Anyone who sells on eBay – this one’s for you

[SuzieBishop]

So selling something on eBay and postage is set at £3.40 - buyer buys and messaged me asking if I will refund the difference of the postage as it is small and might go as a large letter so would only be £1.10.
I initially found this a bit cheeky as postage is normally set around £3.10 to £3.40-50 on most items on eBay. Yes I set it up £3.40 to make a bit of a profit.
I’ve sold a good few things and some have gone just £1.10 but no one has ever messaged me to ask for the money back. The postage is the postage and it says in your terms that there are no refunds. Is this person being cheeky? I can’t decide.
So my AIBU is should I refund it as they have the balls to ask (YABU) or say no and keep the profit (YANBU). Thanks!

I do wish people would actually the thread. The op charged for a small parcel, the buyer wanted the postage reduced BEFORE the package was sent as she ASSUMED it was go as a large letter... The op got to the post office and it did in fact go as a small parcel. The op did NOTHING wrong and did put down the correct amount of postage for the item sent!

Time. Packaging. Getting to post office. All your costs.

This is simply about perception.
Scenario 1 - you sell an item for £6 and charge £4 p+p. P+P seems disproportionate to the customer for a small item. The result is poorer feedback/stars on ebay.
Scenario 2 - you sell the same item for £10 with 'free' p+p. Customer is happy and doesn't feel cheated.
The result is EXACTLY the same for you (fees on postage are the same as for your item) - but a better experience for the customer.
Ebay recognise this and therefore reward free postage with higher visibility of listings.

Ah, thanks a lot for that info, HostessTrolley.

I buy loads of things via eBay- I'm not a seller!

Perhaps it's just me but I never pay too much attention to the postage. I just look at the total cost including postage. I'm either happy with that or not and if not - very rarely - I don't buy. End of!

I definitely wouldn't refund any postage OP. If it's too expensive for her then just cancel the sale and relist. Why should you go out in the freezing cold to post for just over £1?

I sell everything (if private sales) with 'free postage' to avoid this nonsense.

Where delivery charge is clearly stated as £3.40 and then demanding a reduction only after purchase is blatent cheeky fuckery in my mind. they obviously can't read & will blithely insist on changing any other term of the contract they just agreed to when agreed to purchase, just because they want to. Whatevs.

I'm selling some stuff for charity.
Selling price = £4
stated postage charge = £3.80
Actual RM 2nd class charge = £3.10
3.80 = 3.10 = 70p
Ebay fees = 0 (charity sale)
Paypal fees = 20p + 28p = 48p
my stated charge for tape & packaging = 0
my supposed 'profit' = 22p

No eejit has yet demanded that I give them back 70p, but I presume that moment is coming.

@SuzieBishop

So just back from the post office so it went as £3.10 as it didn’t fit through the wee postbox thing.

For future reference, that £3.10 is Royal Mail small parcel second class standard. Signed for would have been £4.10 and would have given you a tracking reference to confirm delivery

Of the £3.40 you charged, PayPal & eBay are going to charge 46p in fees
As it cost £3.10 you have 'lost' 16p and you don't have any backup if they claim it doesn't arrive

....

Yep, i send everything second class signed for and charge the customer for it. I stopped doing normal post the first time a customer pulled the ‘i didn’t receive it’ trick.

It is postage and packing

That includes your time spent getting it to the post office, possibly including the petrol.

So yes, it is sometimes more than the actual cost of postage, but most people underestimate the packing costs too.
A new padded A4 envelope bought in the post offices costs £2.25.

I reuse a lot of envelopes, but when I have a lot to post I run out, and don't always have time to get cheap ones.

I had one buyer refund me postage, as it hadn't cost him as much as £3.40 or whatever it was, but I absolutely wasn't expecting it, and was fine with paying the listed postage price, so hadn't questioned it. There are also costs involved in wrapping goods to post. Neither of us would be retiring on the profit.

I would say no, postage is as stated and also covers packing materials and admin time.

PS
I’ve just realized that the table I shared earlier in the tread was the wrong page of my spreadsheet with the wrong formula!
(I had originally added 13.4% onto prices rather than reverse engineer the 13.4% deduction from the total

The ‘right’ price to charge for £4.10 Royal Mail signed for taking into account fees is £4.73

Also I’m sure someone has already said but eBay also charge you commission on the postage and package fees as well now.

