AIBU to ask you to explain what people mean by MH?

[BarryWhiteIsMyBrother]

Here on MN I keep on hearing people say that they MH is suffering for one reason or another which sometimes sounds to me just like stress. I used to think that MH issues are when someone is actually ill with a MH condition like bipolar, multiple personalities, etc. Serious stuff. I would hope not all the people saying their MH is suffering actually suffer from one of those MH conditions.

I have a very stressful job, one you can never really switch off from, I have to do a few hours' work even when I'm on holiday. But that was my choice when I decided to go down the path I chose. So I'm rarely 100% relaxed, but I wouldn't say my MH is suffering.

Am I completely misunderstanding what MH stands for?

I used to think that MH issues are when someone is actually ill with a MH condition like bipolar, multiple personalities, etc. Serious stuff.

Other MH conditions like anxiety or depression are also 'serious stuff.'

Mental health is in part connected to the world around you, but is more a response to the way your body and brain responds to it.

I had to leave a job because it was damaging my mental health. It wasn't particularly high-powered, though the people around me were largely aggressive narcissists, but various other people could do it fine. My mental health responded to it in such a way because it did.

It might be helpful to think of it the way that you might think of a virus. Some people are exposed and don't get ill. Some people might feel mildly ill for a few days, whereas other people need hospital care.

Plus, the obvious point that anyone could be struck down with a mental health condition of any sort at any time. There isn't an immunity. People who say their work is affecting their mental health are right to watch it and check it carefully because if it goes too far, if it goes unchecked, it can have catastrophic effects.

I really hope you continue to stay well.

I agree with those that said that everyone has mental health, be it good or bad, in the same way that everyone has physical health, be it good or bad.

Plenty of people do, however, say "I have mental health" when they would be more correct to say "I have a mental health condition" or "I have a mental illness."

Otherwise, you might as well say "I have physical health" when you have a cold/arthritis/etc.

MH stands for mental health (which I think you know).

Everyone has mental health, just like everyone has physical health.

You can be mentally well, unwell, or anywhere on a whole spectrum in between.

If someone says that their mental health is suffering, it doesn't mean necessarily they have a diagnosable condition. It just means they are struggling a bit.

Like someone who has flu or a cold is suffering with their physical health, but it doesn't mean they have to be at death's door. Sometimes they are and flu can be very bad. Or sometimes you can have cancer or any number of awful diseases.

Mental health is also a sliding scale.

When you're talking to people just start from a place of kindness. If someone tells you they are struggling with their mental health, just listen to them and be supportive, and don't judge or think you know better.

I also agree with people who say that you are minimising stress and its potential impact in your original post.

It's great that you are dealing with it, if indeed you are, and that you feel mentally healthy.

But there is a slight undertone in your post of "people should pull their socks up and stop whining about being stressed"... which I really disagree with.

Perhaps you could do a bit of googling and research about mental health. I recommend the "Mind" website as a good place to start.

People like you are what is wrong with society.

You're minimising stress.

Bet you say physical health lots.

Mental health is no different.

@BarryWhiteIsMyBrother - it sounds as if you think poor mental health is only valid if it is severe, and I would agree that that is wrong.

Someone who has a cold is ill - they aren’t as ill as someone with pneumonia, but they do still have an actual illness, and they have every right to look after themselves appropriately until they get better. And if they don’t look after themselves properly, the cold could become a chest infection, and could even worsen to the point of becoming pneumonia.

Mental health is no different - mental illnesses range from the very mild to the very severe, and people should get the help and support then need if they are suffering poor mental health, even if it isn’t at the most severe end of the scale.

Tackled early and correctly, a mild mental health issue may not become a more severe and debilitating one.

People like you are what is wrong with society. You're minimising stress*
I feel the opposite.

Everyone experience levels of stress in their lives. I suffered with I believe to be quite severe level when it started to affect my physical health and became debilitating.

But being removed from the trigger from my stress and with time to recover, I'm over it.

My friend who suffers from bipolar has to cope with it for the rest of her life. It's a completely different level.

I keep coming back to this thread and something that's been niggling at me.

I have bipolar disorder. It's a pain in the arse for all sorts of reasons, and I'm always pleased when people have a good understanding of it and get what that means.

The part that bothers me is when people don't get what that means. People like me can be considered, to quote the OP 'Serious stuff'. On the one hand, yes, it is serious stuff. On the other hand, labels like that can make me feel quite small. Like I'm being put in a box with a 'do not touch' sign on it. There is regularly an image of people with this disorder where they're behaving manically, running round the streets, uncontrolled, or lying in their bed unable to move, and often the in-between stuff gets lost.

