To think dogs should be banned from beaches?

[Bedroomdilemma]

At least during nesting season?
www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/nov/14/study-adds-to-calls-to-ban-dogs-from-beaches-during-nesting-season-birds
Not that I’m anti-dog...I’m researching getting a dog. We go for a lot of walks at the moment (not much else to do😄) and I love looking at the dogs on our local beach but it’s also a nature reserve and I’m beginning to get a morally uncomfortable with it. It’s actually mostly a nature reserve for wintering birds so I’m not sure a ban just during nesting season is sufficient.

I like dogs in theory but it’s really disgusting that they pee and shit everywhere. Everyone was up in arms about people pissing in park bushes during lockdown but it’s what millions of dogs do every day.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

It's bad enough for responsible owners that lots of beaches ban dogs in the summer.

No reason why it should be. 'Responsible' dog owners would clearly recognise why such bans are necessary. It's the old rule of law going back to the earliest days of the classroom: if someone misbehaves, everyone else suffers.

I'd be taking this one up with the (many) who do misbehave. The Beach Rules are simply there to ensure the greater good for the greater number of people, albeit they so often go ignored.

I am a responsible dog owner and it annoys me that so many beaches ban dogs.

I don't live anywhere near a beach so we would only tend to go in summer as a 2 or so hour drive (if not longer) to go to a beach in the wet and cold does not really appeal.

My dogs loving running on the beach and I wish they could do so in nice weather.

I don't see why responsible owners should be punished because of some selfish owners. We don't ban all babies from the beach just because some disgusting parents throw dirty nappes on it do we?

[quote Scottishskifun]@Bluethrough actually 95% of owners pick up their dog mess on the beach and respect this.

It's a massive beach there is loads of space and my dog is never out of control. Its so big that even between dogs there is masses of space.
The users of the beach is about 70% dog walkers (with and without children).

There are also beaches in Cornwall where dogs are allowed year round.[/quote]
A survey found that between 25 and 50% of dog owners refuse to ever pick up their dogs poo, region dependant.
Just over 50% of owners supported new laws on dog fouling.

I ve been on Polzeath and Perranporth beaches in the winter and dogs are often 100s of yards away from their owners, of course some dogs stay close, others don't.

The car parks @ Gulworthy woods near Tavistock are littered with poo as owners let their dogs out, wait in the car for for 10 or 20 minutes and then drive off, fido having been to the loo!
A permitted way along the banks of the Tamar was closed to everyone because of dog fouling & littering, this isn't a tiny minority ruining it for the many.

I don't see why responsible owners should be punished because of some selfish owners. We don't ban all babies from the beach just because some disgusting parents throw dirty nappes on it do we?

First disclaimer: throwing dirty nappies anywhere at all is revolting. Dropping litter of any variety is disgusting and anti-social, and I'm including the condoms and sanitary protect as amongst the most anti-social. It also has to be said IME the detritus left behind by dogs and their owners outweighs all three of the above categories put together. It's hardly a controversial statement: all people have to do is look around them.

Now the disclaimer's out of the way, you're seriously comparing dogs to human children?

No wonder dog-threads on Mumsnet are notorious for being barking mad.

There’s a brilliant meme about this but it won’t let me post pics for some reason

@SausagePourHomme

I May be in the minority but i hate dogs being on the beach. I hate that in this country people take their dogs to beauty spots to use as a toilet. Even if you pick up after it's still filthy and children will be playing there touching the sand, people picnicking there. It's gross

Do you let your small children paddle in the sea?

because you shoudl be aware that is many beauty spots the ocean is basically an open sewer.

So, until that is fixed, I can't get excited about dogs.

Most beaches ban dogs during the tourist season, (rightly so) out of season pretty much the only people there are people walking their dogs.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks
"....... you're seriously comparing dogs to human children?"

