Another plane missing

[HoppingPavlova]

Not sure if this is the right place, didn’t seem to fit anywhere.

Just read another plane has disappeared from radar. Indonesian flight 182, Boeing 747.

What I can’t work out is they are reporting it lost contact 45 mins after departure and Flight Radar indicated it lost 3000m altitude 4mins after take-off. I understand the 45mins but not the loss of altitude 4mins after take-off. Wouldn’t the plane still be climbing in that time? I would think it would even be visible from the air traffic tower! Maybe the early reports have muddled information?

Hopefully they locate this one and by someone me miracle there are survivors but experience proves doubtful unfortunately.

@Pleasantville.

Reuters article from Jan last year here ..

www.reuters.com/article/us-airlines-safety-idUSKBN1Z0242

FWIW the 2021 figures (sub-300) sadly include Iranians shooting down a Russian airliner...

For a while now the annual fatalities for commercial operation have been sub-1000 a year, which is pretty much "in the noise" when you look at the numbers who were travelling, but nevertheless each death is a tragic.

There's an old saying that the most dangerous part of a pilots' working day is the drive to/from the airport..

@EileenGC

By pretty much any internationally agreed aviation standard that was a crash - there's even an accident report.

and I hit enough birds (sorry bird lovers) in my career..I don't feel the need to do any more research, but thanks for the tip.

Make that a non-fatal crash then. I personally don't call a minor accident a crash but yes, there was an incident.

My point was, 737s as a whole are not unsafe, for the PP that said she never wanted to fly on one again. It was the 737 MAX that had to be (is still being?) investigated.

@notimagain I do apologise for the misunderstanding. Like I said, my point was that 737s are safe.

How sad 😞

I have flown in a 737 many years ago, they are a old plane, I don’t understand why some countries use older aircraft? Surely they are more likely to have a fault?

We’re you trying to start another conspiracy theory OP? I think we can assume it has crashed and people are very sadly dead.

Yes, saying 64 presumed dead now on bbc

@EillenGC

I personally don't call a minor accident a crash but yes, there was an incident.

Good for you..however

ICAO, definitions

www.iprr.org/manuals/Annex13.html#:~:text=Accident.,being%20in%20the%20aircraft%2C%20or

"Accident. An occurrence associated with the operation of an aircraft which takes place between the time any person boards the aircraft with the intention of flight until such time as all such persons have disembarked, in which:"

........
"b) the aircraft sustains damage or structural failure which:

• adversely affects the structural strength, performance or flight characteristics of the aircraft, and

• would normally require major repair or replacement of the affected component,"

Looking at what happened to the FR flight at Rome and the state of the airframe I'd say that's an accident, not an incident, but what would ICAO know about it..

Sorry Eileen, crossed post..

Yes, 737s in general have been very safe.

@quarks

its not missing, it has crashed

I take it back, I heard a report earlier that debri had been found, but now it seems that was unrelated.

Lets hope found safe

@Username7521

Not sure if you’ve read but though flights are way down year on year in 2020 crashes were up.

I hadn't heard that at all.

It's not a Boeing 737 Max which was the one that crashed a couple of years ago.

@Lovemusic33

How sad 😞

I have flown in a 737 many years ago, they are a old plane, I don’t understand why some countries use older aircraft? Surely they are more likely to have a fault?

This particular plane was a 737-500, which is a slightly older model. 737s have developed over time and not all of them are old. Most of the 737s in service today will be from the 'Next Generation' series, they're fairly modern.

@Lovemusic33

How sad 😞

I have flown in a 737 many years ago, they are a old plane, I don’t understand why some countries use older aircraft? Surely they are more likely to have a fault?

Sriwijaya Air is a budget airline.

We’re you trying to start another conspiracy theory OP?

No, incredibly odd thing to say. My OP was based on an early report I had read which headlined and used the term ‘missing’. Hence I used this in my OP as I did not know there was an update where it had been found. My later link had updated information but still said search party sent out, not found. That’s where it’s left for me with local news as they pack it in until the morning so makes sense you are now getting more information than we have locally.

My AIBU initially really pertained to the initial report I read about the large loss of altitude 4mins out from takeoff when I didn’t think it would have even achieved that within 4mins and as said initially I presumed may still be within sight if a tower at that point. Seems that initial report had wrong make though so maybe that aspect incorrect as well, doubt it was fact checked in a rush to get it out.

So, no I am not being goady with any conspiracy and also believe in Covid if that sets your mind at rest.

By pretty much any internationally agreed aviation standard that was a crash - there's even an accident report.

Aviation professionals sonny use the word “crash”. That is lay terminology. We would talk about an “accident” (which has a specific legal definition for both investigation purposes and in the context of international aviation conventions”. In aviation insurance they talk about a “loss” or a “major loss” or a “constructive total loss”. The Ryanair bird strike would be referred to as an incident or accident.

Sonny=don’t

I have flown in a 737 many years ago, they are a old plane, I don’t understand why some countries use older aircraft? Surely they are more likely to have a fault?

Apparently, there some 737s still in service that are over 50 years old.

Anyway the point is a Ryanair plane has never fallen out of the sky so their safety record is very good.

Sadly not the case for this plane and its crew and passengers.

@HoppingPavlova I believe the weather is overcast there and the cloud height around 2000ft so it wouldn't take long for the plane to be out of sight

@Username7521

Not sure if you’ve read but though flights are way down year on year in 2020 crashes were up.

That's pretty worrying, given that there were far fewer planes flying last year.

@HoppingPavlova. It is definitely not an AIBU topic and FYI there is a news topic.

This is the topic used the most as posters say it gets the most traffic but if people just used the right sections...

It is so awful, whatever has happened it appears people will have died.

@CharlotteRose90

It’s crashed into the sea unfortunately. They’ve found debris in the ocean now already. So sad and as an airline worker it fills me with dread every time I see it

So sad isn’t it, I was just saying to my colleague that I feel like any plane crash is personal and devastating whilst we work in aviation x

That's pretty worrying, given that there were far fewer planes flying last year.

In the grand scheme of things it really really isn't worth worrying about 2020 commercial airline passenger fatalities, as I posted earlier for several years now the numbers have been down at "noise" level in the data..there are plenty more things to worry about as we drive/bus/walk around.

FWIW, the one accident ( having been chastised I'm carefully avoiding the "c" word) which contributed most to the 2020 statistics was the Ukraine International Airlines 737 which was mistakenly shot down by the Iranian military on 8th Jan...an outlier and one that occurred before Covid decimated aviation movements.

That's pretty worrying, given that there were far fewer planes flying last year.

More were shot down though, which bumped the fatality figures up significantly.

@mizydoscape do you hit 2000m in under 4mins? Sorry, pre-Covid I did fly a lot but admittedly no idea, left it all to the pilots😁. If you do hit 2000 in under 4mins then yes, together with the cloud information all head scratching aspects resolved and probably better to move to news, no idea how one does this though?

I hope they locate it if not already done so. While tragic either way, so much easier for families to accept and grieve if the fate of a plane is known. The stories you read of the families who had lived ones in the missing plane were heartbreaking, many willingly believing ridiculous conspiracy theories as it meant hope their loved ones may still be alive. Terrible.