to not volunteer for St John's Ambulance?

[MaMaLa321]

I applied to be a steward at our local Covid vaccination centre - basically standing around in the cold, showing people where to go.
My online application form arrived yesterday, and my heart sank when I saw that it had eight sections. But I gamely started, telling them why I wanted to do it, and why I would be good at doing it.
Then I found two references.
Then I was asked for my employment and volunteering history. I've been retired for several years, and , before that, had several jobs. I really don't see why that information is needed.
Then of course, the gender, ethnicity, 'do I fully identify as the gender I was assigned at birth' and which religion I identify as.
Just to steward people around.
So, I've given up. It just seems utterly disproportionate to me.

Standard, even to volunteer. Go for it!

That sounds shorter than most TBH!

Of course they need that sort of information. They want a smaller number of volunteers who will actually be reliable and have the necessary skills. They also need to have done some basic checks to ensure you are who you say you are, and not a danger.

@NoOneOwnsTheRainbow

Genuine questions
What is degrading or intrustive/or unessarey about filling in application form for volunteering work then??

Even in my Local Job Centre they have the same respect/value for people who do volunteer work as paid work.!!

Why do you or some people do not think Volunteering work deserves the same respect/Consideration and safguards in place to protect potential volunteers aswell as the general public like yourself, as paid work of any kind does?
Just Curious /and Confused why you feel this way,

As I have done loads of volunteer work for charities such as fundraising etc ..

Even crappy min wage jobs have a 6page form .It's good they're checking people out, but honestly , everything seems so mega slow here, when Israel is doing 24/7 vaccinations, wirh absolutely no problem. And yes Boris , I would turn up at 8pm for a jab. What is it they say? 'Assume' makes an ass out of you & me.

Yeah I wouldn't be arsed to chase references etc.

Have you thought about what you might actually be dealing with as a marshal in these conditions? Very anxious or confused people, people with physical or mental health issues. People may have a bad reaction to the vaccine or an anxiety attack and collapse and you need to know what to do. They need to know you can learn, take direction, be reliable (do you fancy telling everyone you can't do any vaccinations today because the volunteer coordinator hasn't turned up?), be safe. It is nationally vital work affecting people's health. If they didn't have high standards they'd be downright irresponsible.

Teeing up my references took about 90 seconds and two WhatsApps. But again, if you can't be bothered with it, no one is making you.

Ex SJA volunteer.

This is probably a standard form. The organisation would have been busy this year, as with all medical organisations. It's unlikely that Covid volunteer roles are treated any differently from the usual first aid work (I haven't researced this, I welcome any feedback on how they are actually doing this).

As PP said, SJAs work revolves around working vith vulnerable people and the safeguarding concepts are strict.
If you see someone leant over a child in a first aid uniform, touching them, removing outer clothing, you wouldn't look twice like you might any other adult, would you? Add in the youth arm of the organisation, then it would be a goldmine for the wrong sort of people.

Maybe for this role references and pages applications look extreme, but it is logical for this type of volunteer work.

I understand what you mean, it does sound like a long form for a temporary, well supervised role. And just because you don’t like/aren’t skilled at writing doesn’t mean that you wouldn’t be an excellent steward.

But I think you do have to see it from the charity’s point of view well. As well as wanting to safeguard people and behave ethically, they will be terrified of a scandal if something goes wrong. Look at what happened to OXFAM when the news broke about the staff member acting unethically in Haiti. They have lost thousands if not millions in donations and are so less able to do their work.

With regard to the employment and volunteering history, I would just sum up my previous employment (in fact, I am self-employed but would say what line of work I'd been doing) and any volunteering must be relevant, surely? With regard to what "gender" I identify as having/being and ethnicity, I just put that I prefer not to answer those questions - I've never had anyone refuse to accept a form I put that on, as the first question is personal and not something you are forced to tell everyone if you don't want to and the ethnicity question is a racist and divisive question in itself, to my mind. So the lattertwo questions seem inappropriate for stewarding, in my opinion. If they interview you, they can assess whether you have commonsense and empathy, can follow instructions and are able to deal appropriately with any situation that might arise. Filling in a bit of paper isn't going to tell them.

