To say I don't care anymore? (13yo bedroom related)

[Pastcaringnow]

Background: 3 years ago, we moved into an absolute dump of a house. Everything needed doing. Plastering, windows, doors, decor. We decorated the DCs room to a habitable level.
2 years ago, it was time to start making the rooms 'proper bedrooms'. We spent £2500ish on DD11 and DD4 (at the time) bedroom. Carpet, plastering, decorated to DD11 choice, bunk beds, wardrobe, drawers, curtains etc etc.
Within 2 months, drawers had broken backs from DD forcing too much in, room was full of rubbish, impossible to walk through.
Fast forward 2 years of me lecturing them, 'put clothes away, clear the floor, get rid of empty glasses etc, show some respect'
DDnow13 came down tonight crying hysterically because she'd torn the (expensive) wallpaper.
My response was 'I'm past caring. You have no respect for your space, forcing your 6yo sister to live the same way. The bedroom will stay the way it is permanently'
She's now sobbing about how I'm angry with her (I'm past that) and disappointed in her (I was but genuinely past caring) and how she's going to save to redecorate (not happening as the rest of the house needs to be done.
So not to drip feed, this is the main bedroom of the house. Myself and DP only got carpet in our room 6 months ago, no decoration or furniture other than the bed we sleep in. Other DCs have adequate decor and carpet but need upgrading.
WIBU to tell her to I don't care about her room anymore?

It's not your children's fault you are all living in a hovel. You should be providing a decent home for them to live in. And it's been like this for 3 years?? That's insane.
I feel really sorry for both of your daughters. It's up to you to help them keep the room nice. Don't allow drinks or food or paint in there for a start. Confiscate stuff left on the floor. You can't expect them to keep their room nice if the rest of the house is a dump.

You don’t have to spend a lot to make rooms look presentable. I also moved into a bit of a dump a few years ago (50 year old carpets etc) and had to give it a very quick and cheap makeover. Just painted all the walls white, cheap carpet and Lino offcuts, some bits from IKEA.

You moved your family into a hovel and they had to live in it until you fixed it. A year, it sounds like? And it's still partly a hovel, which is stressful even when it's not your personal space.

Giving your kids habitable personal space is not something for which you should expect effusive gratitude, especially when they had to live in a pit beforehand and still do to a degree. You certainly should have prioritised their rooms. She should learn to treat her space well so that she can have it at its best but all the implications that she somehow owes you because you moved into a hovel...no.

@FlyingPandas

Hmmm...I think YABU, a bit.

It sounds like at age 11 and 4 you just expected them to put things away and keep the room tidy with no help or guidance or actual structure. (Apologies if that wasn't actually the case, but it's how your OP reads). And that 'within 2 months' it was a tip. I suspect most kids would struggle to keep a room tidy without help. You can't just say 'put clothes away, clear the floor, have respect!' Unless it's just a case of having one or two items to clear away, mess can swiftly reach a point where it's too overwhelming and they (quite literally) can't see the room for the shite and don't know what to do.

Really silly question maybe but have you ever had a structured routine of helping them tidy on, say, a weekly basis, and get organised, other than 'lecturing' them? My kids can keep rooms reasonably tidy (my rule is 80% of the floor has to be clear) but they need direction on a regular basis!

It's very common for teens to be messy but your DD sounds overwhelmed rather than uncaring.

I totally get that you're frustrated but I'm not sure whether you expected a bit too much from an 11 and 4 year old (as they were at the outset) sharing a room.

100% what I was going to say.

I am well aware that any failings of my DC to keep their rooms in an adequate state are because we (as parents) don’t help them keep on top of it - by example, by reminders, by helping and keeping a schedule, rewards/consequences.

11 and 4 sharing is tricky ages/stages. It’s unfair of you to say the older one is “forcing her younger sister to live like that”.

I’m afraid I think YABU.

I think this is another difficulty of lockdown. Kids are spending a lot more time in their rooms so there is going to be more wear. Also they can't have friends over which used to be an incentive for tidying bedrooms.

I am probably going against the grain but your house sounds very stressful.
Why are you not calmly helping them have a tidy up each day and providing tick lists and rewards if you want increased independence? Children don't miraculously 'respect' their belongings - you have to gently, kindly, model, teach and provide a habitable and organised home in which for that to happen.

Within 2 months, drawers had broken backs from DD forcing too much in, room was full of rubbish, impossible to walk through.

8 weeks in a shared children’s room is an absolute AGE if daily/weekly tidy-ups aren’t kept on top of. Too much stuff in drawers is your job as grown-up to encourage them to pare down or buy more furniture if you think they need everything. At 11 they don’t have the maturity to think stuff will break if there’s too much. Only keep what you can store properly is an adult teaching thing.

Fast forward 2 years of me lecturing them, 'put clothes away, clear the floor, get rid of empty glasses etc, show some respect'

How often? Weekly? Daily? “Respect” isn’t a clear instruction to follow! Even ‘clear the floor’ can be overwhelming. Hell, some adults struggle.

DDnow13 came down tonight crying hysterically because she'd torn the (expensive) wallpaper.
My response was 'I'm past caring. You have no respect for your space, forcing your 6yo sister to live the same way. The bedroom will stay the way it is permanently'

You lost your temper and need to say sorry, that you over-reacted. We all do sometimes but it’s how we fix it that counts.

She's now sobbing about how I'm angry with her (I'm past that) (she doesn’t know that) and disappointed in her (I was but genuinely past caring) (even worse - you’re so disappointed you’re past caring, imagine what that’s like to a child) and how she's going to save to redecorate (not happening as the rest of the house needs to be done. (she understands the source of your anger and is desperate to fix it.)

