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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To apply for a job that's 5 steps up?

42 replies

TheExecutionOfAllThings · 15/10/2020 15:46

I really hope this isn't outing, but here goes.

A job has become available in my organisation which is within my remit (but not my team or department) but has more significantly more responsibility. The main objectives are actually what I do but on a much smaller scale (think organisational level whereas this is on a regional level).

As far the job goes, they are looking for special emphasis on 4 competencies - I fully meet 3 and partially meet 1 - but the partial one is an 'understanding of', the others are 'able to do' so it's researchable.

However I work or have worked with many of the staff in that department and I'm conscious that they are aware of my current grade. Additionally, an aspect of the role would be managing some of those colleagues (who are currently all paid more than me). I wouldn't even be considering this if it was 2-3 steps up, but at this grade I'm worried I'll just be embarrassing myself.

And of course, I have no way of knowing if it's actually already ear-marked for someone in that team already but it's part of the 'process' to fairly advertise.

Do I apply and risk making a fool of myself or am I better holding back, discussing with the manager (who I have also worked with on numerous projects) about my interest of being part of the team and asking to be kept in the loop if something else comes up?

OP posts:
Carminabubu · 15/10/2020 15:48

I don’t know the answer but I am watching this with interest.

dontdisturbmenow · 15/10/2020 15:50

It's impossible to know. They will either laugh or on the opposite show ambition and guts.

Depends on the organisational culture and who are doing the interviews.

londonfever · 15/10/2020 15:53

Absolutely apply....why wouldn't you?? If this was in another company you wouldn't hesitate. Ambition is a quality that I always look for when recruiting. You have said that you can demonstrate the competencies...I would approach the hiring manager, advise I was interested but do not do it in an apologetic way...you have to be seen as confident especially if you would be managing people that you know

Flamingolingo · 15/10/2020 15:55

How much is a ‘step’ in your organisation? In mine it’s roughly £5k, so it would be like going from £25k to £50k. It’s quite odd that something that you think matches your skill set and current responsibilities so closely is valued so differently. But as a hiring manager I would be quite wary of recruiting someone to make such a huge jump in salary. That said, £50k to £75k is not such a huge leap in my organisation. So it’s not an outright no (and nor should it be - you can apply for any job you wish).

Moondust001 · 15/10/2020 15:55

How does applying make a fool of you? The worst thing that can happen is that you won't get it because there is a better candidate. In which case it has been a learning experience for next time. And you very definitely won't get it if you don't apply.

Miljea · 15/10/2020 15:57

Nah, if it's NHS management, the job's yours! 😂😂😂

JoJoSM2 · 15/10/2020 15:58

5 steps up sounds a bit ambitious like shop floor to area manager or newly qualified teacher to headteacher etc. I can’t imagine a scenario where someone really junior would actually have the experience to do well in a very senior job.

Could the job spec just be poorly written, giving people the wrong impression?

Or maybe I just haven’t got enough imagination.

dimples76 · 15/10/2020 15:59

I would say go for it. I have read studies before highlighting that it's a v female trait to only apply for positions which we feel that we are fully qualified for whereas men tend to give it a try. Even if you are unsuccessful you will be demonstrating your ambition.

tulippa · 15/10/2020 15:59

A man would do this without a second thought. It's been well researched that women will only apply for jobs they're 100% sure they'll get whereas as men are much more happy to take a chance. That's one reason why we have more men in top positions. Go for it!

Apologies for making a massive assumption you are female.

AlexaShutUp · 15/10/2020 15:59

Nothing to stop you from having a go.

I guess the question is whether you have the competencies needed for the job at the level that is required for this more senior position - and whether you will be able to come up with good enough examples to evidence this, given the limited scale of your experience.

In most organisations, the competencies required for the top jobs are not actually that different from those required by middle managers. It's just a question of scale and degree. However, the stakes are much higher for those in senior positions (higher impact, responsibility for more people, bigger budgets etc) so employers will want clear evidence that they are up to the job in order to minimise the risks.

