Brexit clearly needs to be postponed

[flashbac]

Ok I get it, we're stuck with the bastard thing but to do it now, in the middle of this chaos?

Article 50 should never have been triggered straight after the ref. there should have been a public consultation where people could have submitted 'evidence' about what they did not like about EU membership and then DC could have negotiated on those points where necessary and run a public education campaign on the elements that were not due to membership at all! Of course, that would have required, thought, time, energy and an admission of using the EU as a scapegoat for decades, so they did not want to do it. Just throw the match and walk away.

Unfortunatelym there is nothing to extend or delay anymore, we have been take out of the EU, which saddens me deeply. All I can do is to console myself that it would have been difficult in or out economically and hope that the worst comes to roost for those in power. I don't wish it on the voters, they made a democratic choice, just as I did, why should I blame them? They did not trigger article 50 or negotiate incompitantly and I hope they thought their decision would be the best thing for the future.

Hollow laugh when people say ‘we’ve already left’. You’re in for a shock
You have already left. It's not a matter of being shocked. You are no longer a member of the EU

It's not a matter of being shocked

I’m struggling to work out if you’re either incredibly dim, or are trying to be ironic in some way.

Once the reality of leaving hits (at the end of the transition period ie in a few days) there will be a very large shock to many/most people in this country. If you don’t actually live here then you may not actually grasp what this might mean.

Oh and to the nah it’ll all be fine mob- let’s see how you feel after a month of no deal. I suspect you’ll be keeping your head down at that point.

That's not the point that was made.

You said "Hollow laugh when people say ‘we’ve already left’. You’re in for a shock"

They may or may not be shocked, but the fat remains that you have already left.
I think what you meant to say that yes, you have already left, but that people will get a shock when the real effects of that occur, after the end of the transition.

Dont call other people dim when you've confused yourself and not understood the point. Scarlet for you.

Pretty obtuse way of putting it then.

Obviously people are talking abut the end of transition.

I always thought that Brexit would be a complete disaster for the UK, so I don't have very balanced view

but it's just going as badly as planned, and the pandemic is only showing what some of the weakest points always were.

It would help if it was delayed as long as possible, ideally until it's forgotten but I am not sure it will happen.

Ah, but if it wasn't for Brexit we wouldn't have all these wonderful lorry parks set up which we are using now the French have stopped them leaving. See there is a benefit of Brexit after all!

Yes, seriously though, I agree another delay would be better than letting it go ahead now. Not that they will ever actually agree on a deal!

@LillianGish

I think the current chaos is a convenient smokescreen for the chaos that will ensue after Brexit. No-one will be able to tell the difference and the Government will be able to blame everything on Covid - it's the only possible explanation for the totally incompetent handling of the current health crisis.

One theory I actually think might be true.

They’ll certainly spin any brexit related issues to be a covid issue.

It's already happened and it needs to be finished.

We have left, there is no extension,

the pandemic is only showing what some of the weakest points always were.

Quite, in an effort to maintain unity within the block, the EU purchased millions of doses of a French made vaccine which will now not be ready for approval until October. They do have other sources for the vaccine but this will set them back and they haven't started administering any yet.

I would say I feel pretty neutral about Brexit at the moment but in reality I just don't have enough energy to worry about it. My point is that it's incredibly naive to think leave/remain would be either all good or all bad and here's one example where being able to make our own decisions has been to our advantage.

Only on MN will people still not accept that this is happening in under two weeks.
Come 1st at least your going to have stop saying postpone it....

I see where you’re coming from op but covid could be going on for years and we can’t delay indefinitely.

As someone trying to steer a small online business relying on trade with the EU, YANU.
I've got stock headed to Europe, probably sitting on a lorry somewhere, my customers requested it before transition ends lest they be hit with extra charges, we've had a terrible year and this may well finish us off. We'd love to know what we're preparing for, it needs to be extended.

The UK is going to experience the full horror of no deal very, very soon. Even if they did now somehow agree a deal, it cannot be ratified before the 1st January. There is a mechanism whereby a deal could be brought in from 1st January and be ratified at a later date. RTE tweeted earlier that the UK rejected that option today so no deal it is.

I assume the OP voted leave and is one that didn't realise the consequences of doing so.

Yes, we have left, but we have not had the consequences yet.