That's not what she's doing at all. She's comparing irresponsible dog owners who leave their dogs' poo on the beach with irresponsible parents who leave filthy nappies on the beach. They are equally disgusting people. If the answer to the dog poo problem is to ban all dogs, regardless of whether their owners clear up after them, then the obvious answer to the filthy nappy problem is to ban all babies, regardless of whether their parents take their dirty nappies with them. Responsible parents would clearly recognise why such bans are necessary.

Yes, so a dog poo's 100s of yards away from you? with the best will in the world no one will be picking it up

another one saying that I would and do pick it up, and so do most dog owners I see. (maybe they only do it when someone is watching!)

This summer I was on a beach with my dog.

Huge empty space in Devon. beach has groynes and the first 8 or so groynes were dog free, so if you went with a dog you walked down the whole beach to past the 8th groyne where you were allowed to take your dog.

we were the only ones for miles.
I love this idea that dogs on beaches = dogs attacking other dogs and children. In my experience, once you have foudn the dog part, you are the only ones there. Dog ran and ran. But that doesn't mean he ran 100 miles away either, as PP said, they run up and down and round you and to the sea and back etc etc.
No reason not to pick up. Much easier to find the poo on the beach than in the long grass.

Absolutely, apart from the nesting birds issue who wants to wade in dogshit or have kids playing in it. How on earth would dogs off lead (=all dogs on a beach) be kept out of certain areas? 6 foot fences?

Surely nesting birds can be protected by simply keeping the dog on a lead. No need to go for a complete ban.

@RainingBatsAndFrogs

Why is the whole thread talking about dog shit?

The OP is about the impact on nesting birds.

And the study shows that birds are disturbed by dogs on leads as well as roaming free.

I read it and they seem to be talking about off lead dogs in particular. Unless I’m missing something...

‘It’s not about excluding dogs from beaches or public spaces but acknowledging that dogs off leashes cause significant problems. Dogs could easily be kept on a lead between the months of March and June when birds nest.’

Pp asked why would people obey rules about no dogs if they don’t obey rules about keeping dogs on leashes. I think the former is much easier to police - you go to the car park or access to the beach and just say no dogs allowed, whereas it’s much harder to police dogs off leash or poo not being picked up. Sure, just look the incident in Central Park where the police were called on the black birdwatcher who asked the woman to put her dog on a leash - that’s how aggressive entitled people can be when asked to leash their dog. A straight out prohibition is clearer.

This isn't personal opinion or an arbitrary, sweeping judgement: the evidence is directly proportionate to the piles of shit on public view everywhere.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks it sounds like you live in an awful place for people not picking up after their dogs. It is, absolutely, your personal opinion though - or rather your personal experience - as it’s not like that here at all. I can’t even remember the last time I saw dog poo on the pavement.

[Not relevant but I see empty beer/cider cans/bottles bloody everywhere round here though! Always shoved into bushes or perched on walls. Maybe I should start litter picking while I walk the dog... ]

Could we also ban people then because I'm sick of steering my dog round shitty chemical filled nappies, broken glass and barbeques.

Dogs should be kept on leads and away from nesting areas. But humans cause a shit tonne more damage to our regular beach than dogs do.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

I don't see why responsible owners should be punished because of some selfish owners. We don't ban all babies from the beach just because some disgusting parents throw dirty nappes on it do we?

First disclaimer: throwing dirty nappies anywhere at all is revolting. Dropping litter of any variety is disgusting and anti-social, and I'm including the condoms and sanitary protect as amongst the most anti-social. It also has to be said IME the detritus left behind by dogs and their owners outweighs all three of the above categories put together. It's hardly a controversial statement: all people have to do is look around them.

Now the disclaimer's out of the way, you're seriously comparing dogs to human children?

No wonder dog-threads on Mumsnet are notorious for being barking mad.

As another poster pointed out, I am comparing irresponsible dog owners with irresponsible parents or even just humans.

I totally disagree that there is more dog mess on most beaches than the litter left behind. I do look around me and I can assure you that is the case.

