Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DB is going on holiday to SA tomorrow

52 replies

viktoria · 06/02/2021 22:48

DB called me about two hours ago and said that he had a surprise to tell me:
he and his wife are setting off on a 2 week holiday tomorrow. To South Africa.

They were meant to go last April and obviously had to re-schedule. He said that they are flying to Jo'burg, then hire a car and drive to Kruger and then will go to the beach on the east coast near Durban.

He said they hadn't told many people. But it's not illegal (they live in Germany).
I think he only told me because he asked me to try and arrange booking a covid vaccination for our mum (who is 84 and who I haven't seen for a year, because of covid).

I literally couldn't say anything to him other than "I have to go, we're having dinner. Have a nice time"

But I'm angry - it's entitled and selfish. I can't understand why anybody HAS to go on holiday at the moment. I would love to. But I don't think it's right. And I'm ok to wait for a time when travelling is safe again.
AIBU?
Am I too judgemental?

So not to drip feed - I'm not close to my DB.
He is 4 years older than me. We both were at boarding school (different ones). He went away to school when I was 6 and we would only see each other some weekends and during holidays.
He has three kids, admittedly, the elder two are 21 and 19, but the younger one is 16, and obviously not at school at the moment.
Nowadays, we mainly are in touch to discuss care arrangements for our mum who has dementia.

OP posts:
LagunaBubbles · 06/02/2021 23:44

You sound very bitter and jealous OP. Why does it bother you so much?

You don't sound very bright if you can't work that one out!

Original poster
viktoria · 07/02/2021 08:04

Thanks, everybody.
Yes, I'm trying to rise above it and not let it affect me too much.
And, yes, even though we don't have much contact, I think I will in future reduce it to a minimum ie, to anything concerning my mum.
I have been annoyed with him over the last few years, because I feel that he doesn't care for my mum as much as I think he should.
Pre-covid I used to spend more time with her than he did, flying to visit her every 8-12 weeks. Even though he only lives 1 hour's drive from her.
But I (after quite a bit of soul searching) came to to conclusion that the way I need to approach it is that i am responsible for my actions and he is for his and I don't want to have a toxic relationship with him, or have no contact. At least as long as our mum is alive, as she has dementia and my DB and myself need to be in touch about her care and about administrative issues.
Plus, my children and his children are very close and usually visit each other, and I get on very well with his children.
I suppose this decision to go on holiday to South Africa has just totally taken me by surprise and blindsided me.
In a way, Covid seems to bring out the worst in some people - and thankfully the best in many others.

OP posts:
Doomsdayiscoming · 07/02/2021 09:14

I think it’s fine.

Who cares if he helps bring back a variant that undermines a vaccination programme.

Hope he has a nice time.

peak2021 · 07/02/2021 09:20

Understand why you are upset. Totally understand if you decide to reduce contact with your DB to only be where discussions about your mum's welfare are needed.

The only thing I would add is that in Germany when I went last September face coverings were worn and contact tracing in place properly. Without exception, no people claiming reasons not wear a face covering.

Disneyforever1974 · 07/02/2021 10:18

Sorry OP I wrongly assumed your mum lived in the UK. I light of your last post how are you supposed to arrange a COVID jab if you are in another country? Also yes he is being a bit short sighted going on holiday if he is the closest physically to your mum. What if there is an emergency regarding your mum and nobody is there to help out?

Original poster
viktoria · 07/02/2021 11:10

In order to arrange vaccination for my mum, I just need to make phone calls - so I can do that from here.
My mum has a live in Carer who can take her to be vaccinated.

