Is this Ageism? (Job Interview)

[ladylovesmilktray]

I recently interview for a job and just got this emailed response.

Thanks for interviewing with the team earlier this week for the above position. Unfortunately on this occasion we've decided to go with someone else for this role.

Although the team were really impressed with both your experience and the ideas you mentioned (particularly in regards to XXX), we've decided to go with someone who is more of a younger, up and coming voice which meets certain strategic organisational goals for us.

I am annoyed I ever went for the job and wish they hadn't shortlisted me in the first place though I imagine this could have been classed as discrimination.

AIBU to think this is overt age discriminination? Or I am just feeling sour grapes (and like a bitter old hag)?

If they meant the OP was out of touch they could have said "more modern" or something similar. They can try to argue younger doesn't refer to age but how likely is anyone to believe that?

If they meant the OP was out of touch they could have said "more modern" or something similar
They could, but not everyone is gifted in giving feedback appropriately. That's why I think it's worth being open to the fact that getting/not getting the job isn't necessarily down to age.

The person who wrote that email needs to be pulled up for it because it's a discriminatory and unprofessional email though.

@blobblob

We do need to know how old the OP is and how old the sucessful candidate is before saying that the OP has a case.

If the OP is 40 and they hired someone who is 46 then discrimination on the grounds of age is unlikely. (Also, how old were all the other shortlisted candidates? )

Well there is no way the OP can know the age of the successful candidate....although judging by the phraseology used in the email it is likely s/he was younger. If the OP chose to take it further, the ages of all the candidates would come out in any consequent investigation.

That is definitely ageism. I’d be calling ACAS and various employment solicitors for free consultations.

You could consider contacting the Equality Advisory Support Service for initial advise regarding this:

www.gov.uk/equality-advisory-support-service

Yes it is ageism.

I would contact ACAS for advise on what to do if you wish to take this further.

She has great, 'young' ideas as she is exposed to them and expected to come up with them.

That's still a discriminating view!

You indicate it by putting young in quotes. The whole point is implying that having a youthful view & approach is somehow better than another approach. This is typically held by someone who is, actually, young.

In your case, you're presenting your mum as an unusual case, as she is someone with young views, though she isn't.

Regardless, the email as was sent to OP is clearly discriminatory, in the context of a reason for not giving them the job.

I'm not usually one to find offence in things, I usually let things slide. But wow - this is clearly discrimination and I wouldn't be happy about this at all.

I cannot believe they actually put this in writing!

Definitely discrimination. Relative got made redundant a few years ago and missed out on a few opportunities due to his age. But they did at least have the foresight in feedback to say he was "over qualified and wouldn't find the job challenging enough". Same outcome, different approach.

What, precisely, is meant by a 'younger' view and ideas?

There are (plenty) situations where age discrimination is legal. I can't remember the exact context... don't think this is one of them, though.

@iklboo

Doesn't it depend how old you are whether age is a protected characteristic? How old are you op? I thought it was only over 40 that it was protected but don't know why I think that

Where did you come up with that? I hope nobody fed you this bullshit to try to use your age against you?

I'm not the poster who said that, but I was told the same thing in a two-day training course on the Equality Act. The trainer was insistent that age discrimination only applied to over 40s (certainly in an employment context, which was our focus). I thought that was a bit odd, but whether or not it's definitely true, it's certainly believed by some people who are supposed to be experts on this.

What an odd thing to tell you! How old are you?

ACAS advice on age discrimination in hiring practices.

advice from Unison.
It can be legal but ... minefield.

I just know that OP's story sounds like a perfect example of what would NOT be legal in my employer's compulsory video training programme (we have to repeat annually, zzzz)

@blobblob

We do need to know how old the OP is and how old the sucessful candidate is before saying that the OP has a case.

If the OP is 40 and they hired someone who is 46 then discrimination on the grounds of age is unlikely. (Also, how old were all the other shortlisted candidates? )

Unlikely, but there's also discrimination by perception... If they had assumed that the OP was older, it would still be discrimination. E.g. say if a 40yo looks older than her years and has a CV stretching back 20 years, but the successful 46yo not only looks much younger (Botox etc) but has a CV which makes her seem younger, like a degree completed recently followed by a few years of work experience.

I agree that would be unlikely and difficult to prove, though!

OP, I'm shocked they put this in writing, and I don't think it matters much that they said "a youthful voice" rather than literally "a younger person". That's like saying they hired someone with "a more masculine presence" - I don't think we'd be tying ourselves up in knots about whether they actually meant a butch woman; we'd see that as blatant sex discrimination. It would boils down to indirect discrimination anyway - of course younger people are going to be the ones generally considered to have youthful voices.

Yep. Are they a small company? I am shocked that they have been so blatant.

They are also extremely stupid to have put that In writing

Yep.

I can't believe someone was stupid enough to email you this feedback...the choice of candidate was purely based on age it seems.

Get legal advice and go for these idiots...

KerCHING!

You are in line for a payday!

Whatever you do, OP, and I would pursue this (probably starting with either CAB, ACAS or my union), do not alert the company. Just don't reply. They might respond retracting what they said, apologising for the poor wording and saying of course they didn't mean a younger person etc etc it was an intern who wrote it and it doesn't reflect company policy... If they were worried enough they might even withdraw the vacancy. This could weaken your position.

Was ready to say get over it.
My goodness though! I’m really surprised that they’d actually put that in writing.

Yes that is absolutely age discrimination - my god I can’t believe they actually put that in writing.

Actually - I know someone who got a fairly large payout from their company for less (age discrimination related - it wasn’t at all and he was a chancer, and the company just threw money at him to go away).

Thanks so much for all your posts and your practical advice. I'm 41. I'm worried about legal action as it's a small media company (about 6 staff). I wouldn't want to take any money from it. I feel like it's really out me off going for any jobs in this industry now as I'm not what they're looking for even four years after I last got a job in Media. How quickly do times change these days?!