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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Worried for child of covert narc

48 replies

NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 14:22

Tryin to keep this short but its difficult. Name changed obviously.

My sister and I are no contact for years. She tormented and abused me growing up.
Told many lies about me to our parents throughout my childhood and early adult life until I stopped contact.

We are complete opposites,always were.
She is introverted ,office job. Not very confident.
I have been to counselling for years for the damage she's done to me. She really is a nasty piece of work who appears lovely and quiet to everyone outside of her family.

Even in our adult life she physically attacked me,twice, when nobody was around and I wasn't believed for a long time as she'd done such a number on my parents convincing them I was never to be trusted. This affected my life greatly.

She seems highly embarrassed of where we come from and what my parents do for a living. She has adopted a new accent and has done everything she can to appear 'middle class'. She is extremely controlling and doesn't take the children to visit my parents very much.

When we do see the children the oldest child (7) is often very upset. We see her being tormented in some of the same ways I was. Child is controlled and micromanaged to the extreme.
Example..they were going to a birthday party after visiting us.
Niece (5 at the time) was sobbing uncontrollably because her mother had been shouting and berating her earlier for signing the card with a plus ( +) instead of a kiss ( x ) she kept angrily rubbing it out and telling the 5 year old child to do it again (I remember her doing this with me as a child when I was forced to ask her for help with homework- she'd shout at me like I was a learning disabled foreigner with little understanding of English)Hmm she micromanages everything the child does including toys,play and food.

Child has two younger siblings who seem not to get the same abuse but perhaps thats because they are too young or are boys?
Child tenses up and is extremely nervous when her mum comes back for her she cries every time and recently was wailing ''she upsets me every day, why is she always upsetting me?'.... from a 7 year old..this was utterly heartbreaking to hear.
I understand kids do play up and can make us look like evil creatures sometimes!Grin but this is worrying.
Child is expected to do everything perfectly and only have interests in what her mother deems interesting. If child likes somthing else or does somthing childlike..her mother seems almost...embarrassed?! Child is an extension of mother and must be seen as perfect and intelligent at all times. My own mother is now very concerned and cries regularly worrying for her granddaughter.
My Parents cannot and will not say anything because they know they will see the children less than they do now so will absolutely not rock the boat. You cannot approach her with anything and she is very cold and will just ignore then take things away from you to punish you.

Sorry if I'm not making a lot of sense. I'm not even sure what I'm asking of mumsnet here. I'm just very worried and have been damaged incredibly by this woman I panic when I think of my niece being put through the same kind of treatment . We make sure there is no stress when we see the child alone, we make sure to praise her and tell her we love her but every time we see her ...its like her little spirit is broken more and more. We dont see the children enough to really have an impact on their lives. I worry a lot about what it's like in their home.
Does anyone have a similar story or advice for any part of this? I cant stop worrying about the future for this child.
Thank you if you've read til the end.

OP posts:
letsnotscaretheneighbours · 29/12/2020 16:08

@NothingICanDo exactly how you start. They ask you questions after and it goes from there. They normally ask you what outcome you want. Its ok to say you don't know.

NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 16:11

Its ok to say you don't know I was just thinking this. As realistically what can be done. I suppose if I can at least learn better coping techniques or things I can do and say to let the child know she can talk to me and trust me, then that's somthing.

OP posts:
NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 16:13

Thank you for the replies lovely people. I appreciate it. Hoping to get back into counselling soon as this is causing me a lot of worry.

OP posts:
HyacynthBucket · 29/12/2020 16:25

It must be so hard to see your own childhood pain replicated with your niece. Good for you in thinking that you must act in some way to protect her as it is definitely abuse. Hoping that the NSPCC can advise, and for a good outcome for your niece and for you.

missymousey · 29/12/2020 16:27

Definitely contact the school. If it is as you recall from your own childhood then it is emotional abuse. The information may be a piece of the puzzle the school needs to put support in place. Most schools round us have a nurture programme that might be just the sort of low-key but effective support that would make a difference.

NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 16:28

That's exactly what it is HyacynthBucket history repeating itself. Thank you x

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NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 16:31

missymousey that kind of thing sounds really good. Do you think the school would tell her somebody has concerns about her and her parenting? Because I'm sure she would know it was me and cause havoc. I don't want to cause her stopping us seeing the kids or my parents never speaking to me again.

OP posts:
Aahotep · 29/12/2020 16:55

I do have a good relationship with my niece now, but didn't see her for a big chunk of her teenage years. She said she took the decision not to see extended family because she would always get in trouble because she would forget what she was allowed to say. My sister lies compulsively and would get cross if her kids inadvertently exposed her.
Niece is definitely affected MH wise and wants to go NC with her mum but can't quite cut her out. Basically she lives in hope that her mum will have a personality transplant. It's never going to happen and I've been through this myself as I always hoped I was wrong and she would change. Eventually I accepted it but it was hard.
Sadly we didn't realise just how bad things were which I feel very guilty about. My DH says I shouldn't beat myself up as I am a lot younger than my sister and some of this happened when I was a teenager.
I don't know if it will change anything as the threshold for intervention is pretty high but you will know you tried.
My niece said it meant a lot to her that she knew we loved her.

PeacefulPlease · 29/12/2020 17:04

This is not dissimilar to my own childhood. DM from working class family who had a successful business so moved up in the world. DM has massive inferiority complex, now has ridiculous fake posh accent and literally looks down her nose at waiting and shop staff - especially other women. Throughout my childhood she was either working or away with my step-dad (equally snooty). I don’t remember her ever reading, or playing with me. Hobbies were mainly chosen by her, eg forces to play the piano, when I wanted to learn the guitar it had to be classical guitar. I wasn’t allowed to study the subject I wanted at a-level as apparently there were no career options in what I wanted to study. She would often tell me off when I wasn’t even aware I’d done anything wrong in the first place and would make me feel like a truly awful human being for everyday childhood mistakes. She forced me to eat food I didn’t want to, eg. Prawns complete with heads and tails and to wear frumpy, old-fashioned clothes.

