Covid Christmas PIL dilemma

[Cheeseandwhine81]

Hi all, first time poster and long time lurker here. I’m sure there will be a lot of people in a similar situation over the festive season, less of an ‘AIBU’ and more of a ‘What would you do?’

SIL lives in a foreign country with 6m old baby that PIL have not been able to visit yet due to travel restrictions etc.

They plan to visit her just before Xmas and visit us 4 days after they return.

We’re slightly nervous about this given the fact they’ll be on a plane, at a busy airport etc and I will be around 29 weeks pregnant at the time of their visit.

Telling them they can’t come is going to cause a LOT of upset. We have a 3 year old DD who they are desperate to see after not seeing her for several months. DP has told his Dad that we’re a bit worried and so far the opinion seems to be that we are being neurotic and it will all be fine because they won’t go out while there.

So as not to drip feed - I’m not sure they’ll be able to keep to ‘no contact’ if they do visit (We did a socially distanced visit in summer and a big part of the day was spent responding to comments about how sad it was that they couldn’t have hugs and the statistics say they’ll probably be fine etc etc)

It’s frustrating because no one wants this. But we will absolutely be to blame if we ask them not to come.

Suggestions on how to deal with this with minimal upset? Or opinions on whether we are in fact a pair of ‘hypochondriacs’ and the risk is low enough not to worry.

It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks! Noone here, online, real life.

If you and your DH do not want to open your home to that level of risk then you say no!

• I am pregnant
• DD is 3
• we can't afford to self isolate if anything happens
• our choice. No!

The pretend you're isolating ruse is perfect. Avoid arguments.

I dont personally fancy sitting on a plane for hours with a bunch of strangers and I'm not too worried about covid. Having heard sad stories of pregnant women dying with it then I would be wary if I were you. But to be fair my friends who are midwives sat there are a lot of pregnant women with covid and they are fine but its not a nice birth experience because the midwives have to get rigged up in so much PPE and it's less personal.

Is there not compulsory quarantine for that country? Most countries are on the list. If not you need to stand firm, not worth the risk

is there statistically an increased risk to the pregnancy from Covid?

The risk increases during the third trimester when a woman’s respiratory system is already put under strain by the sheer size of the baby/womb. Your organs are squished to make way for the melon sized baby basically and you can’t breathe as easily so contracting a respiratory viral infection is not ideal. Some women have had to have emergency c-sections prematurely because they plainly haven’t been able to breathe...

Anyway, OP I wouldn’t risk this either. Ask them to visit you before they go.

I'd go with nope.

But surely the liklihood is they'll have to isolate for 2 weeks on their return anyway?

If not, I'd white lie it - oh no, we've been contacted by track and trace and we've got to isolate for two weeks. Such a shame, we we were SO looking forward to seeing you.

oblada of course there is a risk at airports and on a plane. NZ had no cases then when cases started up they traced it to two British people who went to a funeral. Later another cluster on the north island and where was the connection...the airport! One case wasn’t the airport and they were puzzled. It turns out although he didn’t go the airport he was a cargo handler so now they quarantine their cargo for longer than the four days. There are hardly any planes in or out of NZ I know because my daughter and partner had to apply for another visa because they couldn’t get out. The reason NZ closed it down quickly was that the PM closed it down quickly with hard and fast rules that people are obeying.

OP you are not ‘neurotic ‘ at all. You have very precious baby and you shouldn’t take the risk. I wouldn’t worry about upsetting them what if they came and gave Covid to you and your unborn child? You could lose the baby or yourself or both how would relations be then?
There was a young woman that lost her, life they managed to save the baby with EMCS. Would your husband want that?
As others have said have a meeting a few weeks later. They should be in quarantine anyway when they come back I would remind them of that. It is ridiculous that people are just expected to follow the rules at home here. NZ and Australia you have to be quarantined. NZ aren’t letting anyone back in if they leave. Australia are just taking Australian citizens at the moment as they realised their mistake about not quarantining people coming into the country when a large spike occurred.

Please don’t take the risk. I know a young family man who had Covid and is still off work and has health problems 10 months after. He was a healthy fit young dad now he can barely walk 1/2 a mile. Don’t take the risk with your unborn child or yourself it isn’t worth it.

Bowerbird5 - yes there is a risk in airports and planes but there is also a risk (possibly higher) in going to a supermarket/restaurant etc in tier 3/tier 2. It is about assessing the risk but taking relevant information into account. If the PIL are going to a safe country and respecting social distancing generally I'm not sure I see a higher risk. If the PIL are v laid back about social distancing then unless OP is in tier 1 I don't see how them going to see the SIL makes any real difference really and the OP, if worried, shouldn't meet with them at all, travel abroad or not.

@Cheeseandwhine81 this is your life, your health, and your baby.

