Are parents becoming less employable?

[forinborin]

Backstory - I am a single parent with two small children at home (young primary age). I lost my old perm position in autumn (I did underperform and underdeliver during the first lockdown due to the children at home, so did not pass the review).

I was interviewing for a temp contracting position (way below my old career level, but at least something to cover the bills) on Friday - I thought the interview went quite well - but was asked to confirm this morning that I will have a quiet isolated place to work and to declare that there will be no interruptions to my schedule or competing responsibilities during the working hours. Obviously, I cannot commit at the moment to this in good faith.

Wondering whether this becomes the norm? Are parents, effectively, becoming less employable?

It's shit op, I can see why employers don't want to pay you to look after your kids instead of working but I don't understand what single parents are supposed to do?
There needs to be more government assistance for these situations.

@SweetPetrichor

It’s a nuisance but you can see why a company would ask. Especially since given the current job market, they can likely find a person with no childcare issues easy enough so why take the risk.

I can totally see that, the intention was not to complain, only to understand if it is the new normal (hopefully, temporary).

I also think many employers have suffered from the decreased productivity from parents over the last lockdown, so are now uber-careful. I know I did a very substandard job then, had to split my working time into early morning / late night "shifts" with looking after the children in between, and after a couple of weeks on that schedule my brains were like boiled cabbage. I would not have hired myself, knowing what I know now.

I'm finding call centres to be accomodating. Not ideal but you can earn great commisiion in some.
Only problem is you don't know which one until you start.
Obviously working from home now.
My ds says you have music in the background like you would in call centre.
Some of the women just log off to see to children and manage the 8 hours over say 10/12 hours.
Not ideal but keeps the wolf from the door.

I can see why you dont like it, you can't change it now, but it's a choice you made, not like you're being discriminated against for the colour of your skin.

I thinks it's perfectly reasonable for employers to hire someone who wont also be looking after kids while they're paid to work. Why would you choose the person that will be distracted over the person that wont? And it sounds like the job is one that needs you to be paying attention.

It’s tough but the proportion of the workforce who actually require childcare is actually pretty small, I remember being quite surprised when I read the stats. Makes sense though when you think about it. Most of the working age population would only require childcare for perhaps ten years out of a 40-45 year working life and most children have 2 parents. Add in the fact that there are a significant number of SAHP so childcare not required and the percentage of the workforce impacted by childcare is actually pretty small. It seems a massive issue on a site like this but in the wider world the percentages are smaller than you would think

I thought the interview went quite well - but was asked to confirm this morning that I will have a quiet isolated place to work and to declare that there will be no interruptions to my schedule or competing responsibilities during the working hours.

Yes this would disproportionately affect parents but not just parents - people with caring responsibilities to other family members, perhaps people living in house shares who don't have quiet, uninterrupted spaces to work etc. It is difficult but I can understand why employers would want their employees to be able to focus on work during working hours.

It's such a shit situation to be in, I'm so sorry you're having to deal with all the stress of it.

I can completely understand why employers don't want to hire mothers at the moment (because let's be honest, it is mainly women. Men are usually far too important to look after their own kids). We're great employees and have robust childcare in place and can be relied on but in a pandemic when childcare closes, it all goes to shit and we're not as productive - especially those of us who are single parents. Employers have a job that needs doing and targets to meet.

What's the answer? The government give working mothers money during school closures instead of employers paying wages? Fathers are forced to take flexible working and employers are forced to accept flexible working for fathers as well as mothers? That would help women in couples but not necessarily single parents, domestic abuse survivors, etc. I honestly don't know.

It's bloody unfair.

@Godimabitch re the choice thing - speaking personally, I made the decision to have kids 11 yrs ago, knowing that it is possible to work too, understanding that it may impact my career choices and would be expensive etc, but knowing that parents can and do frequently work. Nobody would choose to 'homeschool' (we aren't really homeschooling) and do a job at the same time!

Of course it does OP and I’m so sorry you’ve found yourself in this position. An absolute mess!

@Godimabitch what choice - having children? Surely you aren't suggesting all the people who have lost their jobs should've thought about a possible pandemic caused by an unpredictable killer virus - which is not similar to anything that has ever happened before in our lifetime - before deciding if they wanted children? The government have closed schools for the majority of children... where's the 'choice' in that?

Agree @heidipi I chose to send my child to a state provided school, and specifically NOT to homeschool him, as those are the choices in our country.

It depends on the level you are at. I work at a mid level of seniority where you need about 10 years of experience. Because I'm not competing against younger people, almost all my colleagues have children, mostly under 10. The year I had DS, in my team of 35, there were 7 babies. All of the born to people at my pay grade which was about 20 people within the team.

I think my manager may struggle, as she has been promoted relatively young and hasnt had kids yet, but most of her peers have older children so are past the age where they need as much time from you.

Certainly I think mothers are becoming less employable yes.

