Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3

Original poster

To think that you must be able to cite capability after 5 years

67 replies

Edenspirits · 04/03/2021 06:18

Someone in my work has a long term health condition which I have huge sympathy for (it’s bipolar plus other mental health issues) but it means that over the last 5 years, they are off work for approx 6 months of the year.

They don’t want to go part time but it seems fairly clear that they can’t sustain the role but work have said that there is nothing they can do. It’s putting an enormous strain on the health and well-being of everyone else as we have to fill in that work & pick up the gaps.

I have huge sympathy but aibu to think after 5 years, there must be some kind of capability issue here?

OP posts:

Eviebeans · 04/03/2021 07:52

Is this NHS?

Porridgeoat · 04/03/2021 07:54

The issue is ineffective management and not the woman. They need to cover her absence and also support her to manage as best as possible by implementing changes.

CrappyNewYear2021 · 04/03/2021 07:57

I spy a public sector job!

You need to raise your workload issue and not mention your colleagues absence. Speaking from experience your best approach is one of “I cannot manage this additional work on top of my own”. This then becomes your bosses problem. Ask for a meeting, explain your workload issues and ask for it to be dealt with in two weeks. If you have a union rep speak to them as well.

It’s awful when a colleague is too ill to come to work but it is not your problem!

AdventureIsWaiting · 04/03/2021 08:13

Appreciate you aren't the manager, but is early retirement for ill health a possibility you can mention? I had a vaguely similar situation many years ago, compromise agreement wasn't an option so HR suggested the above. The individual bit our hands off; they knew they couldnt cope but they were (understandably) scared of being unemployed. The other option is for HR to get an occ health assessment that recommends part time hours as a reasonable adjustment. Problem with that for the individual is part time pay.

Racoonworld · 04/03/2021 08:20

Not acceptable in any workplace, the problem is management aren’t doing their job. What would happen if you refused to take in the extra work?

GuyFawkesDay · 04/03/2021 08:22

I think you work with me OP!!! Similar situation, 2 years in and no resolution in sight.

catless · 04/03/2021 08:27

I worked with someone who was also off work about half of the year but more intermittent. She would start projects then go off sick (for mostly genuine reasons) and not only did we have to fit in her work on top of our own workload but we had pick it up halfway through sometimes with little background.

In the end she wasn't given bigger campaigns because she was unlikely to see them through and it just ended up with us resenting her especially as she earned significantly more than me.

Ijustknowitstimetogo · 04/03/2021 08:33

Yes, some public sector employers might not do anything.

Generally local authorities are a lot faster to take decisive action, whilst much of the nhs is reluctant to deal with these situations.

Sugarplumfairy65 · 04/03/2021 08:36

Some of the replies on here ane why its so difficult for someone with disabilities to get and hold down a job. You then complain about them claiming benefits.
It reminds me of when my friend was going through chemo and radiotherapy. For nearly 2 years she spent more time off sick than at work. Her employers were great, but her colleagues were utter bitches. The days that she could work were spent listening to sly comments along the lines of "must be lovely to be part time" etc. She did at one point offer her notice but her employer refused it and told her not to worry about her job.

oblada · 04/03/2021 08:39

I'm in HR. I'd go mad working in the public sector, nothing ever gets done.
DH works for a company that behaves a little like the public sector and that is maddening enough.
Your work is clearly unreasonable and should be managing this much better.

Brefugee · 04/03/2021 08:40

to be fair, not being available 6 months of the year isn't getting and holding down a job, it is getting a job and mightily struggling. It really looks, when written down like that, that part-time would be less of a struggle?

OP i get that it is an absolute load of shit that you have to cover someone's work, and this is now you need to approach it - in terms of how your workload is affecting you. So usually you'd need to work out what your actual job is, then the extras and go to your manager and ask which to prioritise and which you can drop and not have to go off with stress or something.

Are you in a union? join a union.

DayBath · 04/03/2021 08:41

I worked with someone like this. Perfectly capable when she worked but her bipolar kicked in at the perfect point to take sick leave as soon as she was eligible for full pay again. Not a day before, not a day after. Incredibly convenient how bipolar can be set to a regular timer like that.

Bipolar my arse.

Original poster

Edenspirits · 04/03/2021 08:46

@Sugarplumfairy65 I completely get what you are saying and I really don’t want this to be a disability bashing thread- quite the opposite. Honestly, I really like and respect my colleague and know they struggle.

It’s just the wider impact that it’s had for 5 years on the rest of us which really doesn’t feel fair or right at all

OP posts:

Donotfeedthebears · 04/03/2021 08:48

What’s going to happen to all the people with long Covid?

oblada · 04/03/2021 08:54

@Donotfeedthebears

What’s going to happen to all the people with long Covid?

Well like with any condition it depends on the situation. If people can do their job with adjustments then fine. If people cannot do their job despite reasonable adjustments then the job has to change somehow or they leave. Business are not there to subsidise people being unable to work, it's not how it works.

