To think that a solicitor is not a key worker?

[Sandiepatterson]

Grrr, three sets of parents at our school are solicitors. Not family lawyers dealing with courts but plain old private client wills and trust lawyers. They most definitely could WFH but no, they've ALL sent their kids to school.
AIBU to think they are being unreasonable?

My own probate solicitor is working harder than he ever has and is now having to attend at hospitals from time to time etc.
I’m at the bar so am a key worker - crime - and almost everything even court of appeal and prison conferences etc are able to be remote or at least hybrid.
Most family/child protection cases too. But exceptions where eg a client is deaf or blind or some cases with interpreters or where special measures are in place to protect witnesses etc etc present real challenges.
Probate solicitors are currently dealing with huge workload and many wholly unexpected unorganised intestate situations etc.
Think it’s right lawyers are key workers.
Know lawyers not even at home but relocated and home set up is not suitable for online court hearings.

And the Govt need to address this
Part of the rise is due to inflexible employers
It’s not acceptable
It’s short sighted
It’s going to prolong the economic damage ultimately

The OP should not that it isn't ALL solicitors who are classed as key workers, but only certain ones depending on what they specialise in. There are some aspects of law, wills and probate being one of them, that are currently critical work being carried out by key workers.

[quote FreeButtonBee]@VanGoghsDog I've had the same nanny since my youngest was 8 months and he's now 5 and a half. Norland trained actually and although we were moving towards school run/homework/tea plus full time in the holidays (with her enthusiastic agreement as she has other part time work in school hours) we went back to paying her 3/4 of full time salary so that she is on retainer to drop everything and do full time hours when there is no school. She did only 3 full days before Christmas but will be full time now until schools return. Her other job is SE and can't be done during lock down.

She's still a nanny even if she is part time and frankly my very tricky 5yo needs just as much input as he did at 3 (although less likely to throw himself under a moving car these days!).

But that was a lucky happenstance of timing and there are many people who either can't afford a nanny or let theirs go once their youngest started FT school. We had a chance to keep her part time and it's been life saving from a work perspective (if a lot more expensive than I hoped for childcare at this point in my children's lives!). But they go to state school so at least I'm not paying private school fees on top![/quote]
It was only your comment about keeping her on at great expensive that I was questioning. It seems like you had a lucky bit of timing.

The other poster suggested it was just someone doing teatime and school runs, which generally isn't a nanny. And as a Chiltern trained nanny myself (actually) I do feel fairly well qualified to make that comment.

Make sacrifices , be flexible , work remotely , use technology

I'm doing all of these yet there are still some elements of my job where i can't really have a 6 year old interrupting me regularly. Luckily our school agrees.

Not all jobs have infinite flexibility.

I saw your examples and have zero desire to get into a vitriolic spat with you, believe it or not

"I saw your examples and have no answer to the very good points you made, so will bluster on and hope no-one notices"

Fixed that for you, @Thisisworsethananticpated

This thread is amusing me because op is taking on solicitors in a battle about key worker spaces - solicitors are trained to win arguments

Court is still on going. You can't have a six year old interrupting a court hearing. Imagine.
A solicitor was recently told off by the judge for drinking out of a mug!

HelloThereMeHearties
Meh 😑

"This thread is amusing me because op is taking on solicitors in a battle about key worker spaces - solicitors are trained to win arguments"

but not to win arguments on mumsnet.

Does anyone ‘win’ by arguing on MN, I think not.

People still need wills - more than ever, you could argue! If you needed to have some important legal work done, would you trust someone who is also trying to look after a young child to carry that work out without any mistakes?!

would you trust someone who is also trying to look after a young child to carry that work out without any mistakes?!

How do you think everyone else manages ? Accountants , commercial lawyers , estimators etc

I’ve never heard the like

Many jobs cannot be done properly with a child around and if a child is there people may die because a mistake might be made. if I get a word in the wrong place in a document potentially millions of pounds are lost. I am not doing anything with children around ever and spent £30k a year on childcare where I needed to. Now they are students so I am not in the same position but I do want all schools reopened ASAP for the sake of women and children never mind the old who need our tax revenues to pay their pensions and NHS costs.

YANBU but you have taken on the profession with THE highest opinion of itself and its incontrovertible worth so good luck!