There is a virus kicking about that isn’t on the retreat as much as it should be for the level of mixing that’s being allowed over Christmas

I believe, as has been the case in other countries, that our shower of a government should be clear with people that while some degree of mixing is allowed it should not necessarily take place unless there is a real need to do so.

I want this lockdown stuff to stop. I’ve not had too much disruption in many areas of my life, but the lack of being able to swim, to see friends and just potter about weighs ever more heavily the longer this goes on.

Christmas is important to some, but not to all, and not at any price. I’d rather we don’t do Christmas now so we can get some normality back sooner in our lives

You are going to have to be brave and just be clear with them that you won’t stand in the way of them seeing your sister, but that they can’t do that and still come to you afterwards

Tell them it’s been a hard decision to make, but that you and h are as one on this and the risks are too high and frankly not worth taking at this time.

Don’t invite or encourage negotiation, you’re clear on why your doing this so just end the conversation if they keep pushing things

*you’re

Thanks so much everyone for all your replies

I’ll try and cover off answers to some of the questions here:

• No quarantine required on return

• PIL live around 3 hours away so sadly we don’t get to see them that frequently. They booked last min and fly pretty soon so no time for a visit beforehand. We could go and stay with them for the evening on New Years Eve which I think might keep the peace (that will be 7 days after their return). And I think beyond that there’s a good chance we’ll go in to yet another lockdown in Jan, preventing a belated Christmas.

• We’re in Tier 2 but have been pretty much shielding. No visits to supermarkets etc, we’re fortunate to be able to work from home and haven’t socialised with any friends/family (it’s all a bit depressing but we know lots of friends/colleagues who are doing the same at the moment to protect the clinically vulnerable relatives that will form part of their Christmas bubble).

If I wasn’t pregnant we’d probably accept the risk. I’m just putting the shielding thing on the list of things I’ll do to protect this baby (along with not drinking wine or sleeping on my back ). It seems like a small but temporary sacrifice.

Would they be open to celebrating 'Christmas' with you all later? I know the rules give a small window, but if its less of a risk for you all to gather a week later than go for it.

FWIW I have specifically told my family that DP and I are spending Christmas alone this year because I know none of them will adhere to distancing if they visit us or we them.

I think it'd be such a shame to waste all the efforts we've made this year when a vaccine is now so very close.

Can you say your midwife has advised you against contact with those who have so recently been abroad? Considering no one really knows the full implications of risks of having Covid whilst pregnant.

There is no reason for a midwife to advise not to see people who have been recently in a country not subject to quarantine rules tbh.
It's absolutely fine for anyone to choose to shield but to consider it's fine to mix with others who, for instance, have gone to restaurants/supermarkets/pubs but not with others who have recently returned from a country considered safe seems a little bit irrational to me.

Thanks @oblada you’ve raised a very good question. Perhaps the question I should be asking is ‘Is it possible to socially distance on a plane?’

I think that’s our main concern.

I feel as though popping in to the shop for 10 mins, while wearing a mask and maintaining 2 metre distance is less risky than sitting next to someone on a plane for 8 hours, especially when masks are removed for meals etc. While we trust PIL will be sensible during their trip - they have no knowledge/control over the people they are in very close proximity to for a long time.

(But as per my my comment above we haven’t been socialising with anyone at all so we haven’t come in to contact with people visiting supermarkets either unless it’s for medical appointments etc)

Maybe ask your PIL how the trip was etc. My parents and brother have had to come over quite a few times since Covid and from their experience it was v safe. It was from France to UK though so a short trip but with quarantine either way...
But I don't have any personal experience of it. I expect planes have to be covid safe so less people on the planes, masks etc.

Maybe as a compromise you could ask them to have a test when they get back and not visit until they’ve had a negative test?

On another note I don’t think pregnant people are statistically at any more risk than anyone else so I think you are worrying unnecessarily but I know lots of people get quite anxious during pregnancy so don’t blame you for worrying.

Maybe sth like that is useful ? www.newscientist.com/article/2252152-how-likely-are-you-to-be-infected-by-the-coronavirus-on-a-flight/

There may be more recent information I don't know as I've not researched it in depth.

I dont think it matters what the risks or rules are, the fact is there is a virus that has so far ended 60000 lives in the uk, many of which were elderly and already unwell but some were not. Nothing has changed, the virus is in the community, albeit in very small numbers in some parts. If you dont want to see them because you dont want to put yourself at risk however small or large that might be, that is your decision to make, not theirs and it would be unfair and unreasonable to put any pressure on you to facilitate a visit. If you cant sit at a restaurant table with people who are not from your household, then its probably also not a good idea to be cooped up on a plane with strangers

It's not unreasonable to see them and equally, it's not unreasonable to refuse. I think you should do whatever you choose, having weighed up the various pros and cons - but certainly don't feel guilty about saying they can't visit. You have to be happy with the risk, small though it maybe. If you did catch covid from them and became seriously ill, you want to know it was your own decision to take that risk and not due to pressure from someone else.