to give up on Amazon Prime

[whiterabbitsweets]

Don't get me wrong. Amazon customer service is excellent so I've no complaints there.

However, it's clear that they've boomed during the covid-19 pandemic whilst smaller businesses have suffered really badly.

These are the same small businesses that can't avoid tax on the scale that Amazon do. As a result, come payback time Amazon will continue to pay the bare minimum while any remaining SME's will likely face increases to help reduce the deficit.

Irrespective of opinions on tax avoidance I think we'd all be better off if business was done with smaller suppliers/shops. I may end up paying a bit more and waiting an extra day or so for delivery but my money will go to real people.

One thing that's come from this year has been the need to support local businesses, which I'm trying to do more of. Amazon just seems like an obvious company to drop completely.

If you pay the monthly subscription, you get free cloud photo storage, free kindle books, free basic music service, tv and video services plus the delivery. Definitely worth it for me.

What about 'Ring door bells' 'Hand print pay system' 'Street WiFi connection systems' all so over the top and a lot of control for one business. I swear they will take over the world! One bloody prime member at a time.

Amazon isn't cheaper for a lot of things and has a lot of cheap Chinese brands that are unknown quality. I only use it for things I cannot find elsewhere.

@Tanith

A friend runs a local small business and tried selling on Amazon a few years ago. Not long before Christmas, they wanted her to pay extra for a "Premium" listing. When she didn't, they marked her stuff as out of stock. Amazon is no friend of small businesses and has far too much control for one business.

Also, they don't check their marketplace sellers and their feedback system is easily manipulated. You don't know what you're buying, where it's coming from or even if it's safe.

Many thanks to all for the responses (pos and neg) but this stuck out as Amazon crapped all over sellers last year due to a glitch in their pricing algorithm. Many sellers ended up selling products at a loss, due to an Amazon fault but they refused to compensate.

I totally get the marketplace involves sellers but it must be better if I buy directly from a seller and cut out the middleman.

Amazon seem to treat everyone but its customers like crap. This is why it's so difficult to move away from them but think I'm done now.

The issue with small businesses is they understandably often cost more but also take more time to dispatch items. It isn't the case for all small businesses but a fair few of them have long turn-arounds and people quite simply can't be bothered waiting.

I sometimes buy winter hats for my DC from a small business and it takes 5-6 weeks for the hat to be delivered. It also costs twice as much as a hat would in a supermarket. I'm in a position to afford this but many aren't. It's the same with books, a small business might charge £10 for a book Amazon are selling for £5 and Amazon will have it delivered the following day too. So whilst Amazon continues to be so quick, cheap and convenient of course people are going to buy from them.

@BrumBoo

may end up paying a bit more and waiting an extra day or so for delivery but my money will go to real people.

This is also a line I hear a lot from the smug 'I shop better than thou' people. Many people aren't in a position to 'pay that bit more' on items, especially when buying for Christmas. Buying from Amazon means you can buy cheaper, and have the items delivered in bulk (much better for the environment than 200 little boxes of niche artesian crap turning up).

Definitely not being smug as I'm not rich and definitely not buying artisan stuff either.

Cost saving is an interesting one because someone always loses out somewhere and it's always us (as opposed to people like Bezos). In order to save, salaries are pushed down elsewhere. When salaries are suppressed we seek cheaper and cheaper goods and so the cycle continues.

Add to the fact that Amazon don't pay much corporation tax and it all makes us poorer still.

Being environmentally friendly is a difficult one to judge. If you're buying the cheapest stuff you can, it's likely to come from outside the UK, in which case a single delivery may be ok locally but not globally.

I buy unique stuff from locals. Otherwise there is no difference for me whether I buy it in supermarket or Amazon.

Can people say what kind of small businesses are they talking about? Quite frankly at this day an age, if someone opens (yet another) "bargain hut" with goods you can buy in poundland (and they probs actually did) or whatnot, they can't be surprised people don't come much.

However, services, especially good services are usually very much appreciated. And shops with not so common stuff. Baby clothes with good service, farmers markets, artisan food, tool shops with KNOWLEDGEABLE staff (pleeeease, can't bear the "dunno" service), and so on are something local people use and always will.