@MaMaLa321

Ask yourself if you were a staff member who's role it was to recruit potential volunteers like yourself

How would you try to ensure that you attract potential volunteers who would be Capable enough/have the right(work ethic) attitude for the particular role expected of them and ensure they have the right ethos ,for charitable work etc??
As you need them to respect safeguards put in place to protect themselves and the general public as you definately do not want any potential avoidable accidents happening/and lawsuits cause volunteer endangering themselves or public
Or how do you try to prevent ensure you don't make mistake of having a thief working for your charity then?
Or a sick child abuser working for your Charity then?
Or a potential volunteer who sabotage stuff a,s Nasty to people if he/she does not like listening to any instructions and thinks they know better than yourself or anybody else about this role working for charity?

How do you as chief recruitment officer for staff/volunteers stop prevent these Nightmare kinds of situations from happening then??

Op Rember your Reputation and your Charity Reputation is on the line if anything goes seriously wrong especially if Newspapers find out they have a field day...

@MaMaLa321

I can assure you that I would have been committed to do this. It's just that I'm not committed to fill in a long and intrusive form to satisfy the bureaucracy. I would understand if it was a different role, but I'm not going to recreate my CV for this, and that's just a start.

Those are standard questions on most job forms now, what part is degrading?

Whilst I have some sympathy that the op might have been out of touch with modern day recruitment practices, the time she spent kvetching about this, she could have filled the form in several times over and saved herself a lot of angst and misplaced indignation into the bargain.

Sometimes I think people want to say they’ve volunteered but not actually put in the leg work to volunteer. Managing queues is actually pretty hard work and I’ve done it as a paid position for festivals etc.
I think having a form to fill in is the easy bit!

I would have more time for these sorts of forms if they actually worked and sorted out the wheat from the chaff. Unfortunately in my experience all it does is filter out the ones who are good at bullshit and creative writing.

It's utterly frustrating and entirely pointless to have such a long winded form. NHS and council ones are the worst, it's like submitting submitting a university thesis on why you love their (usually awful) services. By all means check work history and ID, but I can't go in for all these elaborate questions that mean nothing.

Source: HR work sorting through application forms. Despite these types of forms we still ended up with often entirely useless people. (I didn't pick them!)

@Orf1abc

Hundreds of thousands of people signed up to volunteer in March/ April, but when it came to actually doing anything, only a small number stepped up. This is the same, if you can't be bothered to complete the form, chances are you won't be particularly committed to the role.

This. ^

Loads of people are all mouth and trousers, and the OP sounds like same. Wants the glory of being a volunteer (and no doubt to crow about it,) but can't be arsed to even fill in the form.

It's a bit like when something (bad) happens in your life, and people say 'if there's anything you need just let me know.' But if/when you DO ask, they umm and ahh, and make excuses to not help.

My (widowed) friend in her late 60s, was moving house several years ago, and a man she knew (an old colleague in his mid 40s,) said 3 or 4 times, 'when you get your moving date, let me know.' He worked in a factory and said he will get a bunch of boxes from work, and help her pack, and also help her move house, (in the van he had.)

So she took him on his word, and on 4th May 2018, she got her date for moving... 18th May 2018, (just 2 weeks notice.) She rang him, and asked if could get the boxes, and come help her.

He said he was off work for the next 2 weeks, and he and his wife were going away for 2 weeks tomorrow, so he wouldn't be able to do it. 'Call 'man with a van' he said cheerily. They'll help!

This woman I know was gutted. She was 100% depending on him to help her pack, and move house. To add insult to injury, she saw him in one of the city shopping centres 2 days later, so it was clearly a lie that he and his wife had gone away. She also rang his workplace the next day, and asked for him, and they said he isn't in til 2pm. So he wasn't on leave either!

She shouldn't have depended on him so much IMO, but still, this is just an example of how many people are all talk...

As has been said, re; the OP. Of COURSE the people looking for volunteers have to check people thoroughly. Just as if it's a paid role. Why wouldn't they?

