To think this should be headline news - 10% of a bubble to be considered an outbreak

[lurchersrule]

I am a teacher. We have 5 cases in one bubble and I'm told PHE/DfE today advised the member of staff who spoke to them that it's not considered an outbreak until/unless 10% of the bubble have it?!

So in my particular school that' 20 in the school itself plus whoever we spread it to. And the country is apparently in lockdown? What a fucking joke!

Original guidance said 2 cases for a bubble to shut, it's crept up and now 10% - and no publicity at all. As a parent and teacher (3 different schools involved) I'm absolutely livid.

Don't say I'm UR because I'm bloody not!

In both of my sons schools, 1 case closes the bubble. (2 primary and 1 secondary).

In the other 2 local secondary schools, it's close contacts only, so about 10 children per case.

Secondaries here (East mids) only sending close contacts home to isolate, not even everyone who has had a double lesson in a room with the positive case, only the ones sat closest.

Late last week, there was a positive case in my eldest's year group, and 7 or so kids were sent home. (Secondary) Today we were notified of another case in the same year group, but a different form. The head determined that they were unrelated, and again sent around 7 kids home.

Another mum rang up to enquire what they were defining as a "close contact". The head said it meant anyone who was within 1 meter of the positive student, within 48 hours of the positive test. They appear to have chosen who to send home based on the classroom seating charts.

Unfortunately the seating charts don't show which classmates hugged the positive child during breaks (she was in school for half the day yesterday and had a positive result today)

I had a thread on here yesterday about this. I had naively believed that my dd's bubble would close if there was a confirmed case, but apparently not. Only "close contacts" were sent home, which meant close friends and kids who sit next to her in class. DD regularly sits near the child in question for hours at a time in an unventilated room, but not next to her. Definitely within 2m. Apparently, she doesn't need to isolate.

A number of people explained on the thread yesterday that it isn't the school's decision. I think they're doing their very best, but it looks like the political pressure to keep schools open has overridden concerns about health and safety for the teachers.

At my kids primary and secondary 1 case in a year has triggered self isolation for 14 days.

In secondary it's seating plans now that make the decision and children saying who they were near. If they think your child hasn't been within 2m, without a mask or for less than 15 mins from a case they don't need to isolate

DS is at primary and the class is currently at home as there’s one case in his class bubble

Whole of a two class year group are currently just beginning their two week isolations because of one case at my dc school.

New utterly un implementable info has come out today on mask etticute and staying 2 meters away away.

It's just appalling.

We closed a year group yesterday as one child had tested positive, primary school with 2 form groups per year. My year 8 son is off as one child in his form/ bubble tested positive so they have all been sent home to isolate.

Maybe my DS’s school is going over the top
We have 3 bubbles “popped” one with known case in the group. One who may have it and it’s popped until the test results are in. And one which has closed because the teacher has been told to isolate via track and trace, currently they have no symptoms.

Primary school here - 1 case does not close the year. School does internal T&T, liaising with PHE, and only asks the kids in close contact with positive case to isolate.

I agree with you.

Round here one case and they send whole year group home

Seems schools are doing different
I think because the bubble includes break time and they have no idea who has been near who , it seems round here sw whole bubble which is year group gets sent home. Couple local schools had one case this week and whole year group goes home

But are they considering an outbreak to be , needs investigating and one / two cases to just follow isolation
Did phe actually say not to send whole bubble home as here letters from schools say who year being sent home and that they have liased with phe

So they don't consider it an outbreak - fine; but isn't that different from triggering self isolation procedures?

At our school, the bubble is sent home if there's 1 case. And yes, it has happened. But it shouldn't be called an "outbreak" unless it affects more people.

Reading the guidance for schools, you have to call a number if there is a positive case and seems like there is a risk assessment over the phone. So seems very case by case..

High school sent home 11 close contacts on Monday. On Tuesday one of the feeder primaries sent home 4 full classes across 3 year groups.
There are definitely inconsistencies, but there are all the way through this whole mess. The council are giving out very dodgy advice that contradicts the law. 119 and the doctors are giving people various ‘advice’ that means you potentially have infected people in schools and workplaces. People think the rules and guidance doesn’t apply to them because they can’t possibly have COVID because it’s ‘just a normal cough’.
I have never been more annoyed with those in power than I am at the moment!

Is this a terminology thing rather than a value judgement - isn't 'outbreak' more than a few occurrences but a significant cluster of cases? Even though a single case may be enough to close a bubble it isn't an outbreak in the normal epidemiological sense. It doesn't mean it shouldn't be taken seriously, just that it is a different phenomenon.