To wonder how Friends has survived 'cancel culture?'

[ChocolateSantaisthebestkind]

Over the course of Christmas/lockdown evenings, we have been watching these again on Netflix and DH and I were both saying we don't know how it has survived unedited some bits are down right uncomfortable to watch now.

1. Treatment of LGBT people

2. Making fun of disability -Ginger's leg episode

3. Phoebe's Childhood

4. Ridicule of foreigners

5. Joey/Ross/ Chandler treatment of women

6. Tag --> Sexual Harrassment at work

7. Gunther Stalker

8. Lack of racial diversity ('fixed' but tokenistically by introduction of Charlie)

9. Ageism

10. Body shaming

I know lots of us loved it back in the day and some episodes are still funny, but it just amazes me that there hasn't been more backlash.

AIBU to be

Because 'cancel culture' is about 3 14 year olds on Twitter and the Daily Mail trying to sell their excrement?

Actually theres an early friends where Joey says something like 'went down like a hooker punched in the stomach'.

'Joey : I fold like a cheap hooker who got hit in the stomach by a fat guy'

I remember at the time it was made people commenting on the lack of ethnic minority characters.

However american critics did point out that it was correct in that people of the demographic portrayed in Friends don't tend to mix much with people from other races and to show them doing do would look forced.

Make of that what you will as a comment on American society

I’ve been binge watching it again after many years and still love it but thought completely the same thing!
The constant ‘gay’ jibes and jokes.
The quite creepy pervy comments by Ross and Joey.
The fact that this time round I’ve realised Ross actually treats Rachel pretty appallingly.
And the ‘fat’ Monica constant ‘jokes’ irked me a lot. Especially in the ‘The One That Could Have Been Part 1&2’ where Monica’s ‘fat’ suit actually just shows her as a pretty average size! I found it really quite offensive.
It’s still a brilliant show, but parts of it have not aged well at all

I didn't really pick up on anything much about Friends - apart from it being really funny - or Grease apart from hating that it made smoking appear cool (I've loathed the smell for as long as I can remember). Loved it otherwise.
My daughters (now early 20s) loved both too. One of the highlights of elder DD's school career was being a Pink Lady in the Bowdlerised-for-schools "A Spot of Grease".

The only time I remember thinking "Hang on...!" was Pretty Woman.
I didn't see why she had to have been a prostitute. Seemed overly gritty for what was basically a modern Pygmalion story and wrong to glamorise that lifestyle. And how could Richard Gere be a romantic hero in those circumstances?
Still enjoyed all the "moments" in the film though: "Slippery little suckers!"; "Big mistake - huge!" etc

@ElizaLaLa

Because people love it, the same with creepy Love Actually. I don't think neither will be cancelled ever, but I wouldn't be surprised if Grease is removed from terrestrial telly

What's wrong with grease?

Grease is horrible and I can't understand why schools use for performances. There's all the implications of 'did you get very far' and 'did she put up a fight' ie coercion. At the end she dresses like the other girls, denying her true self and, lo and behold, she gets the boy. He, on the other hand does very little.

Perhaps very few people are watching it?

There's all the implications of 'did you get very far' and 'did she put up a fight' ie coercion.

I know that isn't your main point, but those sort of lines were cut/changed in the school performances.
And, obviously, chicks didn't cream for Greased Lightening.
Like comparing Pretty Woman to Pygmalion, isn't Grease a kind of modern day Cinderella?

I realise fairy stories don't stand up well either, but sometimes things can just be enjoyed for what they are in their own context.
And I love a good transformation scene.

Don't know if anyone on this thread reads Terry Pratchett, but in one of his books a vampire is trying to train his children to become less responsive to superstitions so that eg someone holding two candlesticks in the shape of a cross won't hurt them and make them cower.
He regularly holds up flashcards with various religious symbols on them to desensitise his DS and DD to them.
It works for a while, but eventually they find they're seeing patters of religious symbols everywhere and feeling uncomfortable because all the time (for any TP fans - I agree, I'm over-simplifying).

Many of them wouldn't have bothered them at all if their father hadn't brought it to their attention.

Not sure if that was the best example, but isn't it possible to watch something, appreciate some of its mores will be of its time and, possibly, not copy some of the things that we can see now aren't ideal.

Otherwise, "cancel culture" will be regularly "cancelling" everything that happened up until last month, say.