I've been safe and stable for a long time now. Yes, it's hard. Yes, I'm on a cocktail of medication that is a bit soul destroying and has a whole heap of side-effects. Yes, I struggled to keep that job, like I mentioned. However, I'm also healthy, intelligent, have raised amazing children, can contribute to society. Hell, I work in a school for part of my life - everybody knows my condition, and everyone knows it's not dangerous, and if it is, I'll be the first to know. I now run my own business.

What then tends to happen is the, 'But it's not like REAL, real bipolar,' and I'm like, actually, yes it is. It is real, real bipolar. I'm not presenting with the typical behavior that someone might notice with someone with bipolar disorder right at this very minute, but it doesn't make it any less.

I think the point that I'm trying to make is this. I have bipolar disorder, have a help system, have had amazing medical assistance, all sorts of stuff.

Someone who is facing extreme work stress over a long period of time might descend, quite unnoticed, into a deep depression and may get to have suicidal thoughts and further.

In a lot of ways, in that situation, I'm the 'safe' one. I know what I am and where I stand. Someone who doesn't know, isn't checking themselves, is forcing them to go through something because of a misguided sense that they might be failures or for some other reason, then that person might fall apart really quickly and really suddenly and in catastrophic ways.

On MN, mental health is of paramount importance if it's your mental health or if you want to whinge about lockdown/a global pandemic.

If it's anyone inconveniencing your own life - your partner or relative or even child - they're being a CF, trying it on, need to get a grip, kick them out, LTB.

I use mental heath when talking about people i know who have diagnosed conditions such as depression, anxiety, disassociation etc

I dont tend to use it for feeling low or sad etc, but I appreciate that others think differently, and indeed that the meaning changes over time

I find it really difficult to talk about my mental health because of what someone (sorry - I should look back and see who it was because it was a good point) said about the difference between Mental Health and Mental Well-being and how these terms have become interchangeable.

Your mental well-being may not be good and you may be unhappy or stressed, but that doesn't mean you are mentally unwell.

But when I declared to my new employer that I have depression - as a mental health condition, I'm not sure how seriously that was taken. I had a lot of advice about mental well-being, minimising stress and helplines and counselling. Which is great - I think all employers should focus on these things for all of their employees - but my declaration wasn't 'I struggle with my work sometimes and can't cope'

My depression is non-reactive, recurring and treatment resistant. I'm under psychiatric care for it. It isn't triggered by events or by stress. My life can be going swimmingly and the black clouds can descend anyway. It can't always be fought. So my form of depression is different (not worse - just different) from someone suffering stress triggering a depressive episode or a marital break-up causing a depressive episode. Same word - different condition.

When I have an episode I'll often end up under the community mental health team or in hospital. I can be near comatose at times.

And I find myself wanting to scream out that this isn't because I find my work stressful, or I'm 'unhappy'. It just happens to me. I have an actual Mental Health condition. But, because it's 'just' depression, it is sort of shrugged off, I feel.

I look after my Mental Well-being, but for me, it's not like a vaccination against my Mental Health condition. Sometimes it makes a difference and sometimes I'll sink.

I also worry about the talk about 'resilience' that comes up a lot in workplaces. Stress, depression and anxiety are often concurrent and one can trigger the others. They are real mental health issues - and I think talking too much about resilience can lead to self-blame when stress is the cause of a downward spiral - as if you only succumbed because you weren't strong enough to cope.

I hate having this condition. I would do anything to find a stable solution.

But I really wish there was a different word for it so I don't have to answer questions like 'why do you feel like this? What happened?' Or hear kind well-meaning people tell me they were depressed when they lost their job, so they understand how I feel.

My life is knowing that this isn't going away. I will be ok for months, sometimes years, but it always comes back.

Sorry. Just venting now!

But in response to the OP, people are shortening Mental Health Conditions, Mental Health Problems, Mental well-being and Mental Health decline to just the phrase 'mental health' and it's a nonsensical term on its own.

You hear people say 'oh. It's sad. She has Mental Health'. Totally meaningless sentence!

@EdwardBear1920

I keep coming back to this thread and something that's been niggling at me.

I have bipolar disorder. It's a pain in the arse for all sorts of reasons, and I'm always pleased when people have a good understanding of it and get what that means.

The part that bothers me is when people don't get what that means. People like me can be considered, to quote the OP 'Serious stuff'. On the one hand, yes, it is serious stuff. On the other hand, labels like that can make me feel quite small. Like I'm being put in a box with a 'do not touch' sign on it. There is regularly an image of people with this disorder where they're behaving manically, running round the streets, uncontrolled, or lying in their bed unable to move, and often the in-between stuff gets lost.

I've been safe and stable for a long time now. Yes, it's hard. Yes, I'm on a cocktail of medication that is a bit soul destroying and has a whole heap of side-effects. Yes, I struggled to keep that job, like I mentioned. However, I'm also healthy, intelligent, have raised amazing children, can contribute to society. Hell, I work in a school for part of my life - everybody knows my condition, and everyone knows it's not dangerous, and if it is, I'll be the first to know. I now run my own business.

