating.

[quote supersonicginandtonic]@User334567 I had birth trauma after my first child, so I completely understand how you are feeling. But why would you claim compensation from a strapped cash organisation that have already apologised? Surely you'd want practices to change.
This compensation culture drives me insane and it's making people selfish. [/quote]
This sort of thing does make me cross. Why on earth would people getting due compensation for injuries they have received drive you "insane"? At the very least OP has gone through hell, the first months of there chiid's life have been ruined, she and/or her partner may have been delayed in going back to work and lost money, she may have ongoing damage. Should she really suck that up? Would you?

Health authorities have insurance or else have funds set aside for claims; likewise medical professional have insurance. At what point, if any, might someone be entitled to compensation in your book? What if they can never work again, need expensive adaptations to their house, need expensive treatment that's not readily available - is it OK to claim compensation then? If so, where exactly is the dividing line?

I considered this, however as pp have said I didn't think it would change anything and would just make me feel a bit dirty about it all.

A consultant for my second child was horrified at what had happened and said plainly I could have sued . In retrospect am glad I didn't. I still feel traumatised by what happened but my subsequent births helped me overcome that trauma.

@Brieminewine

If they have apologised and you and your child are healthy then yes I think you would be unreasonable to try and take money from a free, underfunded, on its knees service in the middle of a global pandemic.

Why would getting money make you feel any better about your experience? Surely your concerns being acknowledged and receiving an apology would be far more beneficial?

Absolutely agree with this.

@willibald

Why do you think you deserve cash for this? What is it going to solve?

Compensation doesn't have to "solve" things. If a surgeon cuts off the wrong let and you have to go through life as a double amputee, compensation won't regrow the leg. But it provides the only remedy that is realistically available, and may help you in future in terms of lost employment opportunities, any equipment or adaptations you need, etc. In OP's case, it may help her in future in terms of getting counselling and therapy - particularly if she has another child - and will compensate if, for instance, she has been delayed in going back to work; also if it would help her to have a break when Covid allows etc.

But even if there were no concrete identifiable financial loss, the law has long recognised that people are entitled to compensation of pain, trauma, stress and suffering: it won't take them away but it's the best substitute available. The idea that we should all just suck up extraordinary pain and trauma caused by someone else's negligence because "compensation culture" or similar buzzwords is one that is heavily promoted by insurance companies and big business, and really we shouldn't fall for it.

I massively disagree with the messages about not suing the NHS. They're liable when things go wrong just like any other organisation and it's paid for from their insurance (though I'm sure claims push up their premiums). Sometimes it's only pay outs that produce change, apologies get swept under the carpet.

That said, treatment needs to be actually dire rather than just suboptimal for a claim to succeed, and even then compensation might not be that generous.

If I were you I'd find a reputable solicitor firm that will consider offering you no win no fee - they'll only take you on if you have a good case. It might be a no go on the grounds that your care wasn't bad enough to pass the legal tests, or there's not enough evidence - a lawyer will be able to tell you.

Contrary to what it says in the DM comments section, it’s actually really bloody hard to succeed in a claim for medical negligence. It takes ages and the NHS is not above using done pretty shady tactics to subvert even the most robust claim (eg NHSLA using v expensive solicitors and threatening claimants with costs orders).

As one of those "v expensive solicitors" I strongly object to everything you have said BuggerBognor - because almost none of that is true. I just don't recognise anything you say in the way we work.

Yes, I'll give you that it can take ages - but that's the English legal system for you - fairness takes time.

The NHS LA hasn't been called that for years now, it's NHS R. The outsourced solicitors are on rates fixed by NHS R which are significantly lower than equivalently qualified lawyers working for any other organisation of a similar size. The way costs work in civil litigation no longer give Defendants any ability to 'threaten' in the way you suggest. Again, that changed years ago so if you have recent examples of claimants having costs measures used against them, then that can only be in circumstances where the claimant or their lawyers are not progressing a claim appropriately.

Yes, it can be difficult to succeed but that is mainly (as others have said on this thread) that medical causation is difficult to establish. People are in hospital for a reason and it can be hard to unpick whether it's that reason or the negligence that caused a poor outcome. But if it is the underlying cause, do our doctors not deserve that we fight on their behalf? The NHS should not pay for outcomes that could not have been avoided even with the best care.

In the OP's case she said herself it was a traumatic birth, she would need to establish that it was the aftercare that caused her injury, not the birth itself. Based on my experience, that will be hard.

@cansu

They have apologised. I think it is incredibly difficult to get money from them. I would say it isn't worth the time or energy. What would it achieve? How would you feel if unsuccessful i went to ombudsman to complain about how my son was treated. It took nearly a year and nothing at the e d of it but a long list of excuses. It made me even angrier. I sincry wish I had never bothered

It isn't really difficult in an appopriate case. Either they will use tried and tested mediation to sort out what is due and pay up, or you can go to expert solicitors who will do the vast majority of the work.

I suppose it depends on how traumatic and how they failed to address it. You got an apology. If they have caused you or your child long term disabilities then maybe compensation to help with long term care costs

@dontdisturbmenow

OP, you're unlikely to get anywhere with that.

I assumed you want to sue in the basis that your experience has left you with a long term disability.

How are you going to evidence that your ongoing symptoms are a direct consequence of the birth experience and that you would have none of your issues if you'd recieve mediocre treatment as opposed to bad?

Not really a problem. There are tried and tested procedures for establishing this sort of evidence which a good solicitor will know about.

Completely disagree with everyone suggesting it is somehow immoral to sue the NHS for negligence. The harm that they can potentially do to an individual can have far reaching, emotionally crippling and financially expensive consequences. They are not a charity that we should be grateful for any output they provide, no matter how damaging or negligent - they are a service provider and they have a duty of care to meet, and if they don’t do so it is correct that they can be challenged on this and that legal recompense is made where the law allows.

As to the merits of OP’s case, only a solicitor can provide. I would suggest an initial meeting sooner rather than later if this is something you think you might want to pursue, as your claim will be time barred after a certain point.

What would the money change? Would it make your PTSD better?

Probably, yes. Treatment can be expensive and mental health treatment on the NHS is ridiculously difficult to access.

As above, the NHS is a free service which we should be grateful for

As pointed out, it is not a free service. We all pay for it - even if we aren't paying taxes, the VAT etc that we pay on goods goes towards NHS costs. If the NHS is not properly accountable, then the sort of dreadful care that OP has suffered will continue. With some honourable exceptions, the quality of obstetrical services in the NHS has declined in recent years and we need to get it into the heads of those who pay that it is NOT good enough to fuck up women's bodies and lives, shrug your shoulders and say "Sorreeeee" and carry on with just the same practices.

OP, you do need to see an experienced clinical negligence solicitor soon. You have three years from the original injury to start proceedings, and there is probably quite a lot of work to be done to prepare your case if it is viable.