How do you think everyone else manages ? Accountants , commercial lawyers , estimators etc

There was recently a thread expressing surprise at some accountants having key worker status.

YANBU but you have taken on the profession with THE highest opinion of itself and its incontrovertible worth so good luck!

She hasn’t ‘taken on’ anyone. She’s completely uninformed. As has been pointed out umpteen times on the thread, some solicitors - a fairly small minority of them - are classed as critical workers. This includes wills and probate solicitors. You and the OP may not think that they should be entitled to critical worker status, but the government disagrees with you (and has done since the beginning of the pandemic - they aren’t a new addition to the list).

The rest of the profession - I have no idea of the actual statistics, but I would hazard a guess at 90% or more - are not classed as critical workers and have to juggle homeschooling/childcare/work just like everyone else.

Some are, some aren’t. Unless you know their specialisation, it’s impossible to know.

I’m a criminal defence (duty) solicitor. My kids are in school. I would love to be able to work from home but unfortunately the very large magistrates court in my area is woefully set up for defence to access remotely. CPS can, probation can, but not defence.

Everyone else gets socially distanced spaces- we still have to speak to clients in custody in small boxes, with chairs bolted to the floor less than a metre apart, often for half an hour or so.

Even if I could work from home it would not be possible with young children. The court simply would not allow interruptions from children, and I certainly couldn’t attend a telephone (recorded) interview with children around. Confidentiality extends to not having children in the room, and the language and lifestyles they’d have to listen to is wholly inappropriate.

I’m not minted either. I work in legal aid so despite being rather good at my job I earn less than pretty much every other professional I know. It’s not a job you do for the money.

I know I’m a key worker because my work IS essential. Criminals don’t stop committing crimes and the government has decided that courts will run cases as usual. Not my decision. I have no idea if other solicitors carry out essential work because I don’t do their job, obviously. Interesting that so many people seem so clear about what solicitors do though.

I'm reminded of when some years ago now I had to explain to the not too bright staff at my DCs school that if I was at court or dealing with a telephone hearing I would NOT be available to respond immediately to their queries, and no I couldn't just put the court on hold to speak to them

I suspect that same type of people are posting on this thread incredulous at the idea that some lawyers might be classed as keyworkers, or that all lawyers aren't all 'fat cats" on 6 and 7 figure salaries!

Fwiw any comments I made earlier only applied to Soliciter within the assumed context raised by OP
I do totally get that a child protection case cannot be carried out with fortnite/screaming kids in the background

Having said all of this I was in a remote hearing last week where the judge had what was pretty clearly a delivery which she had to buzz in. It’s been tricky sometimes ensuring signed for items or deliveries don’t interrupt hearings let alone children pets etc. Have seen it all on screen recently !

I am a solicitor (not wills/probate). The guidance from the Law Society is clear to me. Any solicitor CAN be a keyworker when they need to appear in court/tribunal. Criminal and wills/probate lawyers are keyworkers all of the time.

Wills and probate work has gone through the roof and a lot of clients are elderly/vulnerable/don't use zoom (etc) so meetings need to be conducted away from the solicitor's home. Contrary to public opinion, most solicitors are quite reasonable and sensible people and I'm sure wouldn't be taking a school place unless necessary. Everyone I know in my practice area (employment) is trying to get on with WFH with small people around - working earlier, later and longer - and they are burning out. The consequences of getting it wrong are serious, both for us and our clients, but they aren't taking school places for their children.

YABVU.

"Any solicitor CAN be a keyworker when they need to appear in court/tribunal. Criminal and wills/probate lawyers are keyworkers all of the time. "

I think that must be right.

thisisworsethananticipated Same applies to wills though hence them explicitly being on keyworker list. Taking instructions from elderly or ill client, assessing capacity etc all can’t be done with kids interrupting plus logistics of getting wills validly executed in covid. Hospital/urgent home visit wills are not unusual even in normal times. I won’t even get into how the OP knows exactly what people vaguely acquainted with do. In mumsnet land everyone is married and organised and probably just took a few emails to do straight forward mirror wills in a none urgent timeframe. Real life is very different. Not a wills solicitor but seen enough scenarios working in an office where colleague did. Contentious probate is a massive growth area - fuck it up and all sorts of ramifications.