What then tends to happen is the, 'But it's not like REAL, real bipolar,' and I'm like, actually, yes it is. It is real, real bipolar. I'm not presenting with the typical behavior that someone might notice with someone with bipolar disorder right at this very minute, but it doesn't make it any less.

I think the point that I'm trying to make is this. I have bipolar disorder, have a help system, have had amazing medical assistance, all sorts of stuff.

Someone who is facing extreme work stress over a long period of time might descend, quite unnoticed, into a deep depression and may get to have suicidal thoughts and further.

In a lot of ways, in that situation, I'm the 'safe' one. I know what I am and where I stand. Someone who doesn't know, isn't checking themselves, is forcing them to go through something because of a misguided sense that they might be failures or for some other reason, then that person might fall apart really quickly and really suddenly and in catastrophic ways.

This was a brilliant post too. I totally agree.

As lots of people have said, mental health is a spectrum, just like physical health. Health problems can range from very minor things right up to life-threatening illnesses. I don't see why you wouldn't think the same applied to mental health.

I've seen threads like this before on MN, and I don't think they usually come from a place of kindness and understanding. Stress, anxiety and depression are serious problems, and they affect a worrying number of people. You can either decide that's because 'people are all snowflakes these days' or face the fact that there are aspects about our modern lives that are not doing our minds any favours.

Hi OP,

If you are in a leadership position could you take some time to learn about mental health (as opposed to mental illness) and how to support your team with improving their mental wellbeing? As a start you could look up www.mind.org.uk/workplace/coronavirus-and-work/tips-for-supporting-yourself-and-your-team/

Some of your strategies to succeed in your career would lead to others going off sick with stress or having poor intimacy or relationships or various other consequences so it might help to learn more about collective approaches to resilience and why one day, you might need a broader repertiore of coping strategies.

It is interesting that the language has changed to mental health, though.

DD1 has SN and she is very anxious about the pandemic. She often says "I hope I don't get mental health after this" or "I have a feeling I'm going to end up with mental health." Obviously, she's using the term wrongly, but she's expressing that she's worried that she will be mentally damaged by the experience of living through a pandemic. For her to be using the phrase, she must be hearing it somewhere.

Everyone has mental health. Every single person. Your mental health can have a serious, life long condition, just like your physical health. It can also have a serious condition which is temporary.

It can also have colds; bad moments were you're not feeling 100% in your head, but you dont have any names condition.

Stress does affect mental health. You dont end up with bi-polar disorder but you can end up struggling.

Everyone has mental health; good, bad, wobbling, having a bad moment.

Good point re MH vs mental illness and mental wellbeing. And I agree with those PPs who say that some people now talk about their MH suffering when they are down or stressed.

I believe that MH having become a bit of a catch all word is doing a disservice to those people whose MH is truly suffering (anxiety, depression, panic attacks, bipolar, etc).

My stress is self-inflicted because it's down to a career choice I made - so I don't talk about it. Not because I want to be a martyr but for the opposite reason.

But I wish then that if indeed some people are too quick to say their MH is suffering when they are missing their families, or are upset and sad because their relationship is ending, are scared of catching a virus or similar, they didn't fold themselves into the same category as people whose MH is truly suffering because that's unfair to the latter.

As usual on MN I'm sure the flame throwers are already being pointed in my direction of course.

@BarryWhiteIsMyBrother

Good point re MH vs mental illness and mental wellbeing. And I agree with those PPs who say that some people now talk about their MH suffering when they are down or stressed.

I believe that MH having become a bit of a catch all word is doing a disservice to those people whose MH is truly suffering (anxiety, depression, panic attacks, bipolar, etc).

My stress is self-inflicted because it's down to a career choice I made - so I don't talk about it. Not because I want to be a martyr but for the opposite reason.

But I wish then that if indeed some people are too quick to say their MH is suffering when they are missing their families, or are upset and sad because their relationship is ending, are scared of catching a virus or similar, they didn't fold themselves into the same category as people whose MH is truly suffering because that's unfair to the latter.

As usual on MN I'm sure the flame throwers are already being pointed in my direction of course.

I would say that someone who has anxiety, depression, bipolar disorder, etc., is mentally ill, rather than their mental health suffering. They are in a position where they have a condition they live with, rather than experiencing periodic stress.

You say that your stress is self-inflicted, but that doesn't mean that you don't have the right to talk about it. It doesn't matter if you could do something to change it, in terms of circumstances, because if you haven't done that, there is a reason.

I do think there are times when terminology matters though. I think for DD2, it's more helpful to say that she gets anxious in social situations, rather than saying that she 'has' social anxiety. But, if she chose to frame it as such, I wouldn't dismiss her.