I told my friend in South Africa about the situation, and this is what she texted back - putting my feelings in words better than I could have:

I would have hoped your brother would realize your Mum’s vulnerability and with you unable to get to her at this time, take responsibility to be there for her.
It is such a learning curve, not flirting with danger. Many people think they are immune, that bad things cannot happen to them. They can and they do.
Willfully putting yourself at risk impacts on so many others. I wonder if they understand the SA health system? Even with travel insurance and going private, the hospitals are under strain with bed shortages and are full to capacity with serious Covid cases.
Your brother and his wife may travel here, not contract the virus, balk at all the fuss and feel quite proud of themselves for their “bravery” at not letting the virus limit their lives or their summer holiday plans. The flip side is putting their and others’ health at risk, risking the spread of infection, possibly taking up valuable resources by choosing to put themselves in the line of danger and leaving a vulnerable parent in a time of need.
This is a social maturity issue.

OP posts:
MagnoliatheMagnificent · 07/02/2021 14:07

I like the phrase 'this is a social maturity issue' - very appropriate right now! My 11 year old has more of this than quite a few people many years older!

Duckberg · 07/02/2021 14:13

Tell him to enjoy the covid SA variant!

lljkk · 07/02/2021 17:10

They said on radio today that Germany didn't allow travellers to enter from countries with alarming new variants. I wonder what they meant, if OP's Bro can go on hols so easily.

lljkk · 07/02/2021 22:37

ok, I found rules here.
5-10 days quarantine when get back

BeakyWinder · 07/02/2021 22:48

An 84 year old that hasn't been vaccinated yet? Where is your mum, that's very unusual?

pistachioglace · 07/02/2021 22:55

He's an idiot. Depending on how insurance works over there he could be going without valid travel insurance, he might not be able to get back and even then he presumably has to quarantine.

Lemonsyellow · 07/02/2021 22:56

@BeakyWinder

An 84 year old that hasn't been vaccinated yet? Where is your mum, that's very unusual?
OP has said her mum is not in the U.K.
BeakyWinder · 08/02/2021 07:33

@Lemonsyellow ah, thank you I had missed that.

MimosaFields · 08/02/2021 07:34

@BeakyWinder

An 84 year old that hasn't been vaccinated yet? Where is your mum, that's very unusual?
My parents are 83 and not vaccinated yet. Every country is dealing with it differently. Mine live in Spain.

OP, your brother's actions are incredibly stupid but he's there now and let's hope he doesn't catch it and spread it. I have a similar relationship with my own sister. She lives an hour away from my parents but I visit every 6 weeks (on a normal year) and she visits them twice a year. It's hard to accept but you can't change them. Once my parents are gone, our relationship will die out.

Choccorocco · 08/02/2021 07:53

I wonder if he was worried about losing the money paid out for his holiday. If it’s legal for him to go then presumably he can’t get a refund? And was it an expensive, holiday of a lifetime time trip?

Before you all jump on me - I have personally gone above and beyond re lockdown, my kids could go to school as keyworker children but I haven’t sent them, etc, etc.

But if I had paid thousands for my holiday of a lifetime and knew I would never see that money or have the chance again, it wouldn’t be an easy decision to just let it go. I know because we were undecided about going abroad last summer on a holiday booked the year before, thankfully the law changed so we were able to push it forward but if we hadn’t been able to, and if it had been a more expensive holiday, I’m not sure which way we would have jumped.

Is he just a selfish idiot or are there other things to take into consideration?

Original poster
viktoria · 08/02/2021 12:24

@Choccorocco

I wonder if he was worried about losing the money paid out for his holiday. If it’s legal for him to go then presumably he can’t get a refund? And was it an expensive, holiday of a lifetime time trip?

Before you all jump on me - I have personally gone above and beyond re lockdown, my kids could go to school as keyworker children but I haven’t sent them, etc, etc.

But if I had paid thousands for my holiday of a lifetime and knew I would never see that money or have the chance again, it wouldn’t be an easy decision to just let it go. I know because we were undecided about going abroad last summer on a holiday booked the year before, thankfully the law changed so we were able to push it forward but if we hadn’t been able to, and if it had been a more expensive holiday, I’m not sure which way we would have jumped.

Is he just a selfish idiot or are there other things to take into consideration?

