Suspected School Place Fraud

[SchoolFraudDilemma]

This is more a WWYD.

If you suspected someone had fraudulently applied for a secondary school place, would you report it?

There is a very outside chance of an EHCP but it is unlikely.

I suspect that they've used a different address to their actual address when applying.

They live approx 6 miles from the school. According to the local authority data, the furthest place offered was 1.2m from the school.

Would you report it or just mind your own business?

[WombatChocolate]

I'd need a strong sense that I was right about fraud to report it.

It's absolutely true that loads of people have things that push them up the priority order that you know nothing about. It's a bit like people being annoyed a younger person got the vaccine and thinking they have queue jumped without knowing about their medical conditions which people don't know about that gave them priority.

If I knew a parent who clearly had lived a long way away, had rented locally for the short term and was telling people they were moving back to their owned home out of catchment shortly, then I probably would report. But if all I knew was that people lived a distance away and always have, I wouldn't because all kinds of things could explain it.

And yes it's true that the admissions people can check easily and there's no real problem if it turns out to be legitimate, but I think that generating that work and reporting requires a reasonable level of certainty about fraud.

Lots of people wonder why someone else got a place. Many later realise why. Good evidence of active fraud - yes report. Just a lack of being able to work out why someone got a place then no.

[ChameleonClara]

@Daphnise

Watch "A Lady of Letters" by Alan Bennett, OP and see the result of reporting things you know nothing about....

Yes quite! Watched this just the other week,

[QueenOfLabradors]

I'm on the report side. Stealing school places isn't a victimless crime.

[Viviennemary]

I might report them. Depends

[MMAMPWGHAP]

I know two families who abused the system and both had sibling places on the back of the first abuses. So that’s 4 school places obtained fraudulently.

In both cases they used addresses that they were not living at.

I wasn’t that close to either case at the time but this goes on far too much. Please report and let those who run the system decide.

[NoIDontWatchLoveIsland]

Why would I report it? It doesn’t affect me in any way and they are just trying to do the best for their kids.

Because another local child living much closer to the school will not have received a place who deserves to be educated in their own community near their home, and instead might be allocated a school miles away.

[lioncitygirl]

I would probably report - though feel pretty bad and mean about it. It’s the right thing to do. I was in a faith school and a girl I knew was ‘baptised’ to get in.... they found out a bit later and she had to leave. Pretty sad really. She loved it/I really liked her!

[Chloemol]

Report, they are not being fair to others

[An0n0n0n]

Report because if they have the evidence then they can prove it.

[Boonlark]

Do you know whether they might have got in via a sibling?

[PurpleWh1teGreen]

I'm in an area where wealthy parents certainly game the system, but I'm not sure widespread fraud happens.

That said, I have close friends whose DS missed out on a place and so I think if I did know about fraud, I would have to report.

[PeapodBurgundy]

I'm torn on this one. There's pretty much nothing I wouldn't do to make sure DS stays in the schools he's in, and I'd have gone to the end of the earth to get him a place to begin with. He's a tricky child (still awaiting diagnosis, but everyone, professionals included, speaks as if he already has the diagnosis in place, so it feels like it's a given). If a fib was the only way I could have got him in, I would have done it in a heartbeat. I'm not sayng it's not a shitty thing to do for other children, but to cut it down to the bare bones of the matter, I care more about DS than any other child in the world (apart from DD obviously).

Just to be extra hypocritical, I would report suspected fraud if DS didn't get a place if I thought it would up his chaces of being offered one retrospectively.

As it happens, DS's school is a very underrated small primary in the middle of a (largely still) 'council' estate, and hasn't been oversubscribed in years. Assumptions are made that it's a bad school based on location, the fact that their SATS results are never anything to sing about and they're within spitting distance of three Ofsted Outstanding schools. When you actually look at the school, the community feeling and the pastoral care is absolutely amazing! They have a huge portion of SEND children, with the associated funding, equipment and specialist staffing which goes hand in had with that. The care, support and education they offer DS is exemplary. That's miles more important to me that SATS results or Ofsted reports.

They're on phase two of four of building hundreds of new houses nearby, which will put pressure on the local schools. We moved two streets away from the school in the middle of said council estate when DS was two to give us a fighting chance of him getting a place there (we're still living there, and won't be moving for the forseeable future, if at all). If we'd done that, and still not got him a place, I'll admit I'd have been mutinous.

In all, I don't really have any right to comment on what other people are doing with regard to school admissions given the way I know I would act if needed.

[lpsandmore]

If there is a chance of an EHCP than they have some sort of SEN. I think in this instance I would really mind your own business. If that particualar school can cater to their needs, they can ask for a Social/Medical place without an EHCP.

Things are really really hard for parents of kids with SEN, really would leave it. Be happy for your friend.

[Hamandcheeselife]

Report it!

Don’t know why you’d need concrete proof - if the child is in on special criteria the school will know. They’ll also have been given their place before today.

I knew someone who bought her parents a house next to the nursery of her choice 🤦🏼‍♀️

[Covidwedding123]

Why are you such a nosey busy body?

No, it’s none for your buisness

[Macey78]

For those that say that the child may have EHCP. That's understandable of course - however the children on a EHCP in my DD's year 6 class were informed 2 weeks ago, of which school they are getting into.

[Ideasplease322]

This happened at our local highly over subscribed primary school. My formers son didn’t get in. They live three streets away,

Her next door neighbours grandson Did get in. He loves twenty miles away.

She didn’t report but she couldn’t bring herself to ever speak to the couple again. This boy clearly took a place that her child would have otherwise have gotten. He could have walked to school, and would have been surrounded by his school friends.

Lying about your address to take another child’s place is Selfish and dishonest.

[lpsandmore]

@macey78 this is if everything goes smoothly. We have an EHCP and didn't find out till a day after national offers

[Forfolkssake]

MYOB

[Macey78]

@lpsandmore ahhhh makes sense

[Nith]

Local authorities are really very hot on checking addresses, the chances that this family is operating successful fraud are really very small. My money is on an EHCP.

[spongedog]

@Ideasplease322

This happened at our local highly over subscribed primary school. My formers son didn’t get in. They live three streets away,

Her next door neighbours grandson Did get in. He loves twenty miles away.

She didn’t report but she couldn’t bring herself to ever speak to the couple again. This boy clearly took a place that her child would have otherwise have gotten. He could have walked to school, and would have been surrounded by his school friends.

Lying about your address to take another child’s place is Selfish and dishonest.

Indeed it totally is. But if that family who KNEW the facts couldnt be bothered to report, then why should the rest of us bother. That's how this fraud and deception continues. I think there are a lot of people who couldnt give a fucking shit unless it affects them. How do they think these dishonest people behave in the rest of their lives? If you are prepared to lie and cheat on this - what about your taxes, speeding, self-isolating etc? Presumably none of that matters either? That might be why, even after lock down for several months, rates of covid are INCREASING in some areas? Selfish fuckers.

[seepingweeping]

My friends sister has 3 children at a local primary. She says she lives with her mum 3 nights a week so the kids need to attend school there and do but there are local kids being bussed to nearest to catchment school because of shit like this.

[dottiedaisee]

Yes as a person who witnessed the fallout with their own child being robbed of a place at local grammar school I would definitely report!! These people who lie are bloody shocking ..am actually feeling bloody sick ..this happened to my daughter 15 years ago and the stress as a family is still with us .My daughter who actually got to that school eventually with her parents going to the ombudsman and fighting. Luckily for my daughter she had intelligent articulate parents to fight for her !! If you want your child to go to a decent grammar school....work hard and make sacrifices!!