I am glad mental health is discussed so much now and that children are taught that their mental health is as important as their physical health and needs to be given as much attention. I think it's positive.

And I'm not overly worried that people get lumped together under a 'mental health umbrella' because someone who is struggling in lock down is having a mental health problem and it's not wrong to frame it that way.

They wouldn't say 'I am really lonely and sad so I'm mentally ill' though. At least I haven't heard that happen. There is still a distinction.

Hopefully, the more we talk about it, the fewer people sink from having a mental health problem to a full blown illness.

I would like to ask you a question, though, OP, if you don't mind.

My DB is a bit of a workaholic. He loves his job. It is high pressure, high stress, long hours and sometimes his partner has to hide his laptop and phone so he HAS to stop working and relax occasionally (which he, counter-intuitively finds stressful).

I don't worry about his stress levels at the moment because he seems to cope, if not thrive on it.

I'm terrified of what happens later, though. Either burn out which may be gradual or he might hit a wall - or - my biggest worry, probably, his retirement. He has worked so hard and achieved so much in the hope of an early retirement, but I fear for his mental health when he stops and the stress and adrenaline grind to a halt.

What happens then?

Do you think that maybe your mental health could take a dive once the stress is all over? Because it is known to happen quite often. That build up of stress and the body's increased tolerance to it CAN have a long term impact even when you feel you're coping.

Sorry - I'm asking you to have a crystal ball! I'm just wondering whether you have any thoughts on that.

My stress is self-inflicted because it's down to a career choice I made - so I don't talk about it. Not because I want to be a martyr but for the opposite reason.

But you can be stressed and still have good mental health. Personally I am fed up with lockdown, missing my friends, worried about family who are unwell, but I would still say my mental health is good because I can cope with these stresses.

There will be others who are tipped into depression and even suicide by stressful jobs and the effects of lockdown. If your job was actually affecting your mental health you would be well advised to do something about it, but lots of people thrive on a certain amount of workplace stress.

But I wish then that if indeed some people are too quick to say their MH is suffering when they are missing their families, or are upset and sad because their relationship is ending, are scared of catching a virus or similar, they didn't fold themselves into the same category as people whose MH is truly suffering because that's unfair to t

Well there will always be those who take a week off work with a sniffle. But equally some people are really badly affected by respiratory viruses, perhaps due to underlying conditions. That doesn't mean they are as ill as someone who is in heart failure.

@BarryWhiteIsMyBrother

Good point re MH vs mental illness and mental wellbeing. And I agree with those PPs who say that some people now talk about their MH suffering when they are down or stressed.

I believe that MH having become a bit of a catch all word is doing a disservice to those people whose MH is truly suffering (anxiety, depression, panic attacks, bipolar, etc).

My stress is self-inflicted because it's down to a career choice I made - so I don't talk about it. Not because I want to be a martyr but for the opposite reason.

But I wish then that if indeed some people are too quick to say their MH is suffering when they are missing their families, or are upset and sad because their relationship is ending, are scared of catching a virus or similar, they didn't fold themselves into the same category as people whose MH is truly suffering because that's unfair to the latter.

As usual on MN I'm sure the flame throwers are already being pointed in my direction of course.

I think part of it is that to an extent the stigma surrounding mental ill health has reduced - for some conditions at least - and this has changed the language.

And, yes I have a history of anxiety, depression, self harm, disordered eating, and 25 years ago I probably would have said I was mentally ill while now I would say I have mental health issues or a history of mental health issues depending on how I was at the time and effort I was speaking to.

(While some of my problems are clearly reactions to certain events in my life, a large number of family members are very anxious people, so a predisposition to that seems to be a family trait, whether inherited or learnt and unfortunately for me events have tipped it over into something I need medication for. People are always shocked when I tell them, I am apparently very good at masking it.)

I don't think you have a good understanding of mental health issues - probably you have never suffered, so that's a good thing.
I have a diagnosis of bipolar disorder, but I'm not "mentally ill". For the last 12ish years I've been well. Well as in not medicated, hospitalised, not suicidal or dangerous.

But at certain times my MH has suffered through certain periods (job stress, adapting to new situations, bad news, etc). Not everyone who knows me knows that I have an actual diagnosed condition, but everyone (pretty much) knows that I sometimes struggle with my MH. For me this might be a difficult period where I take time off, sleep more, try and exercise, yoga, journal, therapy, to get back on track.

I don't know how ANYONE could know that these people saying "MH is suffering" don't have diagnosed or undiagnosed conditions, or whether they are overstating or understating their issues. But it's their business really isn't it? I try to take people's word on their own mind at face value.

Yes exactly @grollliffethedragon

Mens sana in corpore sano.