Good point. That might well have played into it. However, even if it's not illegal to go to SA, there is a severe warning on the German foreign office list. And I'm pretty sure they would have been able to get some of the costs (like flights) back. Yes, as far as I can tell, parts of it was expensive, for instance Kruger Park. However, I don't know if they would have lost all the money or not. I think they would have lost some of it. They were meant to go last April and re-scheduled. I don't know when they re-scheduled it - ie if the SA variant was known then.

For further info - they are financially very well off, my brother is high up in the Civil Service, and they own various properties. So while it would have surely been annoying for them to lose money, they could have well afforded it.

Since the pandemic started they have been on two holidays, in May/June they went to Croatia and in August they went to Poland.

We also had a big family holiday planned, we were meant to go to Jordan last Easter and had to cancel. We lost some money, but as far as I'm concerned, people in Jordan will be financially much more affected by the pandemic and loss of tourism, - and i won't go hungry - so I don't begrudge having lost some of the money. But, yes, if we had lost all the money, I would have been very upset.

OP posts:
JingsMahBucket · 08/02/2021 12:51

Thank you to you and your friend for sharing the phrase “This is a social maturity issue.” That perfectly sums this all up and would be an excellent basis for a host of research and scientific papers going forward!

Original poster
viktoria · 08/02/2021 13:17

MimosaField
I'm sorry you are in a similar family situation.
Thanks for your wise words.
Let's hope we can all go and visit our parents soon again.

OP posts:
unmarkedbythat · 08/02/2021 13:21

I've never thought that illegal necessarily means immoral, so I don't have any problem with thinking that just because something is legal that means it's right. I'd think he was being a selfish tosser and would likely say so.

Rewis · 08/02/2021 13:29

An 84 year old that hasn't been vaccinated yet? Where is your mum, that's very unusual?
That would be most of the world. Where I am, they haven't gotten to my 96yo grandmother yet.

I think the "it's legal" mentality is what got us into the mess. I doubt op was looking to do anyhting about it as in calling homeland security. Just being annoyed. Just because things are legal does not mean you should do it. However, if they are following the quarantine rules to the letter then it should be ok (going from airport to quarantine, no public transportation etc.)

BeakyWinder · 08/02/2021 13:31

@Rewis

An 84 year old that hasn't been vaccinated yet? Where is your mum, that's very unusual? That would be most of the world. Where I am, they haven't gotten to my 96yo grandmother yet.

I think the "it's legal" mentality is what got us into the mess. I doubt op was looking to do anyhting about it as in calling homeland security. Just being annoyed. Just because things are legal does not mean you should do it. However, if they are following the quarantine rules to the letter then it should be ok (going from airport to quarantine, no public transportation etc.)

Yes I assumed the OP's mum was in the UK, if you scroll up a pp corrected me and I acknowledged that.
MintyMabel · 08/02/2021 13:56

Anyone wi the half a brain understands that travelling anywhere for a holiday at this point is not a great idea

Anyone with half a brain knew that last summer. They still did it though.

Original poster
viktoria · 26/02/2021 09:27

Had a text from DB yesterday.
"We are back home. It was very nice. Everything went smoothly. Maybe we can speak on the phone tonight."
I replied saying "tonight is not good, maybe at the weekend" and then texted an update on my mum's vaccinations. To which he replied "thanks, yes, speak to you at the weekend."

And now I'm seriously considering unplugging our landline - he rarely calls my mobile.
I'm just not ready to talk to him. And I certainly don't want to hear about his holiday.
I know - that's childish, I'm a bit of a coward.

I think what I should do if he brings up the holiday is to say something along the lines of "I'm sorry, I don't want to hear about it".

What I think I might do when he starts telling me about his holiday - which no doubt he will as he talked very smugly about his Croatia holiday last spring - is to pretend that I'm having a food delivery.
Oh my goodness, I'm such an avoider... but maybe it's better sometimes to avoid talking about certain subjects?

OP posts:
ThePricklySheep · 26/02/2021 09:33

Before you do talk to him, have you looked at the recent covid cases in SA on worldometer or similar? They’re only 1600 a day.

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

Join Mumsnet Log In

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.