Definitely please report this to the headteacher or safeguarding lead at the school. Keep a diary. Agree getting some advice from the NSPCC. And always always be there for her. She needs to know that this isn’t right.

I ended up in a career I’m not 100% suited to because I wasn’t allowed to follow my own interests. I have also been in two emotionally abusive relationships. I have very low self-esteem and a constant self-critical inner monologue. I feel like my life is wasted.

2BDIs · 29/12/2020 17:08

How do you know all this if you have been no contact for years. Are your parents now aware of the childhood issues between you two and are reporting back to you what they are witnessing this time round and wondering how to deal with it from someone that has been through it?

AccidentallyOnPurpose · 29/12/2020 17:18

I would ring NSPCC and ask for advice with how to deal/help your niece. While emotional abuse is now recognised as abuse , the threshold is pretty damn high if everything else is ok.

Also I would ring her school and ask to talk to the pastoral care person or safeguarding lead. Tell them about behaviours you've witnessed, comments your DN said,changes in your behaviour. Don't make it about you or what happened to you. Just about DN,the changes in her behaviour etc. A good school will take that on board and keep an eye on the child, maybe even fill in a mental health/record of concern. If she's displaying anxious behaviours at school they will have a reason for it and they might put things in place. It might complete a puzzle they already have about DN.

If nothing works, just be there for her. Love her, encourage her to make mistakes and have fun. Tell her you believe her.

NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 17:29

Jesus PeacefulPlease I feel awful for you as I know how you feel. Completely. It is comforting to know I'm not the only one but also distressing now to imagine others damaged as badly,for somthing that is effectively invisible to the rest of the world. I'm sorry you've had to go through this.

Likewise Aahotep I really feel for you and your nieceSad.

2BDIs No my parents report nothing to me. I see it all as I will go to my parents house every time my sister visits with the children. Which isnt very ofter. But I never let an opportunity pass to see the kids. So I see/hear it all.

OP posts:
NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 17:32

We dont speak to each other but will carry on, each talking to others in the room. There is no conflict. Not even eye contact between her and I. The children have never even notived. I'm always with my parents when we see them so lots of distractions in the room.

OP posts:
NothingICanDo · 29/12/2020 17:33

AccidentallyOnPurpose thank you. I will call the school when they are back.
Will they have to tell my sister that someone has raised a concern?

OP posts:
TaraR2020 · 29/12/2020 18:09

I'm sure you will but I hope you keep the relationship going with your niece and nephews. It sounds like your niece is going to continue to need you around and, like the pp said, you'll be able to make a difference.

They're lucky to have you as their aunt.

AccidentallyOnPurpose · 29/12/2020 18:10

@NothingICanDo

AccidentallyOnPurpose thank you. I will call the school when they are back. Will they have to tell my sister that someone has raised a concern?
I honestly can't give an honest,confident answer on this. It all depends on school policy, their methods, if they'll escalate it or have any meetings about it etc. I also couldn't confidently say if they'll name you or not to her.

It's a hard place to be in .Thanks

NothingICanDo · 30/12/2020 15:15

I honestly can't give an honest,confident answer on this. It all depends on school policy, their methods, if they'll escalate it or have any meetings about it etc. I also couldn't confidently say if they'll name you or not to her

It's a hard place to be in

Thanks for the honesty. I will speak to the school as soon as I can, I'll ask their protocol first (if they have to inform the parents etc) I want to call the NSPCC first but feeling a bit nervous to. I dont know why. Will have a cuppa and then try.

Thanks again everyone.

OP posts:
Sandalison · 30/12/2020 15:22

Sounds like emotional abuse to me, I’d call NSPCC for advice.

NothingICanDo · 30/12/2020 15:26

Sandalison Thank you.

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AngryFeminist · 30/12/2020 16:07

You sound like a great auntie. My stepdad treated me in the exact way you describe and my aunties were safe havens for me.

I think I'd second what others have said re: talking to the NSPCC and school. You know she can be violent physically, so it might be good to have a paper trail in case she turns violent on your niece too. Also, I'd recommend reading around emotional abuse - it might help you put names to your sister's behaviours which can be really cathartic and also helpful when speaking to authorities.

Most of all though, making sure she knows you are there and offering her a safe place when she needs it: these are the things that will make a huge difference.

letsnotscaretheneighbours · 30/12/2020 17:15

@NothingICanDo re: Do you think the school would tell her somebody has concerns about her and her parenting

I don't think they will. As far as I could ascertain from the safeguarding lady at my DDs school they monitor the situation and refer to social services themselves. I don't think they alert the parent at all.

letsnotscaretheneighbours · 30/12/2020 17:16

Should add do check, but don't let it put you off reporting it.

EveryDayIsADuvetDay · 30/12/2020 17:30

It sounds like a horrendous situation to be in for all of you - you, your niece and your parents.
Before you approach NSPCC and the school, write it all down; all of the incidents that concern you with regards to your niece, separate to issues between you and your sister.
If you have someone that you can discuss it with, ask them to help and prioritise the most serious issues that an outside agency is likely to be able to action/be concerned by.
The clearer and more concise you can be, I would presume you'll get the best directed help for your niece.

Good luck with it all, I hope that you achieve the best outcome.

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