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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask for the positives and negatives of Brexit now it’s happened

79 replies

Butterflyfluff · 17/01/2021 12:25

I haven’t put this in the Brexit section as it’s the same old faces in there

I was looking for more ‘everyday’ opinions

I’ve read / heard about

  • VAT charges on goods imported from the EU since 1/1/21
  • shortages of certain items in supermarkets, especially in Northern Ireland
  • chaos in the fishing industry

There doesn’t seem to be much of an upside - even ‘taking back control’ seems a distant dream as it looks to me like we’ve got years to come of negiotiating all sorts with the EU

What have we gained from Brexit?

And what other problems are there that people have experienced so far

OP posts:
yearinyearout · 17/01/2021 13:33

I couldn't get an aubergine for my moussaka, I was pretty upset about that.

x2boys · 17/01/2021 13:34

My mum moved to Spain for a year in the early 60,s and worked there .

Butterflyfluff · 17/01/2021 13:37

You don't really want to hear any benefits do you op

No, I really do want to hear them, anything to be honest

It just seems that there aren’t any to speak of - just another raft of excuses

OP posts:
Darklingthrush · 17/01/2021 14:30

My mum moved to Spain for a year in the early 60,s and worked there
And your point is? The world has moved on somewhat in 60 years and it will be a lot harder since Brexit for UK citizens to fine employment in the EU. It is much easier for an EU employer to employ an EU citizen - why bother with all the hassle of employing a British citizen for a short term contract?

TheGreatWave · 17/01/2021 14:39

@x2boys

My mum moved to Spain for a year in the early 60,s and worked there .
And that is where the issues lie, people harking on about days gone by and how things were fine before we joined, but the world has moved on, we can't go back to how things were. What people are wanting is some rose tinted version of the past, the good old days when life was wonderful and rather than acknowledge that the UK has done a spectacular job of destroying itself, but it is easier to blame all that on the EU.
AethelsWhiteGoose · 17/01/2021 14:46

It’s okay, we have our special friendship with Trump and the USA.... oh

Sinful8 · 17/01/2021 14:49

@ludothedog

For me it's about what we have lost. In my 20ies I moved to Spain and lived and worked there for over a decade. I had so much fun, learned so much and had my DD. I'm so sad that this opportunity has been taken from her.
Jesus how low are your expectations for your DD she can't get a work visa in your world?
Darklingthrush · 17/01/2021 14:51

Jesus how low are your expectations for your DD she can't get a work visa in your world?
It's not just about getting a visa, it's about finding a job, it's about competing for jobs on a level playing field. We are making it so much harder for our children to work in the EU.

SendMeHome · 17/01/2021 14:52

@Pukkatea @NoGoodPunsLeft Yep; they’re looking at getting rid of the Working Time Directive, which includes the right to be paid for holidays and the maximum working hours in a week, according to the FT.

All presumably hidden behind some bravado about giving millions of people half a vaccine and Brexit being out of the oven.

AethelsWhiteGoose · 17/01/2021 14:53

The UK fishing industry has lost an estimated £1 million in the first two weeks since brexit but Rees Mog says not too worry cause the fish are happy!

Yes that’s the same Rees Mog who moved his company to Ireland Wink

Judashascomeintosomemoney · 17/01/2021 14:54

@Butterflyfluff

You don't really want to hear any benefits do you op

No, I really do want to hear them, anything to be honest

It just seems that there aren’t any to speak of - just another raft of excuses

Hopefully there’s about to be a positive. The banning of live exports from Ramsgate (think this only applies to England and Wales, unsure if Scotland and NI will follow). It’s a local issue and I sincerely hope it succeeds. It’s currently going through the consultation period (which was controversial in itself as there was hope it wouldn’t need consultation as it was a Brexit’promise’), which is due to finish on January 21st. That’s been brought forward a week or so, so hopefully there’s going to be good news.
Blacktothepink · 17/01/2021 15:02

Totally agree The GreatWave

Tazers · 17/01/2021 15:03

i speak as someone whose Eastern European immigrant parents - and many of their friends - managed to move to the UK long before Freedom of Movement was in place. FoM really isn't the be all and end all. People can still travel work and live in other countries, even if you have to jump through a few more hoops

It's been made easier to get a skilled worker visa too. The minimum salary has been reduced to £20,600. This applies to potential immigrants from everywhere in the world, which is fairer.

ancientgran · 17/01/2021 15:05

I got my backside in gear and got my Irish passport. My GC are horrified that any future GC will have a right to Irish citizenship and they don't. It didn't seem important when we were in the EU so I never got round to it before. So I suppose that is a positive and a negative?

