primary school reception class and SEND support

[user1468863258]

I appologies in advance if I offend anyone as this is not my intent. I merely am trying to educate myself on childens rights and parents expectations in the primary school.
To summarise my question: my dc started primary school and it looks like we have 2 kids with special needs in the class. Of course, I don't have much information about their diagnosis but gathering from what my dc and other kids in the class are saying the 2 kids are getting continuous support throughout the day from TAs while the teacher is left to tend to the rest of the class. I am not familiar with UK primary school system and not entire sure if this is expected/acceptable arrangement. I would expect to have a designated person to help provide any additional support a child needs? Am I being too naive to expect that?
From the little research I have done on this topic it seems that there is a law that requires schools to provide support and physical adjustments as necessary so that your (SEND) child can participate fully in the school. It looks like in the case of my school this support is given at the cost of the rest of the class loosing their two TAs.
Is this soemething we should bring up with the school? Is it common to have no additiona support in the beginning of reception while the kids get adjusted/settled? Any other advise i could get on this topic I would really appreciate.

My son had a one to one ta in primary but she did help the other kids too .
If she wasn't being employed for him then she wouldn't be there at all so I suppose it has its pros and cons 🤔.
If your here to moan that the class ta is paying more attention to the kids with special needs I wouldn't bother because before long class tas won't exist at all due to funding cuts !

Ds 1-1 is named on the school website with TA and then class name. School aren’t really going to post “teaching assistant providing 1-1 support for x child” are they!

We have 30 children in our Reception class and the two TA’s were introduced as class TA In the beginning of the term. I now realise that their primary responsibility might be helping specific child and not entire class. Did not think having 2 TAs is unusual for a state primary school.

Not unusual. There are three in my son’s Reception class and at least two of them look after specific children.

I only know this because one of those children is my son, and another child I’ve known since birth who is autistic and non-verbal.

I don’t expect all of the parents know who the TAs look after and why, because that information is not for other parents to know.

Equally, the “class TA” you were introduced to doesn’t necessarily work with the entire class, but they’re hardly going to say “this is Mrs X and she is here to look after Child Y” because that’s none of your business. “Class TA” is good enough.

IME TAs will always be introduced in the same way whether they are there as a class TA or to support an individual child. Theres no way round it, parents are justifiably unhappy at there being another adult in the room they haven't been told about, and to actually introduce them as a specific 1:1 is basically announcing the SEND of one of the class members, so they are just added in with the teacher as another adult in the classroom.

However it does lead to this situation where parents are questioning why the "class" TA is never with thier child's group. There were some quite heated discussions in the playground at my kids school whenever it came to contributions to end of year presents

For xmas pressies I throw a blanket comment in early! I wont contribute thanks as x&y buy pressies for their 1:1 TAs and we'll buy a card for teacher. Thanks all.

Then everyone is clear that I will buy 'our' TAs a gift each, and they are off the hook in needing to split the vouchers/money or whatever is collected 😏....
I assume everyone is happy with that. I'm lucky it's a tiny friendly school maybe....

You have absolutely no idea the battle required to access SEND support in this country. I’ve just finished a year long battle including tribunal to get my twins into a specialist school (they are 4). When the needs are not as obvious as my two, it’s a massive challenge to get any support in place, let alone before they start school. Often LAs will insist a child starts mainstream school and fails before they’ll assess for an EHCP.

Schools have a limited amount of funding to make special educational provision when children don’t yet have an EHCP. It’s likely that at least one of these TAs is there to support one or both of these children. If the children have EHCPs the school will be receiving funding for this.

I literally had to go to court to get full time 1:1 for my twins and they are autistic, non verbal and delayed across the board.

I appreciate that most parents are blissfully unaware of this horrific system, but the idea that these disabled children are stealing support from NT kids is just... I can’t even put my thoughts into words on this. FFS.

