To not see the point of phonics books with no words?

[Rainallnight]

DD is in Reception and and enjoying it.

She gets a phonics book sent home in her bag every week and so far it’s ones with no words - Level 0.

Teacher says that’s her level and she’s in a reading group with other kids the same level.

I’m really not pushy about this and if that’s where she is, then that’s where she is, but the wordless books just seem to me to be a waste of time. And DD is very, very bored by them. She loves books and her vocabulary is massive so the very last thing I want to do is turn her off books.

The instructions that come with the book, on the inside cover, say that the child should tell the story and you should talk about it, etc which DD is well able to do. She’s just baffled and bored by why there’s nothing for me to read to her (or for her to have a go at).

BUT I am very old and prepared to be told that I just don’t get how reading is taught these days.

So tell me what you think.

@Mochudubh

God, are they STILL doing this? DS (5) had those Biff & Chip books with no words when others in his class were onto the ones with short sentences per page. When I queried it with his teacher I was told that his reading wasn't advanced enough to get books with words but they helped him make up his own stories (he'd no problems on that score). Our argument was, how can he learn to read if the books don't have words?

DH and I are both voracious readers and read with DS every day, I can still recite all the Little..... Colour Vehicle. books 20 years later. We knew for sure the teacher was talking bx on 11 September 2011 when I picked up DS from school and he read the ticker tape along the bottom of the news report verbatim!

We moved back to Scotland the following year and his new teacher couldn't understand the previous teacher's report as "he can read just fine".

Sorry OP this has turned into a rant but for what it's worth my DS is now 25 with his own business. Turns out he just thought the Biff & Chip books were boring, that's the problem with our "one size fits all " approach.

Keep reading stuff your DC enjoys, funny stories out of the paper, cartoons etc. They're provably more advanced than the school thinks.

I'm assuming you meant 2001, unless you're genuinely proud of your 16 year old for reading the news

Yes, @Mochudubh, I have that frustration of thinking well, how is she going to learn?! And she keeps having a go at words in other books, which are definitely too hard for her and then she gets frustrated. I think she’d be better off having a very basic phonics book where she could at least have a reasonable go.

Apologies, I obviously meant 11 September 2001.

Apologies, I obviously meant 11 September 2001.

Yes, @Mochudubh, I have that frustration of thinking well, how is she going to learn?! And she keeps having a go at words in other books, which are definitely too hard for her and then she gets frustrated. I think she’d be better off having a very basic phonics book where she could at least have a reasonable go.

Yes, @Mochudubh, I have that frustration of thinking well, how is she going to learn?! And she keeps having a go at words in other books, which are definitely too hard for her and then she gets frustrated. I think she’d be better off at having a very basic phonics book where she could at least have a reasonable go.

@MiddlesexGirl

Mine were bored with this too.

There used to be a really bad teaching point .... guess the story from the pictures .... or even worse .... guess what's going to happen next. My dc hated this... talk about ruining a good story with over analysis.

We just had a quick skim through the books which came from school and continued with our home reading books.
School in those days did look-say and at home we did phonics!

@MiddlesexGirl

Exactly this! You said it so much more succinctly.

Mine are both KS1 and it took me a while to work out that sending the reading record book back with a note along the lines of 'X is bored by this, could you please send home the next level' is perfectly ok.

Do you think maybe she's bored because she realises you find it boring?

There are loads of things in the world that are not the most exciting if you can't use any imagination to liven them up, and stories are definitely in this category. I have to admit I am terrible at pretend play/make up a story type stuff. It bores me to tears. But I work at it, because it's not about me, and I don't want my DD to start thinking that if she's bored, she has no resources of her own to make something interesting from her own imagination.

Do you think maybe she's bored because she realises you find it boring?

There are loads of things in the world that are not the most exciting if you can't use any imagination to liven them up, and stories are definitely in this category. I have to admit I am terrible at pretend play/make up a story type stuff. It bores me to tears. But I work at it, because it's not about me, and I don't want my DD to start thinking that if she's bored, she has no resources of her own to make something interesting from her own imagination.

@Rainallnight

It sounds like I'm at least a generation older than you so take this with a pinch of salt if you like, but I wouldn't get to hung up on Phonics. It definitely wasn't a 'thing" in the early 70s and I don't think it was used much at my DS primary 25 years later.

My mum taught me to read before I went to school and used to spell out words like cat as Kih-ah-tuh, which as far as I understand is similar how phonics works anyway.

