So parents now have 5 days to...

[Tanaria]

... find appropriate childcare?

The announcement that secondaries are not going back until w/b 11th with exam classes and w/b 18th for all other years, together with the very vague "some" primaries will be shut in high-infection areas.

Given that most of us have been plunged into Tier 4, how will we actually find out whether our children can go back to school?

[quote TheSunIsStillShining]@Penguinmuma
And if you are on rent: absolutely no help for renters.
ANd before anyone says anything about being able to afford that rent is in itself a privilege: people made the choice pre covid and now the world and opportunities changed, but many are locked in for x years by contract.

People don't realize that beyond the headlines the actual substance is quite shallow. The real beneficiaries of furlough are low/middle paid office workers in big corporations.
Anyone above or beyond that is just left to their own devices.[/quote]
@TheSunIsStillShining I'm in that boat. I can't get any help paying the rent & we are struggling at the moment.

I had to quit work after my maternity because of working in a hospital it isn't safe for me atm. A part time job would be good for me because my LO is only 1 so not to have to put him in nursery (which I'd rather not especially with what's going on) but there is nothing out there atm because of covid.

You can be furloughed for childcare reasons if you cannot find suitable provision, your child has special needs such as make a secondary pupil unsuitable to leave at home unsupervised, or if you are a keyworker schools will still be taking those pupils I believe. So mechanisms are there.

Mechanisms are there for some of the population but for a lot there's nothing at all, no financial support and no access to schooling in school. The mortgage support is also pretty useless, the debt and interest just gets added to end of loan and can damage your credit rating. Our school requires both parents to work full-time away from the home for any in school schooling (which isn't any teaching its just online access bring your own computer) for key workers and EHCPs. Nothing at all for SN kids with no EHCP and almost all those with EHCPs don't have 2 full time working parents who can only work in an office as kids have needs at home.

Lots of people don't qualify for furlough or self-employed grant - I became self-employed in 2018 which makes me ineligible. Then there's people on zero hours contracts, people who have lost jobs - loads of people. It's very uneven - some people are getting £24k a year from the state via furlough, others zero.

@TheSunIsStillShining

I think we’ll have to agree to disagree. You seem keen to let schools off the hook here due to not having an ‘incentive’ to provide a minimum level of work if not pushed into using basic thinking skills by the DfE. What ‘upskilling’ of skills is needed to encourage teachers to send some resources home, make some phone calls and signpost students to the DfE’s Oak Academy? You must be aware that the policy officials at DfE are paid considerably less than headteachers and would have been frantically busy with macro issues during covid. But it’s their fault that certain headteachers weren’t incentivised to provide a minimum level of work? Really? Teachers / headteachers are professionals too and the mark of a professional job is going above and beyond what is set out in the job description, using critical thinking skills and adapting to different circumstances.

As I said originally, many headteachers worked very hard however a significant proportion took the piss, ie they ‘worked to rule’ / took advantage of the fact that they weren’t specifically mandated to provide basic levels of education.

Schools won't take children that's wishful thinking. It's first come first served and no other system, that ship has sailed, places were decided back in September based on something random I'm sure. Both adults were key workers in this house during the first lockdown. That didn't get any of our children a space in school or nursery, we were told it was because they weren't at risk but I suspect it was just the teachers didn't want them there. There just aren't the spaces in schools yadda yadda , also the teachers made it very clear the children of key workers were as welcome as a fart in a lift! We've given up on schools. This government is not capable of providing an education to children and appears to have removed that right. As a parent I've just had to realise that and give my children the education they deserve. School system is only for a certain wedge of society. Not for us apparently.

@D4rwin That's awful that you were both keyworkers and couldn't get places for your children. If the primary schools were really full then years 5 and 6 could have been sent to local secondary schools where there were far fewer children.

@Raspberry681
Ok, I'm fine to agree on disagreeing.
Can I make just one last point?

"As I said originally, many headteachers worked very hard however a significant proportion took the piss, ie they ‘worked to rule’ / took advantage of the fact that they weren’t specifically mandated to provide basic levels of education."
Whilst we agree to disagree on the whys, i think we agree on this as the outcome.

My point would be though: if we are in the same situation in a few weeks, how can we prevent this happening again?

tbh if I was a HT i would have gone against guidance and would have risk my job and implemented more measures and rotas/blended learning in Sept. What baffles me is that HTs are still relying on guidance even though it's proved to be shitty

@TheSunIsStillShining

Hmm yes. I think we definitely agree something needs to change to avoid a similar situation occurring in future.

