To think this is discrimination or at least unfair?

[Sweet666]

So today the manager at work told us we can only speak English unless we are explaining the work... not allowed to chat basically except in English. So people who can talk good English are allowed to have chats all day but if you can't speak English then you're not allowed to have a chat. I think this is wrong and unfair. Why should you have to be silent all day if you can't speak English but if you are English or speak good English then you're allowed to chat as much as you want?
4

[Sometimeswinning]

You all sit separately? Is that not an issue worth raising? Or do you choose that for yourself so it's ok??

In my job it would be a huge issue people not speaking english (In England and communication is key.

What happens if your colleagues need to get help for themselves, friends and family? Knowing the language of the country you live in is so important.

[WoolieLiberal]

I think context is important here.

If everyone can speak English then it can be rude for those with other languages to start chatting in front of others in another language as you’re excluding them.

[Baycob]

@Sweet666

And no we can't teach English because we need Romanian to teach English like if we say 'this in English' means ' this in Romanian' we can't say 'this in Romanian' because its not explaining the work
I've never seen this problem before in any job in England. We have Romanian supervisors and Polish supervisors... All my jobs here has been the same, some of my jobs in England even had only Romanian speakers like jobs in fields it is usually Romanian people and Romanian supervisor. The boss knew a lot of people can't speak English when he gave them a job

Sorry, but this is not true.

I taught English in a European country where I did speak the language and I was told explicitly not to use the native language. Anything they said, I replied in English. It’s called immersion.

Also, if you are working in a county who’s native language is not your own you should learn the language ( at least to a basic level ) . And on the new immigration policy ( points system) English to a certain level is needed. So the employer might be doing them a favour.

On the other hand, the job sounds repetitive. Therefore if I were you I would lobby for your colleagues and ask for language lessons. In language lessons grammar is better taught by someone who speaks English and conversation by and English native speaker.

It’s about safety and also about working as team. You might not be gossiping about those who don’t speak your language, but non- speakers of your language don’t know that and it can cause a lot of animosity.

Do your colleagues want to learn English, and if not, why not ?

[CherryRoulade]

SchrodingersImmigrant No they really can’t unless it impedes your ability to do your job. It doesn’t matter if someone else can’t understand or feels uncomfortable. It matters that anyone can communicate in whichever language they choose unless it impacts on performance.
In my example, there is no impact of two Spanish nurses discussing, say an off duty rota, in Spanish. It’s illegal discriminate and tell them they can’t speak in their first language except where it can be shown to reduce their performance.

[deragod]

How do you know which language is spoken at Lidl? This thread, as usual, would be fantastic for introduction to postcolonial studies.

[AKissAndASmile]

@LakeGeneva

Yeah it's discrimination. For people saying "you need to speak the language of the country you're in", how many of the English chavs in eg Dubai speak Arabic?

That said, if you're in a marginal group then your options are limited.

@LakeGeneva they're EX-PATS, not chavs. And certainly not immigrants. It's different when it's English people.

[MiddlesexGirl]

If you teach ESOL you absolutely do not speak in the learner's native language. For a start there can be ten or more different languages in your class.
You start with objects and gesture.

[PlanDeRaccordement]

This is discrimination. For idle chat between colleagues the workplace cannot dictate what language you use. They can only dictate that you speak English (or whatever the local language is) when speaking to customers or to colleagues regarding work/professional matters.

[MiddlesexGirl]

Not strictly true Plan.
Case law doesn't always support this so could be a costly exercise to try to enforce.

[PlanDeRaccordement]

The Acas guide Race discrimination: key points for the workplace warns employers to be wary of prohibiting or limiting the use of other languages in the workplace as it could potentially be discriminatory:
“Managing languages at work

The increased movement of people around the world means it can be quite common for organisations to employ staff from many different countries or ethnic backgrounds. As a result, there may be employees for whom English is not their first language. Often, there may be a number of employees who originate from the same country or share a common language which is not English.

