Aibu to think master’s loans criteria should change?

[CaptainVanesHair]

Full disclosure, I already have an MA, paid for by me.

There’s an MA I would love to do now that would be totally possible with an MA loan. But you can’t apply if you already have one.

Isn’t this shortsighted? Masters are a great way to retrain and if they changed the criteria, it would help a lot of people.

Unis are crying out for students, surely a change to: you can have one loan for an MA/MSc makes sense? The government are talking about helping people to change careers etc so I’m just musing on this tonight. Obviously it can only be once, lest people become career students.

Devil’s advocate, I know that having a postgraduate education is a privilege and that plays into it, but I don’t think the same criteria applies to undergrads as I had mature students on my course who had a degree and then went on to do a second with a student loan.

YABU - if you have one postgrad degree, you don’t need another
YANBU - everyone should be entitled to a single
postgraduate student loan

@Nellythemouse

I scrimped and saved and bought my first house before first time buyer subsidies/stamp duty reductions were a thing. I’ve seen this really lovely new house I like the look of and since I didn’t get my subsidy on my first house I think I should be entitled to the stamp duty reduction on this one instead. After all government wants to help people into the housing market. Sound reasonable? Everyone should be entitled to one subsidised house?

You win some, you lose some. Government is trying to encourage certain aspects of retraining for the benefit of society - same as wanting to help first time buyers into the housing market. It’s not interested in being “fair” to individuals. You don’t get it made up to you later. Similarly though, if you didn’t pay massive fees on your undergrad degree in the 90s the government didn’t come along thirty years later and demand extra money now because that’s what it was charging current students.

I don’t resent anyone’s education. I have an MA myself (self funded).

That’s different though. You can sell, move into rented and become a first time buyer again.

Not for the purposes of government stamp duty reductions you can’t. Owning even a share of any property, anywhere in the world, ever, disqualifies you.

You’ve hit a nerve with me OP because I passionately believe with all not heart that education (all levels) is NOT a privilege, it IS a human right.

Don’t we talk all the time about our children’s right to “fulfill their potential” in school? We argue for the right school, the right class, for giving them breakfast in the morning... all so they can “fulfill their potential”.
What is that potential, I ask you? Is it their potential to learn, acquire new skills and really discover the best that they are capable of? OR, is it the potential to reach the age of 18 and then bollocks to your potential, any more learning is a privilege, what matters is how hard you work, mate.

Learning is lifelong and the right to explore and fulfill our potential should be ours for our whole lives, not binned at age 18.

If I were education secretary I’d make all further and higher education publically funded.

*with all my heart

I have wondered about this OP. Like you I have a self funded masters. I needed it to do the job I currently have.

I hope to one day do an MSc to move further up the career ladder I am on. If I could do that I could do a job that there is a need for in healthcare. But I can’t get a masters loan because of my qualifications, and career development loans no longer exist so it isn’t an option for me just now.

If I could get a masters loan I would take 1 day out a week to study, qualify to do a useful job and then pay it back. But the system as it is means I can’t.

However someone without a masters level qualification could get a loan to do an MA in something that is interesting but might not lead to meaningful employment and never pay in back.

It’s an imperfect system. As is everything. I’ll be watching out for future changes. Career development loans back please, or similar would be great!

‘ Learning is lifelong and the right to explore and fulfill our potential should be ours for our whole lives, not binned at age 18.’ @Nebulacoffee I completely agree with this!

@Nellythemouse thank you! I know it’s a tangent but my in laws have had some terrible (professional!) advice but from a quick google I can see you’re right. FIL is furious but also relieved I was able to send him the links.

@Nebulacoffee

Some people really RESENT others getting an education don’t they?? Postgraduate education is about research and expanding knowledge. I did my postgrad researching how to improve teaching children with hearing impairments. My sister did hers in better ways to dispose of waste in environmentally friendly ways. Further education builds knowledge that benefits everyone!!

What of that knowledge isn't so useful though? For example, Early Middle English lays, or French Medieval Clothing, or any number of nice, interesting things that are ultimately useless to most taxpayers? I don't think we ought to scrap arts subjects (I did one!) but I think it's unfair to ask society to fund endless studies into things that aren't tangibly useful. Why should someone who works for 50 years in a minimum wage job subsidise someone to study for years and years for their own enjoyment?

While I see your point, there would be people who would do nothing but 'study' forever. There is literally no point in the government paying for someone's post grad qualification if nothing will be achieved by doing so.

The government should only provide funding for post graduate qualifications if there is a shortage of skills in that area of knowledge. Or better still, companies who are short of qualified, skilled people in certain fields (I think STEM was mentioned) could employ people who will undertake post graduate learning while working for them too, and the government could subsidise the qualification costs. Win win for all involved. Some companies already do this without government help.

@MyopiaUtopia

Knowing me if I could get further PG loans I probably would end up being an eternal student and never getting a job!

Just to clarify - you can only get funding for a second undergraduate degree if it is part time in a STEM subject or if it is a some of the NHS courses like Nursing etc, I think.

I've had two undergraduate loans... first one was an original style student loan (I was the last yeargroup who got a partial student grant) and fully repaid long ago (it was the much higher amount repayment system). Second one is because it's an allied healthcare professions course I'm doing - and I had a fair battle trying to get an intelligent response out of Student Finance England that I was actually entitled to it (which I am).

I really really want to do a masters after this though - but it's either a hell of a commute to one further away, or do a less-tightly linked one with reduced fees for being alumni where I'm currently studying. It's just always been a big ambition of mine to GET a masters.

Everyone values different things. The arts are important on a social level. If the further study of science and technology was funded and the arts and humanities were not, we’d quickly find ourselves in a culturally and historically ignorant world, without quality museums or entertainment for example. Arts and humanities jobs tend not to be well paid. People won’t pay thousands to research these areas for a poorly paying job when other subject areas are subsidised /free.
If anyone does, it will be those with lots of money already, because they don’t need the money and can afford to work for fun.
How depressing, arts and humanities for the rich and privileged only...