I ordered thing from local pharmacy (franchise). 2 weeks on and nothing. No thing and no response to me. I did however get a review prompting email. Second time in my life I gave 1 start review. And ordered the thing on amazon. Only after the review I got some communication and refund. Sad.

I've noticed that a lot of small to midsized merchants are now using an e-commerce platform called Shopify. They're now adding logistics and are giving amazon some real competition.

www.wsj.com/articles/online-retail-provider-shopify-adds-fulfillment-service-11560956401

@whiterabbitsweets, ok so what other companies do you actively not use due to dubious ethical and legal dealings, or is it just Amazon you (and several other posters) have decided to jump on with little idea of how corrupt big business is in general?

Most of the ‘local businesses’ on my village high street are vanity projects run by people who don’t need the money. At least one (now closed) was a front for drug dealing.

The traditional high street is dead and we are still working out how to replace it (other than with estate agents and coffee shops), but clearly the future is evolving into out of town huge supermarkets supplemented by warehouse based online shopping. This change began years and years ago.

I love Amazon. I do not love any of our local businesses, most of which have given me incredibly bad service at some point. I’m not part of this ‘shop local and hate Amazon’ drive, that as far as I can see is often just a way for people to feel morally superior while cramming into tiny boutiques instead of keeping their germs at home in a pandemic.

Skysblue, it's far more than being snobbish and drifting around local boutiques 'sourcing' artisan products.

As several people on this thread have pointed out, Amazon hold all the cards when it comes to dealing with small businesses who sell through their portal. They make many demands.

The fact that people shop at Amazon rather than UK based companies (not even bricks and mortar, but just companies who pay tax here) means that the UK tax take is reduced - this affects every single one of us. M&S paid more tax in the UK last year than Amazon, on a fraction of the sales.

Amazon are partnering up in the food delivery business. It won't be long before we are paying Amazon a % of pretty much every single thing we buy from books, computer equipment, gardening equipment to tins of baked beans.

Previous posters have pointed out that they are employing people when many are losing their jobs.......yes, but they are also at the forefront when it comes to automation, so the thousands of jobs won't last long, only until the job can be automated. It's like Uber complaining about the danger to the jobs of their poor drivers when London didn't renew Uber's licence, and simultaneously being one of the major players in driverless car tech.

It concerns me on so many levels, and I think we're walking blindly into something damaging, just so we can buy something cheap and have it delivered 'next day'.

@Tanith

A friend runs a local small business and tried selling on Amazon a few years ago. Not long before Christmas, they wanted her to pay extra for a "Premium" listing. When she didn't, they marked her stuff as out of stock. Amazon is no friend of small businesses and has far too much control for one business.

Also, they don't check their marketplace sellers and their feedback system is easily manipulated. You don't know what you're buying, where it's coming from or even if it's safe.

Thanks for this info. I was looking to place a repeat order which was out of stock so I went to the retailers website and will order from there - where they have plenty

YABVU. When are people going to stop whinging about Amazon?

If small shops and businesses could offer what Amazon does then fair enough, but they can’t, and unless they up their game I’m not interested.

When Amazon is offering the same products at a fraction of the price as anywhere else with next day delivery I’m not going elsewhere.

I am a prime subscriber and use it for free delivery, prime tv and kindle books. I find it good value.

Lots of small businesses sell through amazon and their warehouse and vans are not staffed by robots but by real people who need those jobs, i have a couple of regular delivery drivers who are lovely,

If I need something I tend to look online and don’t automatically go to amazon but they often have what I want, at the best price, with the fastest (free) delivery. It would be hard to justify buying from elsewhere.

I don’t tend to go to actual shops anyway, even before covid and I haven’t been to out high street since probably last December. Oh wait, my son had a haircut in August. We didn’t visit any shops though. I do all my grocery shopping online,

Some local businesses have moved online due to covid and I do support those - a cafe or greengrocer offering delivery. I wish more of them offered online services but since they don’t I will stick with Amazon.

Amazon buys stuff from us. Amazon sells it, not on our behalf but from Amazon.

We also sell our stuff through other outlets, both online and in shops. What matters to us is that people buy it, not who is bloody selling it.