It’s ironic because many of the SEN parents I know are getting LA-funded placements at independent mainstream schools because their child can’t cope in mainstream due to class sizes, but an independent with smaller classes is significantly cheaper than a specialist school. I know lots of children with SEN in Independent mainstreams, more than in any other type of school. So if you want to avoid children with SEN, private schools aren’t the place to do that!

SinkGirl I'm so sorry you had to go through all that. I have a friend in a similar situation and they have just spent a fortune going through the courts.

I seems incredibly unfair that, depending on the local authority you live in, you may have to end up going through this process.

We have been very lucky in that when DD started Reception the head teacher fought very hard to get the EHCP in place and although it is a small rural school they have provided brilliant support.

I was coming under some pressure from the LA to apply for mainstream secondary for DD but this would have been a disaster and the head told them so.

Fortunately we have been able to get a place in a special school which sounds as it it will meet DD's needs perfectly but I know we have been very lucky. Children with SEN already have additional hurdles to get over in life and having to fight to get them the proper educational support should not be one of them.

In my class I have two children with EHCPs who have a designated 1:1 TA each, who are specifically there to support the needs of those pupils as stated in their plans. They will work with other children if, for example they are completing the same task as their designated pupil, but the needs of these pupils are such that they need the 1:1 support available. I am fortunate to also have a class TA in the mornings but their salary is partially funded out of the pupil premium budget as we have a high proportion of PP children in my school, so I have to target deployment of my TA to support raising the attainment of those pupils.

@feellikeanalien

SinkGirl I'm so sorry you had to go through all that. I have a friend in a similar situation and they have just spent a fortune going through the courts.

I seems incredibly unfair that, depending on the local authority you live in, you may have to end up going through this process.

We have been very lucky in that when DD started Reception the head teacher fought very hard to get the EHCP in place and although it is a small rural school they have provided brilliant support.

I was coming under some pressure from the LA to apply for mainstream secondary for DD but this would have been a disaster and the head told them so.

Fortunately we have been able to get a place in a special school which sounds as it it will meet DD's needs perfectly but I know we have been very lucky. Children with SEN already have additional hurdles to get over in life and having to fight to get them the proper educational support should not be one of them.

I am really glad to hear that it was a bit more straightforward for you - that’s how it should be!

In our case the LA agreed that a specialist placement was needed but the only spaces in LA funded schools was a school for profound and multiple learning disabilities which my twins don’t have. We knew they needed an ASD specific setting so we had to fight hard for it but we got there in the end.

I know so many parents whose children have started mainstream school without any support in place and it has been disastrous for so many - one 5 year old I know has deteriorated so badly in terms of her mental state while the LA drag their heels sorting out a specialist placement, it’s so upsetting.

I’m glad these children are getting some additional support however it’s being funded. I can almost guarantee it won’t be anywhere near the support they actually need to meet their potential.

Having a single TA is unusual, let alone 2.

Honestly OP this is the problem with a wide amount of British schools; too many pupils, too few teachers.

And sadly it’s not just down to how good the LA is but how much the parents are able to fight. The system is complex and confusing and the fight is hard.

I have long since said looking after DS is the easy part. Fighting for the support that he needs across the board is the difficult thing. You shouldn’t need to quote laws just to get the basic provision your child needs

I think it does depend where abouts in the country you are @SinkGirl in my LEA there are two SEN primary school,s and two SEN High school,s and a couple of ASD primary hubs and the same for high school I appreciate we are very lucky and I didn't have the same fight to get my son in his special needs primary school ,he's in year six however and I'm not sure whether the lea special high school is the best one to meet his needs so I'm lucky looking around private specialist provision ,which I know will be a fight .

Did not think having 2 TAs is unusual for a state primary school.

It is very unusual.