I definitely don't want to rain on your parade, and there is nothing to stop you from having a go, but it would be very unusual for someone to jump so many grades in my experience. If I'm honest, it would probably raise some eyebrows as well, but if you decide to go for it, then that's just a risk that you'd have to accept.

user1471457751 · 15/10/2020 15:59

It depends on your organisation and also on your experience. In my organisation jumping 5 grades would be going from admin to senior manager. Unless someone had lots of previous experience at at least middle mgr level then they would stand no chance.

GingerAndTheBiscuits · 15/10/2020 16:00

Of course you should apply. I applied for a management position with a 20k payrise after less than a year on my current job and came out second - nobody laughed at me. Nothing ventured!

tulippa · 15/10/2020 16:00

Cross post!

Whatifitallgoesright · 15/10/2020 16:03

"What held them back from applying was not a mistaken perception about themselves, but a mistaken perception about the hiring process."

hbr.org/2014/08/why-women-dont-apply-for-jobs-unless-theyre-100-qualified

ibblebibbledibble · 15/10/2020 16:04

Hmm I’m all for ambition, but it sounds like a big jump. Five steps up from me is literally the prime minister, so not sure I’ll go for that one 🤣

workhomesleeprepeat · 15/10/2020 16:04

Hard to know - is there anyone you can speak to internally about the ‘lay of the land’ so to speak?

I once jumped up by 3 levels, but a restructure was on my side. It seemed like a lot at the time. 5 is quite a lot really.

Tho as pp have said, men apply for jobs they are under qualified for all the time - so why not? See if you can chat to people internally and apply if it looks positive

Original poster
TheExecutionOfAllThings · 15/10/2020 16:11

It's £16k more than my current wage. Significant increase from my current wage.

Over the years my responsibility has changed but my job description hasn't, so I've ended up taking the lead on projects rather than just supporting. In our current climate (and working in the public sector) there is no way anyone will do anything if I suggest my JD needs regrading.

The pay is substantially higher due to the responsibility (my work affects an organisation of about 10K, this would be an entire regional area) , but the work is actually the same but would just be a change of audience.

I'm questioning myself as it's even more than my current manager gets paid, but I do actually do a similar role. Ironically one of main 2 objectives for the role is a project I'm working on at the moment, the other objective is what I do on a usual day-to-day basis. But I am worried I'd come across as a bit of an idiot if I did go for it because it isn't the norm for someone to jump up that much here.

OP posts:
ReneeRol · 15/10/2020 16:12

I'd apply. You never know who else is applying, you just have to be better than them. If you can show you can do the job to a high standard, are sane and get along well with others, then you have a chance.

JoJoSM2 · 15/10/2020 16:13

Sounds like you’re doing a job above your grade. 16k isn’t that much, I thought it would be a job paying 3-4 times more. Definitely go for it.

GoldenZigZag · 15/10/2020 16:14

What would you do if you were a man who hadn't been socialised to be compliant and deferential?

Do that.

Bells3032 · 15/10/2020 16:17

5 steps up and only a £16k payrise? go for it. no harm in trying. if it was in your current team i'd think about it but it's not so no harm in it.

Proudling · 15/10/2020 16:19

Of course you apply!!!
You’ve nothing to lose but a lot to gain.
If anyone laughs (which I doubt they will), own it! Say I don’t know why you’re laughing, at least I’ve got guts.

I was once told that applying for a job that you stand no real chance of getting, if nothing else, shows those higher up that you want to do more. That you have drive, ambition and the confidence to go for things. It makes you a face if interest to them and improves your chances of promotion even if not successful this time.

Absolutely go for it!

Original poster
TheExecutionOfAllThings · 15/10/2020 16:22

We aren't paid exceptionally well here, unfortunately! But I'm reluctant to look elsewhere at the moment as the employee benefits and flexible working make up for it in my situation right now.

I'm thinking it might be worth phoning the manager in the first instance and just enquiring more about the role and having an informal chat. Luckily it's for an EoI which I find easier to write so I could work on it over the weekend.

I suppose there's nothing to lose - though I am very worried about my credibility!

OP posts:
Youandmeareluckytobeus · 15/10/2020 16:26

You should go for it. You know you can do most of the role.

Faint heart never won fair lady.

Hoppinggreen · 15/10/2020 16:28

Well if you dont apply you are pretty much guaranteed NOT to get it but if you do apply you at least have a chance.
Go for it