I am always amazed by how little people understand about economics. So easy to have a knee jerk instead of actually using your brain, isn't it?

I try hard to support my local businesses. Many do now do business via Amazon now, which is really useful (win win), and if you ever need to return anything to Amazon my experience has been very positive. Also in terms of value for money i have to say its good both for the streaming and the postage.

I agree and a lot of local shops have gone out of business near me. I don't want to lose the others and they don't sell online.

[quote BrumBoo]@whiterabbitsweets, ok so what other companies do you actively not use due to dubious ethical and legal dealings, or is it just Amazon you (and several other posters) have decided to jump on with little idea of how corrupt big business is in general?[/quote]
Personally, I think it's up to everyone to use a little due diligence when spending their money. That said it's becoming increasingly difficult to ensure that we use 100% ethical shops/suppliers etc. I mentioned in my OP that I'm looking at my shopping in general.

I'm not being sanctimonious about it but it's well known that Amazon's tax contributions are minimal, they treat sellers terribly and are a bad employer. I guess Amazon is an easy one due to the sheer diversity of what they sell.

This thread isn't intended to judge anyone who still uses Amazon but just a discussion. For info I don't use mainstream coffee shops and am trying to buy direct where possible. My daughter is vegan and we're eating more vegan meals as a result. As we're saving money we can use the local butcher for what little meat/poultry we eat.

Haffiana, I understand economics only too well

@Haffiana

Amazon buys stuff from us. Amazon sells it, not on our behalf but from Amazon.

We also sell our stuff through other outlets, both online and in shops. What matters to us is that people buy it, not who is bloody selling it.

I am always amazed by how little people understand about economics. So easy to have a knee jerk instead of actually using your brain, isn't it?

IMHO you have little understanding of economics or just don't care. I think both from your post.

Doesn't it matter to you that the UK's tax revenue is impacted directly by the way companies operate?

Irrespective of opinions on tax avoidance, this country would be better off with more tax revenue. That's indisputable.

If you don't care then that's fine but is a bit rich to want people to use their brains when wanting more for this country.

Please let us know what your company is so I can avoid it.

I run a business

As if small lovcal businesses don't cheat the tax man😂😂😂

I run a business and it's important to me how I operate. Personally I value good business ethics over profit.

Comes down to they are easy, convenient, reasonably priced if not cheapest and I can get pretty much anything through them. They’ve been incredibly useful throughout lockdown. They also have loads of kids to shows which was also great through lockdown.

I don’t have anything against small local businesses but round here unless you want food, beauty products, pharmacy products or a charity shop, there are no such businesses. “Mumpreneur” type enterprises on Facebook selling handmade kids harem dungarees using organic jersey with scandi patterns on for £25-£40 a pop aren’t much help if I want to buy all my children’s winter clothes at a reasonable price from just one or two places. Similarly, if I want a pair of headphones or a TV, there is no “local business” selling those around here unless you count Currys or Tesco. Even if there was a small local business trying to sell those things, they’re not going to have the range of goods nor be as cheap, and I don’t want or need “friendly service” or “great advice”, I just want to buy a set of headphones at 2am because the last ones broke and have them a day later, without having to go anywhere or do anything.

If I wanted something niche like a handmade sculpture or fancy candles or something I might look for an independent business. But most of my shopping is standard consumer goods, mostly made in Asia, and sold by large chains. And for that Amazon is no worse than any other.

My friend's small business is on Amazon so YABU. She wouldn't get the viewers = hopefully buyers if she was only on local selling sites.

If local independent business could match what Amazon Prime offers in terms of price and fast delivery, as well as decent customer service. Then I will stop using them.

I like to support small businesses, when and where I can do so, but I am busy and do not have the time to traipse around the shops looking for items that are often out of stock and receive bad customer service from surly retail staff.

I will continue to go for the most convinent option for me and continue to use Amazon buying from smaller and bigger businesses on their platform.

Independent shops often charge more for an identical product or a similar one on Amazon.

Why on earth even if it is affordable to me, would I pay over the odds for a product just because it is sold in an independent shop or claims to be artisan?

YABU