For example, yesterday we learnt that in Switzerland after Jan 1st, as third country nationals, given the end of free movement, UK citizens cannot enter CH as long as the UK is considered high risk (except in the instances of essential travel, or proven hardship). So whilst other borders remain open and at discretion, it is a firm no go for Brits, and intentions to travel must be given.

Which was a bit of a surprise as we were told that nothing would change. (My family have string connections with Switzerland)

And not much notice at all.

This is the first of many small changes that will start to appear.

Brexit is the biggest voluntary loss of human rights and I just do not understand why anyone voted for it at all.

Brexit can’t be postponed, we’re not in the EU

Yes it’s very clear we have already left. The facts remain:

This is the most awful Christmas anyone can remember for obvious reasons.

No deal Brexit will be a huge shock compared to what people are used to.

To combine those two awful situations is not going to be good so the responsible thing to do would be to delay the transition period until things are under control.

To quote @SeasonFinale:
"I assume the OP voted leave and is one that didn't realise the consequences of doing so."

Why would you assume that from my post? "The bastard thing" not a big enough clue?

And posters are being deliberately obtuse. Yes we've 'left' officially on paper but the real effects hit 1st January. It's going to be a grim new year but you can't seem to reason with brexiters. I heard one today tell me "we can eat tinned fruit and veg for a year, it's fine"
Yeah because tinned tomatoes on a salad are great aren't they?

If we extend to summer time at least we have some of our own homegrown food apart from swede, Brussel sprouts and winter veg (if we can find staff to pick them that is).

We are governed by sociopaths.

Fuck no we need to get it over with if it’s happening, you’re wrong about summer, the market needs time to balance out BEFORE the growing season begins, companies need to “learn” to export/import, we need all paperwork and regulations in place.

Postponing would be absolutely worth. Pull the bandaid off, get the politicians out of the bloody way and let the grown ups sort it out.

@flashbac

Ok I get it, we're stuck with the bastard thing but to do it now, in the middle of this chaos?

If the French are closing the border an causing food shortages anway, seems an ideal time to get on with it.

Can't have tradedisruption if you have closed borders

@flashbac

To quote *@SeasonFinale*: "I assume the OP voted leave and is one that didn't realise the consequences of doing so."

Why would you assume that from my post? "The bastard thing" not a big enough clue?

And posters are being deliberately obtuse. Yes we've 'left' officially on paper but the real effects hit 1st January. It's going to be a grim new year but you can't seem to reason with brexiters. I heard one today tell me "we can eat tinned fruit and veg for a year, it's fine"
Yeah because tinned tomatoes on a salad are great aren't they?

If we extend to summer time at least we have some of our own homegrown food apart from swede, Brussel sprouts and winter veg (if we can find staff to pick them that is).

We are governed by sociopaths.

Fuck me your most serious point is that tinned tomatoes don't go with your salad?

You were saying about sociopaths?

@Orf1abc

The agreement comes at the last minute, it's how the EU rolls.

It's really not. The EU generally negotiates trading agreements with rational trading partners over an agreed timetable. But in normal times they don't have David Davis et al failing to even turn up to meetings.

Didn't they just get bent over and forced to settle thier largest ever budget and corona financing last minute by Poland?

I emailed my MP saying this. Johnson is so self serving and arrogant he didn’t take the chance to extend the transition period back in the summer when he could have, on the perfectly reasonable grounds of there being you know a global pandemic on.

Now we are already right in the shit with queues at the ports and international travel restrictions, so we need Johnson to be an actual responsible PM, and to beg the EU to extend the transition period for at least year or two years so that our government, like every other government globally, can focus on tackling the ongoing crisis of public health and propping up the NHS and our economy. It is beyond crazy to try to stress the country’s resources even further with a no deal situation.

If as is likely if/when we leave with no deal there will be supply chain interruptions to food and medicines or vital equipment, that will obviously have severe consequences for our national interests. Understandably, in addition the public reaction to this will likely cause changes in behaviours which could exacerbate the spread of the virus just when we’ve got new highly infectious version- like if a lot of extra people turn up at supermarkets to panic buy.

Not one single person who voted Brexit could have anticipated that we could be leaving the transition arrangements without any deal in the middle of an unprecedented global health emergency. No mandate has been given for pressing on with this in an emergency situation whatsoever. Only a government who sincerely gives no fucks for its people’s wellbeing could even contemplate trying to press on with it under the current circumstances. It’s frightening to see what they are quite prepared to put us through.