DayBath · 04/03/2021 08:54

@Donotfeedthebears

What’s going to happen to all the people with long Covid?

Presumably they won't have long covid symptoms as regular as clock work that are timed perfectly to take maximum advantage of the 6 months on/6 months off public sector sick pay system. In other words they won't take the fucking piss.

If their symptoms are genuine and long lasting then they will have to stop working and go on benefits like the rest of the disabled community. Long covid doesn't get a free pass over and about CFS or Fibromyalgia just because those people might be younger.

Yes the benefit system sucks, but this is what people voted for and supported. Surprising how many of them regret their vote no they're part of the poor people they tried to screw over.

AnneElliott · 04/03/2021 09:00

Feel for you op (also public sector so I know how rubbish HR can be). My advice is to make your workload your line mangers problem - no way would I expect my team to take an unreasonable workload for 5 years! Your seniors either have to hire new people or stop doing certain tasks - not fair to try and get you doing more than a FT job.

NoIDontWatchLoveIsland · 04/03/2021 09:08

Employers do this when they can get away with forcing the workload onto everyone else. They get to be the "nice" employer/good guy, don't risk reputation, and still get the work done.

Unfortunately all you can when something is going on so long & is clearly not sustainable, is to is start pushing back at taking on the person's work, to force the employer to bear the cost of it, then they will see its unsustainable and will take action that doesnt force everyone else to take the strain.

MichelleScarn · 04/03/2021 09:28

Agree with loveisland the pressure to be the good guy and 'help out as we're all in it together' not is immense.
And the sometimes incredulousness of senior management at you not wanting to do the job of 2.5 people to prevent them having to get agency workers in is almost laughable.

MeltsAway · 04/03/2021 09:56

I feel your pain @Edenspirits - I wondered if you are another colleague of mine! I work in the public sector with a colleague very much as you describe (it's now 10 years ...). I have every sympathy - my colleague has been sectioned on occasion, and it's a chronic illness I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

But the stress on others: dealing with colleague in a lead up to a manic phase, covering for them in front of clients and others outside those of us who know - the extra work - is exhausting.

I hope my colleague is being managed into part-time work; it's all they can sustain. We are all working at a high level (yes, some areas of the public sector are high-skilled, high-demand, high-stress ), and my colleague & management unthinkingly rely on the robust physical & mental health of the rest of us.

When colleagues gossip & complain/vent, I now say "Well, we have to stop covering for X." It's tough, to think that our refusal to cover may lead to their loss of job, but they have consistently NOT dealt with the implications of having a chronic illness. It seems to be a feature of bipolar particularly to deny that you're ill; I can understand this, it's natural to deny that which suggests you're not entirely rational, in an area of work which relies on rationality ...

Brefugee · 04/03/2021 09:57

Not a day before, not a day after. Incredibly convenient how bipolar can be set to a regular timer like that.

How about they have struggled and struggled because they need the money and only go sick when they can afford to? I wonder how stressful that is for anyone in those circs?

In these types of cases it is always better to concentrate on you: how it is affecting your workload and how your manager can solve that, how the overwork is affecting you and how your manager can solve that.

It is up to the employers to sort out any malingerers in the workforce, and other people's health is none of our business. The only thing we should be worrying about is how to manage our own work.

An0n0n0n · 04/03/2021 10:04

Yabu. Have you thought what it would be like for her to work during manic episodes. Or for the team. Or do you thinkbtgey should sack her on medical grounds? Be careful what you wish for it could be you in a similar position one day.

PumpkinPie2016 · 04/03/2021 10:05

YANBU. The person is obviously unwell and they absolutely deserve every sympathy and reasonable adjustments. However, if after 5 years that isn't working, the management need to do something more.

Either hiring a cover or reducing the person's hours or coming to an exit agreement.

Can a few of you speak to your boss/HR about the impact on your work/wellbeing. Focus on the impact on you, rather than the other person.

PumpkinPie2016 · 04/03/2021 10:08

@An0n0n0n the OP isn't suggesting the person work during manic episodes. She has every sympathy for the person.

However, that doesn't mean that everyone else should be continually impacted and the management do nothing.

Pinkfreesias · 04/03/2021 10:23

@Sugarplumfairy65, you're absolutely right. As a disabled person, it is incredibly hard to get and/or keep a job. People don't want someone disabled on their team, as has been clearly illustrated here, but also like to use the lazy scrounger narrative all too readily.

I've experienced the whispering and sniping and it was awful. Knowing that, on top on my declining health, people were angry at me.

I was on capability proceedings and, in the end, left before they were about to sack me; I just couldn'tbear it any longer. This was public sector, and they do sack people, whatever people here might think.

Please at least have a little sympathy for disabled workers, too. Life can be utter hell for them.

Flip

1 2 3