Royal Mail gives proof of posting receipts now which allow tracking AFAIK.
The Pr-of-P, I believe , nominally cover up to £20 value, but only if a purchase receipt is produced by sender to show that the item cost that much. So basically, if one sells an item 2nd hand and it has no receipt for recent purchase, then seller could claim 0 back for it -- from Royal Mail. This is not a problem though, because Ebay accepts the tracked proof of posting number. Ebay will not give refund if buyer claims never received yet tracking (proof of posting) shows item was delivered.

my experience is that if If I post something worth < £15, untracked or with simple Pr-of-P, it always arrives. If I don't track it (identical packaging), and it's worth > £15 ish, then strangely enough, item rarely arrives. It's amazing how those thieving posties can tell the value of item inside.

Because of course the posties can't tell. They haven't a clue what's inside or which packages are valuable if packaged the same. But the buyer knows. The buyer knows exactly which items are worth trying to pretend never received...

A new padded A4 envelope bought in the post offices costs £2.25.

Pack of 4 or 5 for a quid in Poundland.

What is the actual point in not offering free (i.e. baked into the price) postage nowadays? You avoid buyers quibbling it, avoid getting shunted down the listings, don't pay any less in fees.

Unless you're hoping to make your item (i.e. the cost to the customer of getting it) look cheaper to people who can't add the two elements together, seriously what is the benefit in charging separately?

Whether they're businesses or private sellers, I tend to subconsciously view sellers who give an all-in 'to your door' price as more serious, honest and capable than those who (whether intentionally or not) seem to be setting a price and then wanting to add more. I know the postage prices aren't hidden, but it just seems somehow more 'coy' to me.

I think the same about websites and shops that are clearly aimed at selling to individuals (rather than business, who can often claim it back) who will quote you a price excluding VAT. At worst, they're trying to fool me with artificially low prices before springing an extra 20% on me at the final stage and at best, they look like they aren't able to reliably and reputably manage basic costings of running a business before setting and presenting an end price to the customer that covers their required costs and margins.

I think Ebay is cheeky as it charges 10% on postage so £3.10 is too little so I factor this in to postage costs.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll

A new padded A4 envelope bought in the post offices costs £2.25.

Pack of 4 or 5 for a quid in Poundland.

yes. As I pointed out, you can't always get to somewhere to buy them. There is no poundland near here.

I've only had to do that once, but still.

@woodhill

I think Ebay is cheeky as it charges 10% on postage so £3.10 is too little so I factor this in to postage costs.

They do it to stop people getting away with Ebay fee avoidance. Before they started doing this, people would constantly do things like sell an item for 99p with £9 postage.

I'm going to say it again: offering free postage is so much less stress all round. It potentially attracts more customers, but mainly it makes things easier for me as a seller, stops people sending me CF messages, stops me from worrying every time I go to the Post Office, and means that I always get an automatic 5 out of 5 for postage ratings.

You aren't supposed to charge for packaging now, the rules have changed. I always refund the difference.

All parcels have a tracking number that will show in the tracking system as delivered. Ebay accept this as proof now, they didn't before. So no need for signed services.

Honestly I just start items that would’ve been 99p + postage at £4 with ‘free’ postage now. Saves the stress of anyone arguing about postage costs.

As I pointed out, you can't always get to somewhere to buy them. There is no poundland near here.

You can buy them online - on eBay, in fact! - for between 25p and 50p each, depending on quantity. Surely everybody knows that buying packaging products from the PO will inevitably cost you a hefty premium? They're aimed at the captive market who need to send something in an emergency and will prioritise a convenient one-stop 'shop' over wisely planned, cost-efficient buying - or those who aren't aware of the alternatives.

Although you may not be a business, using eBay as a seller does require some commitment, effort and forward-planning on your part. You can't just leave it to your buyers to pick up the slack of your paying premium prices and using inefficient methods in supplying their goods - not if you value your feedback record, at any rate.

I never make a profit on the postage as they can then leave bad feedback about it. I have refunded in the past without being asked as it seems unfair to overcharge.

If it goes large letter you need to send it recorded delivery or you wont have a tracking code. Taking this into account its not much cheaper.

Thinking logically, I would say that the postage is actually more for the benefit of the seller than it is the buyer. The buyer will probably have a number of options for buying X item, including different sellers on eBay, other online shops/marketplaces and physical shops. Without being able to offer to get it to them, you're instantly striking yourself off from being one of their (or anybody else's) purchasing options and thus will be left with unsold goods.

They aren't choosing to buy it from you because they have selected you as their dream seller or as somebody whom they wish to support/subsidise - it's because the price and convenience to them suits them more than any other seller.

Just as I expect Tesco to have something I want to buy on their shelves for me to pick up, buy and take home - if they told me I would need to go to their depot to fetch it or wanted to charge me a contribution for the diesel for their employee to collect it on my behalf; I'm not going to entertain that added hassle and expense for a moment if Asda has an identical one there all ready and waiting for me to purchase at the advertised sale price and then take it away.