My son has SEND and his class is set up exactly as you described op. The TA was specifically hired to support both boys and does not impact the rest of the class.
She is there solely to assist the boys in participating in normal everyday life in school. You need not worry about if your child is getting enough attention as there will be provision for that. In fact having a dedicated TA for these boys means that your child will have the teachers attention and the children like my child won't dissrupt the class

For clarity I also used to be a TA doing this exact kind of support before my son was born

@SinkGirl postcode lottery strikes again. So sorry to hear of your fight

People who worry that their NT kids arent getting support because the SEN kids in the class are taking it all make me weep

@Sirzy

And sadly it’s not just down to how good the LA is but how much the parents are able to fight. The system is complex and confusing and the fight is hard.

I have long since said looking after DS is the easy part. Fighting for the support that he needs across the board is the difficult thing. You shouldn’t need to quote laws just to get the basic provision your child needs

Oh I absolutely agree. I’m intelligent, educated and no SEN myself plus I’m not a single parent etc, and it’s still the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. Getting your head round the law is difficult enough, let alone actually managing an appeal, especially if you don’t qualify for legal aid. I was literally put on sedatives for the last 4 weeks before our hearings, I was falling apart completely. I understand completely why some can’t fight.

x2boys we have lots of specialist settings in our LA too - the issue is, as in many places, the LA making plans as vague as possible so that the child can be fitted into the cheapest available space at that time.

Lots of people without kids with SEN don’t realise that children have an absolute legal right to be educated in a mainstream setting if this is what their parents want, no matter how difficult or expensive it is to put provisions in place. A full time 1:1 is a relatively cheap and easy provision to make. If only parents didn’t gossip about other children’s needs and them monopolising the TAs who are no doubt only there to help them in the first place.

I’m currently going through a dreadful time with my eldest sons school concerning SEN. It’s under investigation currently but I don’t hold out much hope. Months and months of fighting and remaining civil when your child is being failed.

Nothing teaches you as a parent how to prepare for how heart wrenching and traumatic it is to fight for something all these useless policies set forth. Nothing.

I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy so OP please be thankful if none of your children ever have to have these hurdles.

Did not think having 2 TAs is unusual for a state primary school.
It is incredibly unusual. Most schools here have half a TA for reception per class of 30, nothing from year 1. More TAs would do a world of good as school results are abysmal (and so is student behaviour), but there is not budget, and teachers do crowd control rather than teaching.

Maybe this question of TAs being usual or unusual needs more context. It’s not unusual one my experience but these TAs are supporting specific children. Would I expect to find a class with a whole-class TA? Not necessarily.

In my experience it would be more unusual for there to be no TA due to no SEND children in the class.

It's likely the ta's are paid for out of the budget allocation for the send kids. Most classes don't get one dedicated ta these days let alone 2. It's highly unlikely the tas don't help other kids too, schools are used to this and I suspect you just aren't aware of what's really going on

@user1468863258

Wow lots of useful information! Thanks a lot for all the comments. We have 30 children in our Reception class and the two TA’s were introduced as class TA In the beginning of the term. I now realise that their primary responsibility might be helping specific child and not entire class. Did not think having 2 TAs is unusual for a state primary school.

Most schools will probably have one part time TA at least in a Reception class eg mornings only. Ideally schools would probably have a full time class TA if their budget stretches to it as there are still toilet accidents etc to deal with.

If there's more than one TA they will almost certainly be there from the SEN budget.

For example my child's class had a full time TA in Reception, mornings only in Year 1 and no class TA in Year 2, children were just taken out of class for small intervention groups with a TA if needed.

I’m a TA in nursery and we have 4 pupils with SEND. There are 3 TA’s and 1 teacher. 2 of us are 1-1’s and the other TA has the other 2 pupils with SEND as their need isn’t as great. The teacher has the other 20. We all help other children but our main focus is the child or children with EHCP’s

They would have been introduced to the class because they were based in the class and the children would interact with them potentially, it would not be appropriate for the parents (or kids) to be told about specific send funding or diagnosis. My dd shared a ta with another autistic child but the ta did sometimes work with other kids if my dd and the other dc were engaged and not needing support at that time