Can't people be credited with a bit of intelligence to weed out the good (most of Friends, imo) from the bad.
Like I did with Pretty Woman?

There’s nothing offensive about friends; none of the episodes are uncomfortable. They’re funny and relatable. Nothing should be off limits in humour.

Because you can't ban everything from the past that's questionable thank fuck.

There'd be nothing left.

Seems to be a competition to be the most woke these days it's laughable. Well it is for me that isn't offended by anything.

At the end she dresses like the other girls, denying her true self and, lo and behold, she gets the boy. He, on the other hand does very little

She already "had" him, before she dressed like the other girls - he'd been studying athletics and earned himself a letterman's jacket - at that point, he didn't know she'd "changed" and wanted to be with her for her true self.

And, obviously, chicks didn't cream for Greased Lightening

I always heard that as the chicks'll scream for Grease lightning when I was younger and watching it, went right over my head!
Was when finally the penny dropped as an adult (was probably on a Grease bashing thread on here actually lol)

I know that isn't your main point, but those sort of lines were cut/changed in the school performances
I don't think they cut anything in the one I saw.
She already "had" him, before she dressed like the other girls - he'd been studying athletics and earned himself a letterman's jacket - at that point, he didn't know she'd "changed" and wanted to be with her for her true self.
The performance at my grandson's school missed this nuance completely, although I remembered it from the film.

I didn't like it when it came out though (and the 39 Yr olds playing High School kids were ridiculous) and it seems even worse now.

Quaagars

And, obviously, chicks didn't cream for Greased Lightening

I always heard that as the chicks'll scream for Grease lightning when I was younger

Me too!
I was 12 when I saw it first and a pretty innocent 12 (or maybe just normal for way back in the day).

As a by the by, what always makes me smile about Grease was that I saw it when living in a Spanish-speaking country and the title was translated into "Vaselina"

CaptainMyCaptain

I don't think they cut anything in the one I saw.

Fair enough.
My daughter was in a production in year 6 (called, as I said, "A Spot of Greaase"). It was heavily cut and made very obvious that Danny had pulled his socks up and was trying to be a better person for Sandy too. Of course Sandy had her Cinderella moment (but no smoking and wasn't stitched into her trousers à la ONJ).

I made all the Pink Ladies' jackets.

Because "cancel culture" is about finding an excuse to be vile and abusive towards people, mostly women. The lead actresses of Friends have evidently either fallen in line with wokedom's demands or kept their heads down on social media.

Because it represents what it was like at the time that it was filmed! You can't change history! So stop trying! It doesn't make it right but if everything is suddenly made PC, adults forget and kids never learn from the mistakes of the generations before.

I'm a big believer in not judging things of their time by today's discourses so there is still a lot to like about this and other comedies and satire.

YANBU

I love friends but I recently watched the one where Joey lamented that they needed new extras because he had already slept with them all (from his more powerful position on the soap he was in). That wouldn't be a storyline now. Regardless of whether the storyline is offensive to anyone here, it's just a different world.

I don't understand how people who have seen the show lately haven't seen any examples of storylines and attitudes that would be problematic today.

I also don't get why people have felt the need to be shitty to you on this thread, OP.

@Quaagars

YABU, love Friends!! How is Gunther a stalker?! He's just full of unrequited love for Rachel, and sees her every time she comes in the coffee shop, he's hardly sitting outside her flat or stalking her on the subway or whatever Also, ageism? Examples?! OK, was mainly white, but it wasn't just Charlie, there was the girl who moved in across the street both Joey and Ross dated without realising, Rhonda at the musuem, Chandlers would be boss he had an interview with....

I don't really understand the problem with it being mainly 'white'. At the time there were a lot of shows that had mainly 'black' characters e.g Fresh Prince, Sister Sister, A different world, Moesha etc

I am so glad I never got rid of my DVDs when it appeared on Netflix.
Friends is and always will be funny.
People who go out looking for things to offended by are very strange.

Friends is problematic but it's not going to be cancelled when more recent sitcoms have the same problems but are as popular as ever.

For example Big Bang Theory ended in 2019 and almost all of the things in your list applies to that popular programme too.

@emilyfrost

There’s nothing offensive about friends; none of the episodes are uncomfortable. They’re funny and relatable. Nothing should be off limits in humour.

Not even the "Chandler is gay" jokes? If Friends was current they definitely wouldn't have cast a woman with a deep voice as a transwoman.