What about all the beaches that ban dogs in the summer and some beaches ban dogs all year round. Those beaches are covered in nappies, bottles, food wrappers, plastic bottles, used barbeques and many other items. Have you seen pictures of popular beaches after ONE day in the summer?

Of course dog mess is disgusting on a beach but at least if it gets washed into the sea by the tide it is not going to pollute the oceans and kill and injure fish, birds etc like the rubbish is.

@mrsmrt1981

Surely nesting birds can be protected by simply keeping the dog on a lead. No need to go for a complete ban.

But dog owners won't keep their dogs on leads because it's "not fair" on the dogs.

Yes, so a dog poo's 100s of yards away from you? with the best will in the world no one will be picking it up

another one saying that I would and do pick it up, and so do most dog owners I see. (maybe they only do it when someone is watching!)

Good that you do but the point is, as i said up thread, if dogs weren't an issue on beaches, then bans etc wouldn't exist.

Just as councils have had to ban BBQ's because of the idiots, if we were all responsible, there would be no need to waste council resources having bans/enforcement and cleaning.

Its down to dog owners to police themselves if they wish to use beaches.

It also has to be said IME the detritus left behind by dogs and their owners outweighs all three of the above categories put together. It's hardly a controversial statement: all people have to do is look around them.

I definitely don’t see this where I am. Litter is far the most common negative on my beach. Like I said before @MarieIVanArkleStinks I think you must live in an area that’s terrible for fouling! What you see isn’t necessarily representative. I’m not saying that what I say is I’m just saying there are differences apparently, depending on where you live. I’m sorry the area you live is so rife with shit!

@TibetanTerrier the statement about greyhounds and lurchers is incorrect. Sighthounds do have a prey drive but it's dog dependent on how strong that is. My greyhound/saluki Cross (2 Sighthounds breeds) goes nuts for a ball couldn't give a toss about a rabbit, bird or deer.
She has never been muzzled because she was never raced and never taught to hunt. For some their drive is high (can't even be around small dogs) but this isn't true for all. For many rescue greyhounds quite often their race cage is actually to help them feel safe as many are anxious.
I suggest understanding about a breed before making sweeping statements like any dog it's dependent on how they are trained and treated.

Yes ban all dogs from all beaches, ban them from parks, make people keep them on leads at all times 🙄. Yet I can't leave my back door open or my windows open too wide because my neighbours cat comes in and eats the dogs food, or lies in my kids fucking beds, and there's about 6 in the street that wander around my garden, shitting in the flower bed, all out hunting birds and other animals, keeping everyone in street awake at night with their screeching. Apparently though everyone just finds it quite funny and acceptable for cats to kill other animals and enter other peoples property because they're cats so there's nothing that can be done.

@Yohoheaveho

We need better legislation to deal with the feckless owners, owning a dog should not be an automatic right, there should be some constraints over who is able to own a dog, how many dogs what breed etc. The dog walking industry also needs to be regulated since irresponsible dog walkers are in nuisance. However the pet industry will lobby against anything which reduces the number of dogs because this will hurt its profits

Same with fireworks. Too many feckless people terrifying animals but that's allowed.

There's too much of a reliance in this country on people applying common sense when too many don't.

When lockdown was lifted, people came to visit where I live although shops and facilities were shut. Tourists were shitting in front gardens and next to beach huts, leaving dirty nappies and mounds of rubbish everywhere and having illegal barbecues.

But it was okay because dogs are banned on the beach.

Having had lots of bad experiences with dogs on beaches I would be in favour!

Apparently though everyone just finds it quite funny and acceptable for cats to kill other animals and enter other peoples property because they're cats so there's nothing that can be done
I dont think it's funny or acceptable, cats are also a menace to wildlife and the shit is a big problem:(

Humans are the ones who destroy our beautiful beaches with litter! Dogs don't bring takeaway boxes or cans of lager or even fag butts!!!!