@Devlesko

I'm finding call centres to be accomodating. Not ideal but you can earn great commisiion in some. Only problem is you don't know which one until you start. Obviously working from home now. My ds says you have music in the background like you would in call centre. Some of the women just log off to see to children and manage the 8 hours over say 10/12 hours. Not ideal but keeps the wolf from the door.

Thanks for the idea - I will probably look for another month or two for jobs in my professional area but then will be open to anything as will run out of savings.

@Godimabitch

I can see why you dont like it, you can't change it now, but it's a choice you made, not like you're being discriminated against for the colour of your skin.

I thinks it's perfectly reasonable for employers to hire someone who wont also be looking after kids while they're paid to work. Why would you choose the person that will be distracted over the person that wont? And it sounds like the job is one that needs you to be paying attention.

I do understand, I am not crying about discrimination. I did make the voluntary choice to have children, but did not take into account all the adverse circumstances like schools being closed for almost a year (autumn was 50/50 attendance with bubbles bursting), that's true. I am just not sure what the options are now for me.

Yeah. I’m the only member of staff with school age children, the only member of staff who has had to request flexible working & who has become less productive due to school closures, & the only member of staff can’t take up the offer of overtime. I’m on a temp contract & don’t expect a permanent job will materialise at the end of it!

I'm not saying it's not shit, it is, of course it is. No one could have predicted a pandemic. But parents have always been less employable because your priorities are different, and I think men get less of this than women because, clearly from the threads on here, their priorities dont change as much.

I say this as a pregnant business owner who just hired a woman to work from home with a baby. But that's because, as a woman I've found it hard to hire men that dont decide they're the alpha of my office and start swinging their dick around and pissing on my furniture (perhaps an exageration) but it's a job where there's not a set amount of work to do and she gets paid for how long she works. I wouldn't have taken her on while paying her for a set number of hours because she cant guarantee she can work them.

@NoIDontWatchLoveIsland

It depends on the level you are at. I work at a mid level of seniority where you need about 10 years of experience. Because I'm not competing against younger people, almost all my colleagues have children, mostly under 10. The year I had DS, in my team of 35, there were 7 babies. All of the born to people at my pay grade which was about 20 people within the team.

I think my manager may struggle, as she has been promoted relatively young and hasnt had kids yet, but most of her peers have older children so are past the age where they need as much time from you.

I used to be in low-middle management (in a technical/stem area), but my peers seemed to be mainly men, and childcare for some reason wasn't even discussed / on the radar of my co-workers. I don't think anyone had a stay-at-home wives in the traditional sense, but I think there usually was much more flexibility on the mothers' side.

Now, obviously, looking for all options.

@Godimabitch , I do understand, as I said - I probably would not have hired myself in the current situation. Or rather, I would have hired myself, but not someone I don't know and whose work ethics I am not familiar with. Totally rational.

If the role was permanent, I'm sure many companies would be able to take the long term view that this is the pandemic and a short term drop in performance because of children is acceptable.

But this is for a 3 month temporary contract. The role has presumably been scoped out to take that long, and costed accordingly. They know that the pandemic may cause childcare issues for parents for the length of the contract and are therefore covering their backs. At least they are being clear that you need to be able to commit to actually working full time for the length of the contract, that's not an unreasonable ask for such as short term contract

Maybe they are doing it because they want to avoid women taking on all the homeschooling/supervising duties because the children's dad is the higher earner / doesn't want to do it / his work doesn't allow it.
In other words, the employer is saying that they are not ok to take the hit for the other parent's employer.

OP, in your case it is a bit different as you are a single parent: could you get a place at school? A friend of mine is a single parent and works full time but not key worker and she was given a space.

Yes they are. Specifically mothers are less employable. It’s been well-documented.

In this case, it’s a 3 month contract so I can see why the employer wasn’t willing to take a long term view. I’m still not 100% convinced it’s lawful though, it’s clearly indirect discrimination (because single parents are overwhelmingly likely to be female).

LOL at it being a choice you made. No parents of a school age child had even heard the words ‘Covid’ or ‘lockdown’ when they decided to become parents. Being a single parent often isn’t a choice, either.

There’s a massive skills drain when women at the age/level of experience typical for having children, leave the work force, even under normal circumstances.

I think employers who have a long term, less blinkered view and who are prepare to be flexible, can really tap in to this workforce.

I work in a skills shortage area where some sexist, inflexible bosses make it almost impossible for women to return to work after children... so these women locum for £££ instead and bosses grumble they can’t find experienced permanent staff.

OP, in your case it is a bit different as you are a single parent: could you get a place at school? A friend of mine is a single parent and works full time but not key worker and she was given a space.
Unfortunately no, our school is already running at half the capacity, or thereabouts.

Are parents, effectively, becoming less employable?

No. Don't generalise your personal experience to everyone. Millions upon millions of people have not suddenly become less employable.