I read your comment "she keeps having a go at books that are too hard and gets frustrated". I used to read the Peanuts books when I was little and in one strip
Lucy comes across Linus reading The Brothers Karamazov by Dostoevsky and asks if he doesn't find the Russian names hard. Linus replies "When I find something I can't pronounce, I just bleep right over it".

www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=er0sNcfw&id=81D100B392486BCFEA43752F4A92F4049C73360D&thid=OIP.er0sNcfwh89Xm_9T9nR8uQHaBh&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fi.pinimg.com%2foriginals%2f08%2f1c%2f36%2f081c36c7a55b6ad9ceb6e531b8e1d602.gif&exph=186&expw=900&q=peanuts+karamazov&simid=608004753370188094&ck=A91131401C01B97328B22DE31ED1CD2F&selectedIndex=0&FORM=IRPRST&idpp=overlayview&ajaxhist=0

Too hung up, gah

I didn't get the point of these either. We always read loads and talked about the books. I found the stories were so basic in the pictureless books you couldn't actually do that much comprehension / interference. With a good picture book however, you could get a really good discussion going part way through - without having to fight yhr DC to get them to engage.

Our schools' book didn't get any better once they got books with words in unfortunately (very boring repetitive look and say style books). We ended up buying our own phonics based books, if you reach that point they aren't that expensive.

@SarahAndQuack It did cross my mind, to make sure I’m not transmitting boredom. She does get plenty of opportunities for creativity, I don’t think that not embracing these books enthusiastically means she’s missing out on that. They’re possibly just a bit crap.

@Mochudubh, that’s very cute!

I didn't get the point of these either. We always read loads and talked about the books. I found the stories were so basic in the pictureless books you couldn't actually do that much comprehension / interference. With a good picture book however, you could get a really good discussion going part way through - without having to fight yhr DC to get them to engage.

Our schools' book didn't get any better once they got books with words in unfortunately (very boring repetitive look and say style books). We ended up buying our own phonics based books, if you reach that point they aren't that expensive.

@SarahAndQuack It did cross my mind, to make sure I’m not transmitting boredom. She does get plenty of opportunities for creativity, I don’t think that not embracing these books enthusiastically means she’s missing out on that. They’re possibly just a bit crap.

@Mochudubh, that’s very cute!

@Scotinoz

Mine are both KS1 and it took me a while to work out that sending the reading record book back with a note along the lines of 'X is bored by this, could you please send home the next level' is perfectly ok.

This is a very good comment. Most teachers would appreciate the feedback.

"DD is starting to recognise some sounds in words and reading them when I read to her at home. Could she try the first level of phonic books soon?

The worst the school can do is say no.

That’s a good point, @Scotinoz. I’m so obedient, it hasn’t occurred to me. I guess I’m also a bit worried about seeming pushy or having an inflated idea of her ability. I think the sun shines out of her arse but I promised myself starting school that I wouldn’t be too PFB about it!

My DM remembers me getting sent home with these aged 5. I'm 30 now. She was incredibly upset, I don't recall it at all! I definitely wanted to read and loved books so the picture ones probably bored me, tbh. We read lots at home though so I think keeping that up alongside school books really kept me interested in reading and really got me reading and made the difference.

That’s a good point, @Scotinoz. I’m so obedient, it hasn’t occurred to me. I guess I’m also a bit worried about seeming pushy or having an inflated idea of her ability. I think the sun shines out of her arse but I promised myself starting school that I wouldn’t be too PFB about it!

YANBU my son and I aren’t fans of the wordless books. I’m just logging onto Oxford Owl and reading the level above with him as well as the compulsory picture book.

Marking my spot as I’m interested.

When do children understand that written word is spoken? My dd today correctly pointed to the word daddy when I asked her, star, bear and mummy. She’s nearly 2 but I thought it was a bit good for her age. I read a few books every night. Quite long ones now. Usually 4-7 age, as she got bored of the short ones. I found it strange today when she did it. I draw faces (badly) and she’ll point out where nose, eyes ect should go when asked.

She’s a quiet child and seems behind with actual speech, but wonder if her understanding is advanced.

Thanks all.

Oh, gosh, sorry for the double post!

If they're just a bit crap then yes, ok, I'm with you. It sounds like something she can do without.

Also recognised her name, and pointed to it when asked. That’s on lot of her things though like her bag ect. (This isn’t meant to be a brag I’m not smart) just wondering.

Don’t worry, @SarahAndQuack, I think double posting is a problem across the site tonight!