What's more import? Healthy weight or healthy diet?

[Almostslimjim]

Because I can't have both.

Last year I was obese, BMI of 30.9. I was a slender (skinny intact) teen and slim up until 25 when weight just piled on and in 5 years I went from a BMI of 21 to 31 and yoyo'd since then, never getting below 26. I've tried every diet under the sun. I've tried most exercises. I can lose weight, but I can't maintain the loss. I've tried the "changes in life style" etc and I've had therapy. It essentially boils down to the fact I like to eat crap and always have. My weight gain started when I started eating 3 'proper' meals. So I've gone back to how I ate as a teen/ early 20s - eating exactly what I want, when I want and absolutely nothing else. So today. I've had nothing but black coffee until 8pm when I've eaten half a pack of biscuits, a very large bowl of cereal and half a bar of galaxy (melted in to the cereal).

Yesterday was similar. In fact most days are like that. Occasional take away pizza or a croissant for breakfast. And we've had 2 roast dinners in the last month. I made spag bol in October which I ate for a week.

My calorie intake is around 1500 per day. So I'm losing weight and keeping it off. I've maintained this 'diet' for over a year now and lost 3+ stone.

But it's not healthy. Not that I can tell that- my skin and hair is fine and I actually feel better than I have in years!

But surely it can't be healthy?

Prior to last year, I ate 3 healthy (lots of lean protein and fresh veg) AND crap. I can't cut the crap (when I do I end up binging massively) but I can take or leave the rest of it.

Suggestions please?

I've done 6 months of 'clean' eating etc but the desire for crap food never leaves.

Try one day of clean eating a week. Then 2, 3, building it up until 6 days a week. Have one day a week to eat the junk you want.

It's not just about your skin and hair. What about your immune system and cells repairing damage when you cut yourself etc? Being able to concentrate? How is your mental health when you wat like that all the time?

My mental has actually been the best it's been in years! I think lockdown 1 really helped it though to be honest. And not worrying about what I'm eating. My concentration is fine (I'm a medic). My concern is about what I should be eating.

It sounds like the problem with your previous regime is that you were eating three meals a day whether you were hungry or not. You can move to just eating when you are hungry but still make an effort for more of those meals to be a bit healthier than they are. It doesn’t have to be fully one it the other. It can be as simple as sneaking some extra veg in that spaghetti bolognaise or swapping out a couple of the snacks for something a bit lower sugar. Make small changes and see what is sustainable and it adds up to marginal gains over time.

Honestly, I think healthy eating is an average guide and some people are just different. I feel good when eating the crap I like and feel weak, tired, bloated, anxious and miserable on a 'healthy' regime. My DP makes fun of me but even he can't deny that my energy, sleep etc is great after a pizza but after a pile of vegetables I'll be weak and in pain for a day.

Trisolaris not really. I'd only eat proper meals when hungry, but then eat crap whether hungry or not, simply because I wanted to. I also tended to be hungry at traditional meal times but suspect that was slightly due to conditioning.

I worry that if I make my 'meals' as they currently are more healthy I'll just be adding calories to my day, it won't stop me eating the crap.

Pukkatea interesting.

I wouldn't say I feel weak and in pain but I definitely don't feel great. And I definitely feel more guilty.

I do know others who basically exist on crap, and are slim, ones an aerobics instructor though so that explains her.

It sounds like the way I ate in my 20s when I was trying to get on top of a really challenging career with very unpredictable and long hours. Is that where you are?

I think it might be that you have issues around eating that you need resolving. Your current diet sounds a lot like an ED (and I should know, I have a binge/purge ED and am currently ridiculously obsessive.) I just wanted to sympathise really!

No, but that's where I was before I started gaining weight. I'm now late 30s, established in the career.

100% a healthy diet is best.

You could be at a perfectly healthy weight, BMI of 22, and have a pretty horrific eating disorder.
Wish I wasn’t speaking from experience but it’s surprisingly common.

You just get told obesity is the leading or second leading cause of practically every disease (it is). So it makes sense that slimmer is healthier, but I assume the theory is a healthy diet doesn't lead to obesity?

Are you living for the moment or planning for the future?

Eating rubbish will affect your long term health. You will likely be an older person on a lot of medication / with no teeth.

Why not a middle ground? Don't eat til midday. Have a healthy lunch then have a few bits of crap for dinner?