Tazers · 17/01/2021 15:08

@ludothedog

For me it's about what we have lost. In my 20ies I moved to Spain and lived and worked there for over a decade. I had so much fun, learned so much and had my DD. I'm so sad that this opportunity has been taken from her.
In my 20s I moved to Sydney and Hong Kong, I had so much fun and learned so much. There was no freedom of movement between the U.K. and Aus and HK, I had to get a visa but it wasn't a difficult process.

Your children will now need to jump through a few hoops to live and work abroad but as long as they aren't criminals or are planning on living off the local welfare system, then they can still go and live and work abroad.

SerendipityJane · 17/01/2021 15:11

41 posts in, and how many positives ?

Darklingthrush · 17/01/2021 15:18

Tazers- I'm sorry but you are totally missing the point. A lot of young people do not have the money to get jobs in HK or Australia- the fact that you did, suggests that you were/are better off than most. It's funny how all the pro-leave supporters on this thread describe getting a visa as "jumping through a few hoops". Its really not that simple. I moved to the EU as a teenager to look for work with very little money, just enough to pay to stay in a hostel while I looked for work. I couldn't have risked going further and wouldn't have been able to pay the air fare to go further afield. For a lot of young people FOM meant the chance to travel abroad that previously had only been available to the wealthy. That is what we are going back to - the experience of working or studying abroad is once again only for the privileged few.

LillianGish · 17/01/2021 15:25

Interesting that no-one can come up with a single a upside - starting vaccinations doesn't count because that has nothing to to with the EU. Telling people they'll have to wait 50 years to feel any benefit doesn't really wash either. Covid is a convenient smokescreen for this government that is keeping the inconveniences of Brexit off the front pages.

SerendipityJane · 17/01/2021 15:32

Just "getting a visa" is not the same as having the intrinsic freedom of movement to travel around the EU and work. As a non-EU citizen you now have to get the company hiring you to show they were unable to hire an EU citizen first, before they dish out a work visa.

CutToChase · 17/01/2021 15:40

It's a bit disingenuous to say that not being part of the EU has had no effect on the UK's vaccine programme.

There was a scandal with France slowing down purchasing of more vaccines because they wanted more Sanofi vaccines (French) to be bought instead of more Pfizer (German). Germany conceded (whilst also buying more vaccines on their own in a side deal), and this is one of the reasons why there will be a delay here where I am (France). I will be getting the vaccine much later than my friends in the UK are estimated to get it.

Personally I voted Remain and then left once the results of the referendum came through. Now five years on though, my views have softened, possibly as a result of being in a region of the country that votes Front National - my in laws for example would all vote for a Frexit if that were an option.

On balance I would still vote Remain and I'm pissed off that Brexit has fucked up my own red tape and situation. Ultimately though as someone who has worked in many countries outside the EU, and having checked what I would need to do if I wanted to go to another EU country outside France, the hoops arent that difficult to jump through - I know its unpopular and goes against the "they've banned us from ever exploring the world" narrative, but it's true.

In France for example, there were a lot of things already in place pre Brexit that make it pretty difficult to get work without being French, unless you are highly specialised or work for a multinational (in which case you wont have problems post Brexit) or go into English teaching. In fact with the latter, you cant even rock up and teach in state schools the way you can in the UK - you have to sit the "concours", a series of very competitive and academic written exams, which effectively bars many non French applicants from entry as they are heavily geared towards the academic logic and mindset that French people start developing in primary school. That's why many native English speakers end up working for private schools, or on short term year by year contracts, unless they are very motivated and throw themselves into studying for the concours.

Anyway I'm digressing but the point is I dot think FoM is too much of a disaster, especially since I think we will have another two years of posturing before the UK is quietly assimilated under the same rules as Norwegian and Swiss citizens seeking to move around

The UK has a huge number of faults, like all countries, and can be a harsh place to live - I'm thinking particularly of disgustingly low protection for tenants and low wage workers. However the UK had always been a business minded country and one with a flexible and supple bureaucracy, plus a forward thinking outlook in terms of business affairs. With that in mind, I think they will make Brexit work. It's just obvious to me that as with any major change, you wont see those benefits immediately.

CremeEggThief · 17/01/2021 15:42

There are no positives. It's stupid to think otherwise.

StonedRoses · 17/01/2021 15:42

We’ve got happier fish apparently now
And blue passports

It’s all about sovereignty innit

Tazers · 17/01/2021 15:46

@Darklingthrush

Have you heard of Working Holiday visas?

StrictlyAFemaleFemale · 17/01/2021 15:47

The value of the pound has dropped so I can pay off my student loan quicker.

Tazers · 17/01/2021 15:49

@Darklingthrush

You may want to research how many Brits go to Aus and NZ on both a temporary and permanent basis. The numbers are higher than those who go to the EU.

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