However, an employer:

can specify a language of operation, usually English, for business reasons. However, in Wales some jobs require the holder to speak both English and Welsh

can insist on recruiting a job candidate who has skills in English necessary for the job, but it must not select based on assumptions about race, nationality, or ethnic or national origins. Again, in Wales some jobs require the holder to have skills in both English and Welsh necessary for the job

should be wary of prohibiting or limiting the use of other languages within the workplace unless they can justify this with a genuine business reason.”

A race discrimination claim succeeded in the case of Jurga v Lavendale Montessori Ltd, in part, because Polish-speaking employees were reprimanded for speaking Polish to each other in their breaks while Italian colleagues were able to speak Italian during breaks without objection.

Equally, in the 2012 case of Dziedziak v Future Electronics Ltd, the Employment Appeal Tribunal (EAT) found that an instruction given by a manager to an employee not to speak in her own language (Polish) at work was direct race discrimination on the grounds of her nationality.

[MiddlesexGirl]

Yep. Justification with a genuine business reason is often used.
The Polish/Italian one is clearly discrimination.
My point is these cases are not always successful and the situation OP has described could possibly lead to management being able to justify the requirement.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

Dziedziak was the same. Other nationalities weren't told not to use their language. I think this was the polish colleague complaining about the polish language actually?
.

[Casschops]

Some of the nurses where I work part of the week are from Kerala in India. They speak Malayalam among each other but speak English too. Nobody bats an eyelid. I'm sure if I were not in my birth country and far away from home and I met others who could speak my mother tongue I'd use that too as well as speaking the language of the country I'm in.

[CherryRoulade]

Casschops. Very well put.

[contrmary]

It's not discrimination to demand people speak English only if there workplace is in England. There is an argument to allow Welsh or Gaelic in Scotland and Wales unrespectively. Permitting people to use other languages that not everyone understands is discrimination, because it excludes those who only speak English.

[Hoppinggreen]

Total immersion is a very good way to learn a language.
DH arrived here aged 10 with 3 words of English. His native language was banned in the house and within 6 weeks he started a UK school with no extra support at all
I have taught foreign languages to children and that was mostly by immersion too. Even people who have learnt a foreign language at school only usually become fluent when they live in that country use it every day, I know within a few days of arriving somewhere I speak the language my ability increases massively

[MrsPinkCock]

Like @MiddlesexGirl says, there are supporting cases either way.

It can theoretically be discrimination if the reason directly relates to race (which it rarely does), or if the act of asking an employee to refrain from speaking their native language amounts to an act of racial harassment.

On the other hand, if speaking English is a requirement applied across the board, and such a requirement can be justified by the employer, then it won’t amount to legal discrimination.

[maddening]

Surely. If they want integration then the people should not be physically segregated, that would give those who struggle with their english more opportunity to learn.

[Fi57]

You’re in the uk, our language is English so if you want to work here then you need to be able to speak it.
You can speak whatever language you want outside of work.

[DicklessWonder]

@Fi57

You’re in the uk, our language is English so if you want to work here then you need to be able to speak it.
You can speak whatever language you want outside of work.

This is not the case outside of England. Just FYI.

[SweetPetrichor]

It seems a bit petty and unfair, but I don't know what the laws are around it.

It's very British and depressing to hear all the 'you're in England, speak English' coming from British people who go on their foreign holidays and expect to be conversed with in English. We are a nation of lazy linguists complaining about others for not being good enough.

[soundofsilence1]

The law is not 100% clear but it appears it can be justified providing that

' there grounds required for justifying the request; and any policy outlined needs to ensure that the requirements are clearly outlined and are supported by non-discriminatory practices and are therefore applied consistently across the business. Employers should also consider their role in ensuring that their employees are given the adequate communication tools to be able to comply with any policy requests'.

www.lawatwork.co.uk/news-views/can-employer-insist-its-employees-speak-only-english-work-21-05-2020

[changingmine]

This is ruled as discrimination in my country. Everyone is allowed to speak their own language.

[Stompythedinosaur]

You’re in the uk, our language is English so if you want to work here then you need to be able to speak it.
You can speak whatever language you want outside of work.

This is such a simplistic understanding of a more complex issue. I wonder how many people would say this if they had a better grasp of how it is to speak multiple languages?

My experience is that people who say things like this don't speak other languages at all, even when in that country.