When I lose my shit at the state of the kids rooms or the house it’s not them I’m really angry at - it’s me and my DH, for not doing a better job of adulting and leading by example and teaching. Consider if your young DD is the real source of your frustration and whether she should be taking all the blame?

I agree with FlyingPandas. I taught my kids how to keep a room tidy and clean. I thought they would somehow know (their father is quite tidy) but no. Also not born with the need for orderliness like my mother.

So I had to learn how to get kids to tidy up, and then taught them how to actually do it. We're far from perfect, but they do keep their rooms tidy away from home. Now I know the lessons have stuck.

Had to tell DS14 this evening that as he did not tidy his room today as I asked, he would have to tidy it in the morning or lose privileges. He's obviously not keen, but because he knows I will follow through, he asked if I could tell him what to focus on (we tend to focus on areas - floor, desk, shelves, bed). We also do five-minute pickups and 10-item tidies depending on what needs done. They also clean their rooms. Coz I hate cleaning and they're old enough to do their share.

There are a lot of techniques you can teach your DC that will make life a little less stressful for all of you. I hope you'll find a way that works for you.

Sorry, but I actually think you need to help them more to keep their environment nice rather than just getting angry when it is messy and things get broken. Dc aren't born with the skills to organise themselves.

Ah, the cunts are out in force tonight. @Pastcaringnow YANBU

I think you are correct. It’s been going on years and it sounds like she has zero respect. If she doesn’t tidy up I’d be bagging all her things up and putting the in the garage.

Sure, be furious, but then help her make it good as best she can. Offer to pay for a couple of cans of paint if she wants to paint it herself.

I do get the temptation to wash your hands of the whole thing. However with my grown up hat on, you can't expect her to start respecting her space if you stop doing so. And she shouldn't have to feel grateful that you paid for plastering and new carpets. That's just home maintenance. A new bedroom to kids means getting to choose the colour and curtains, they don't care if you've upgraded the skirting boards or finish.

I know the feeling very well! DDs 10 and almost 9 are 2 filthy little shits.

Dirty dishes everywhere; yogurt pots, apple cores, empty packets all over the floor; food and drink spilled onto surfaces of desks and bedside tables; paint on carpets and walls; huge amount of crap lurking under the beds; clothes, clean and dirty who knows anymore, all over the floor..!!

Ive cleaned and srubbed and tidied, removed tech, TV and any fun from them and they still turn the place into a shithole.

Let them live in their scum in my opinion. They'll soon regret it when fruit flies come back or their background for Tiktoks isn't amaze!

@dontletthecatout why don't you have a have a no food in the bedroom rule? A daily tidy up together? An enjoyable time going through their things and 'finding' new things to play with. They are so young. To call them filthy little shits is really unkind

Help her and teach her, I have always lead by
Example made their bed tidied their rooms then they get used to it and keep it like that, when mine were younger I used to offer to help sort wardrobes out so they didn’t get overcrowded- she’s 13 how is she supposed to pay for new wallpaper ??! Be kind the our children have had a horrible 12 months x your probably living in a building site how is she supposed to keep her room tidy with no help

@Dontletthecatout you sound a complete
Joy of a parent

They shouldn't share the room really. The older DD is a secondary school teenager whereas the younger DD is just 6. They have different bedtime routines, different amount of school work etc. They can't go to bed at the same time as teens go to bed later and it's stressful for the older one when they have to adjust for the younger siblings. It could be stressful for both children.

I couldn't disagree more.

It may be a kids bedroom but it's still a room in your house. I'd never allow a room in my house to get into the state you describe. And I have two teens - both bedrooms immaculate

What I do takes little effort - just the effort of me annoyingly popping in there a few times a day anyway - which I do regardless to chat / say dinner is ready / whatever. And when I'm in there, I say ' take the glass down. Hang up your dressing gown. Put your pens back in the pot. Put your book back on the bookshelf.' Etc etc. Whatever is out of place basically. There's built in storage and it's a clear space so easy to keep clean and tidy - it never gets to a stage like you describe because my house is a source of pride for me.

We have a robot cleaner for upstairs too and that cleans every other day - could you consider this?

I dunno, I couldn't live how you describe so I'd be making efforts to fix it

@Dontletthecatout how disgusting. Your kids are little? Can't you effectively parent them? Talk about not giving a shit yourself

YABU for claiming you spent £2500 on their room, if that figure includes plastering! Plastering is maintaining the walls, not decoration.

It also sounds like your DD is not necessarily entirely to blame if the backs of her drawers fell off - honestly, a lot of modern furniture is very poor quality.

At the age of 10, which she was when you did the room up, it's not unbelievable that tidying her bedroom was not something she'd do without a direct order. Presumably, you haven't prioritised ensuring it was tidy, either.

Maybe start building in a ten minute tidy-up with the two DCs at the same time each day to get her into the habit. Make sure there's enough storage for everything. Also, be very clear what counts as tidy - is it ok to shove mess under the bed? Can clothes go back in drawers if they've been worn? Do toys have to be sorted, or just bunged in a box together?

Bore off thanks!

Clearly the humour has been lost in some tonight.

The Mumsnet wildlings are in force 💪🏽

@Dontletthecatout

Bore off thanks!

Clearly the humour has been lost in some tonight.

The Mumsnet wildlings are in force 💪🏽

Calling your kids filthy little shits isn't funny when it's your fault they're like that

@Dontletthecatout ugh. You weren't joking, that much was clear.

When my lot were at home I did not allow food or drinks in bedrooms. They also did their own washing and were responsible for changing their bedlinen. However they were messy and I should have done better at making them tidy up. They have grown up to be messy in their own homes though I hope they are good at changing their beds. Two of them have partners who are also messy and untidy. I compensate in my mind by keeping my place spotless.