OP I had the same experience. I was unable to log back in to complete the form after finding references so it got lost. I have chased it up but heard nothing as yet.

Same experience with a local volunteer hub - hours on online training including trafficking and how to lift loads safely. Every volunteer had to complete it regardless of role. They’ve recently contacted me to update their list of availability but that’s the last I heard.

I have actually completed a shift as a vaccination steward which was organised through a local group. We had a Zoom training session. No references, no DBS, we turned up and cracked on as best we could as the person who was supposed to induct us wasn’t there. It wasn’t ideal but we got the job done.

Meanwhile my SJA application is with HR.

@mrsjoyfulprizeforraffiawork
Genuine Question why do think it is racist/and divisive for charities to ask a potential volunteer their ethnicity(race then?

I will put in different way
This senario,
You are are staff member of charity your role is recruitment officer for potential volunteers for this charity

You are concerned that everybody has a equal fair chance to have volunteering experience,but you want to ensure this actively happens, you have recently discovered that this isn't allways the case,Certain groups of the population,(including your own ethnicity, don't feel your charity reflects this ethos of equality,fairness.

You are unsatisfied/confused on hearing about this News.
And are intrigued to find out why this maybe/or is the case.!😕
How do you find out why certain ethnicities, groups in society have the same Opportunties(fair equal as everybody else to doing volunteering work for your charity?
As you are worried and obviously do not want your charity who work for being accused of being Racist or divisive in any way.

@mrsjoyfulprizeforraffiawork
Oops sorry i ment to say

How do you ensure as a recruitment officer role for potential volunteers that all all sections of our society get the most out of volunteering experience with your charity and its reflected by all ethnicities in society,

You obviously want to find out the reasons behind the recent news, that your charity does not allways reflect this in certain sections of our society
How do you find out how wide spread in certain ethnities in population and why it is,the reasons the case that your policy ethos of equality fairness is not allways or often Not Reflected in your recruitment process of acctracting good enough,capable suitable potential volunteers?

You are Concerned that your Charity could be accused of being racist/divisive
Cause its failing to acctract wide as possible sections of our society
And not fulfilling Gov objectives Goals because of this problem issue
Also as a charity you depend on the goodwill of people donating and on fulfing Gov Criteria too
As you will not get any funding if you don't achieve fulfil Gov Criteria required 😕

@Nacreous

If you want to you could contact your local GP surgery and offer to help there or at the primary care vaccination centre they are feeding into instead - they may have less onerous recruitment requirements.

I certainly hope not. I would be deeply concerned if they don't care about safeguarding and access to / working with vulnerable people.

Whilst I have some sympathy that the op might have been out of touch with modern day recruitment practices, the time she spent kvetching about this, she could have filled the form in several times over and saved herself a lot of angst and misplaced indignation into the bargain.
just how long do you think it took me to write the 2 or 3 posts?

Also, while you seem to have set yourself up as MN headgirl, perhaps MN would cease to exist if people did come on and post like this.

did not

Yanbu. Whatever works for you and your life. I was once asked to volunteer to visit an elderly lady regularly as she was alone and lonely,which sounded nice in principle but some of the requirements ( at my own expense) were a bit
. Two general references
. Police checks
.Employer reference
.credit check ( strange one)

I politely declined.

Also, while you seem to have set yourself up as MN headgirl, perhaps MN would cease to exist if people did come on and post like this.

I've done no such thing, but I'll let it slide, a straightforward online form shouldn't take a competent adult more than 25 minutes. Mind you, given your unique brand of personal charm, I would suspect SJA have probably dodged a bullet.

I found the application process labyrinthine, too. I got emails telling me I'd been accepted, and then that I needed an interview, but I couldn't get a slot.

In desperation I contacted my GP surgery directly and have been helping as a marshal since yesterday.

St John's Ambulance now want a photo uploaded. I feel I have committed to them and that's fine so I will continue to plug away, but in some ways I feel as useful at the GP's.

So you filled in the long form, found 2 references and then fell at the last hurdle of answering questions on gender and religion?