I guess the options are:

• leave it to individual school discretion again as to how education should be delivered, but this time put v firm messages out to the media that schools are not allowed to simply shut up shop for months and hope that all headteachers will cave to public pressure this time. However, govt is then left open to the same criticism from schools/unions for not explaining how schools could do this, etc., and we run the risk of the same problems occurring ie some schools not doing enough and not being held accountable for lack of education over several months. And govt gets blamed for not being prescriptive enough. I personally do not think this is the govt's fault but acknowledge that some do.

• DfE issues relatively detailed guidance on expected levels of educational provision, how to do this etc. The more detailed the guidance on home learning the more govt resource will be taken up when (in my view) we need policy officials to be cracking issues such as transmission in schools, exams, mental health, rolling out laptops, protecting teachers in schools and getting teachers onto the vaccine priority list. And politically and practically, if the govt needs to tell teachers how to do their jobs, the unions and other stakeholders will need to be involved to input etc. This will all take longer and become complicated and inevitably move away from the central issue of minimal educational provision. Eg some stakeholders will use it as a tactical opportunity to bargain politically (eg more pay), which will drag things out more as even if the DfE wanted to increase pay/funding, this would all need to be approved by the treasury etc etc. And the govt gets blamed again for delay.

Then there's still the likelihood that one size doesn't fit all and even with detailed guidance some schools will still say 'we don't fit into the guidance, therefore we'll do nothing'

• issue very general guidance to say that schools are expected to take reasonable steps to provide home learning with examples eg work packs sent home, telephone calls and signposting to oak academy. This would be quicker to implement and there's less of a chance that some schools will simply say 'but you haven't told us how to do this'

The last seems to be the most effective option however I think it is a shame that the govt needs to do this when (in my view) it's obvious and all headteachers should want to cooperate.

@Ribrabrob

I don’t mean to be rude and I’m certainly not intending to be fussy but, genuinely, what do you expect the government to do? The situation is fast-moving and they are reacting when need be.

I get that it’s frustrating but I do wonder what people want the government to do. They are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

I 100% agree

You can be furloughed for childcare reasons if you cannot find suitable provision, your child has special needs such as make a secondary pupil unsuitable to leave at home unsupervised, or if you are a keyworker schools will still be taking those pupils I believe.

it's not that simple. My employer wont agree so I have no chance of getting furloughed.

news.sky.com/story/all-london-primary-schools-to-remain-closed-for-start-of-term-in-government-u-turn-12177017

All London primary closed at start of term and not just the earlier list of just some boroughs.

Schools are expected to be ready to deliver immediate online learning if a child/ group is isolating or the local restrictions require child to stay at home.

There was info on in this October if they were not already doing so.
Those most disadvantaged have been children of working parents.

Those I know with primary age both work and are using non working friends as childcare. They aren’t expecting their friends to supervise any schooling. They are grateful that they can continue to work and their DC’s will be safe. Schooling will have to wait.

We are tier 3. My son is in year 11, state school. Home learning AGAIN. Has to be left to his own devices as I need to work my 10 hour shifts, which means he won't bother doing much home learning seeing as his school do not require them to log in to any kind of online classes all day long. He's dyslexic, is way behind, hasnt had any SENCO help at all in the last year and try as I might to encourage him, his education has suffered hugely

Furlough is at discretion of employer so no option for most working at home parents.

Why the hell can cafes etc stay open for takeaway and shops for click and collect but schools close. There should be a national outcry!

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-government-told-to-consider-making-masks-mandatory-in-workplaces-and-schools-to-help-control-spread-of-variant-12176724

I’ve said all along, everyone in schools should be wearing masks all day inside. It’s been effective in other countries from kindergarten upwards.

Now it's too little too late.

And don't forget english children would not comply and develop serious MH issues because of it.

Two days...now five seems a godsend! Well done Gav.

It sounds like some teachers and heads have also been caught by surprise. There was a poster (not sure if it was on this thread) saying they now had to prepare online learning. I actually thought schools had planned for that already but obviously not.
It's been badly handled but if you don't have anyone who can look after your children how would more notice help?
If nurseries in my area shut I'm screwed regardless of how much notice I get.
Luckily my older children are going to school regardless as we're key workers. But if we weren't no amount of notice will help because we don't have that support.

@Parker231

The furlough scheme applies if your employer has to temporarily close or reduce staffing due to reduction in work. It doesn’t apply if you are off work with Covid or away from work as your DC is ill. If you are ill, there is sick pay. If you are off work because your DC is ill, it is either unpaid or annual holidays if you have any left.

It doesn't even always apply then u fortunately. My husband has worked in the same industry, for the same company for nearly 20 years. They laid all the lads off, non of them furloughed, because they'd taken advice from their legal department and were told that 'legally' they didn't have to furlough them. No work for 12 weeks, no money coming in, I'm a SAHM so no wages from me either. This was from a huge international company! So no, unfortunately not everyone got furloughed!!!