At least supplement your junk with the odd plate of veggies and fruits. And fibre. If it's the sugar you like, try making date balls. Or banana bread. Or homemade flapjacks. Porridge with banana and no sugar chocolate sauce.

I think I am a lot like you!
I’m thinking exercise might be the way out? I feel like I want to eat healthy after exercising, and if I’m burning more calories then I can do so without cutting the crap?

I would love to say health but I don’t actually agree. DP has a strange relationship with food. He only eats chocolate and crisps (literally) every day. He might have chicken and chips for dinner but that’s it. He doesn’t gain weight, has BMI of 19 and good muscle mass. His metabolic age is 17. He did some medical trials recently and they deemed him very fit and healthy.

He only eats shit.
It’s just not worth it. Go for the body.

I had a very similar conversation earlier today. My parents have found an old video of us around 10 years ago on new year's eve, dad was saying how skinny I was then, compared to now. But back then I was smoking, skipping meals and when I was eating it was junk. I don't smoke anymore, eat way better but I'm around 4 stone heavier than then.
I know if I started smoking again my weight would plummet but I'd rather stay as i am now than do that.

The crap biscuits,cereal,chocolate,you describe is not wholly devoid of nutritional value. It's not as if you were simply supping sugar or honey. Breakfast cereals frequently feature in recommend healthy diets because in UK they are artificially "reinforced" with vitamins. The biscuits probably have some of the vegetable oil currently deemed necessary. Chocolate has B12, magnesium etc. I once followed the USDA app. to calculate what minerals/vitamins etc were in my meals so I could be sure that despite following around 1500 kcals I was adequately nourished. Light lunch and evening meal only. I went mad trying to work out a suitable diet. I just could not hit all the targets. Eventually,in a fit of pique I entered for lunch what was the traditional and wildly "unhealthy" lunch for members of my profession - a Snickers bar and a bag of crisps. Bingo! All targets met with that.

I've maintained my healthy weight and BMI for about 20 years by eating when I'm hungry, which is normally once or twice a day.

You don't HAVE to eat three + times a day: just eat when you want to and listen to your own body.

Oh, and stop snacking.

Seriously, the vast majority of people in the Western world can crack on quite happily on a couple of meals a day, and plenty of water.

A huge majority of us eat too much, too frequently.

Healthy food is all well and good - but as you've demonstrated you can indeed eat too much of it and gain weight. Some folks are simply better in a big evening meal. I swear I could live off a massive full English breakfast, one meal per day.

If you ate Spag bol for a week it's not ideal but I'm guessing it had protein, veg, fats in it?

Instead we're encouraged to eat all this stuff, hummus and veg, yogurt for dessert etc etc but it does all add up calorie wise.

Interesting dilemma.
It seems you are healthier on the crap diet because a BMI of 21 must be better for you than one of 30.
I agree with what many others have said, carry on as you are but compromise with adding some fresh fruit and veg now and then.
I'm 62 and my BMI is 21 and has been all my life. I eat twice a day, some healthy stuff and some rubbish.

I feel like saying healthy diet, but then didn’t recent studies conclude that slim smokers were still healthier than obese non smokers?

I think that if you want to be healthy you just have to force yourself not to eat crap. Plenty of people give up smoking which is for the large majority much harder than resisting food cravings.

I agree with the old ages that slim feels better than anything tastes.

I feel like saying healthy diet, but then didn’t recent studies conclude that slim smokers were still healthier than obese non smokers?

Yes, that's the sort of research I mean. It would indicate that I'm better off being slim by doing what I'm doing.

that slim feels better than anything tastes.

Except it turns out that I can lose weight eating whatever crap I fancy as long as I don't also eat whatever I should.

I don't really understand how adding healthy food to the rubbish you eat would pile on the pounds. Just add veg. It has almost no calories. Eat the rubbish that clearly works for you but add a salad, some veggie sticks and an apple every day. Maybe drop a couple of biscuits in exchange, if you want, as two portions of raw veg and an apple will be about 150-200 cals.

Diet matters. My naturally slim FIL collapsed and was shocked to learn he had Type 2 diabetes that was completely out of control. He ate lots of carbs and sweets but was active and not overweight so didn’t think he had any problems.

Your body is going to turn on you if you feed it sugar mixed with sugar at 8 PM on an empty stomach. It may not be in your weight but eventually will show up in your blood glucose levels.