Bullied my whole life at work

[MapleHearts]

Hello all, feeling very down today and pondering why and what I've done to deserve such a crap life.
Basically, in every single workplace I've been bullied and it's affected my mental health so much that I can't foresee me ever getting over it now.

Bullying has always come from colleagues, never had any problem with management - infact, have been offered promotions in a lot of my roles.

Some examples -
bullied for being " too quiet"
have been the source of malicious gossip
had one colleague manage to turn the whole team against me bar one
people who used to chat to me suddenly going completely cold and pretend to be busy when I was around
Colleagues told to have nothing to do with me

I don't know how I've become a walking target and now when I start a new job, I know within a few weeks it's going to start again. I don't gossip/talk negatively about people, I'm engaged in other people's lives/ interests, I try and join in conversation even though I am shy. I'm the type who likes to keep my head down and get on with worj, but it seems that I anger people by being this way.

Any advice please?

If it is any advice to you i have been on the other-end of all this as both an employee and an employer. People wiill only get away with as much as you let them. With age and wisdom you need to make a stand..you have nothing to lose.

Being quiet makes you an easy target in my experience of office life . I had to learn social skills I'd never had very quickly. What you regard as getting your head down,sounds like you don't interact much tbh & people can take that the wrong way. Rarely speaking can make people feel uncomfortable . Hard, I know. You need to be saying more than good morning & goodnight to fit in. Initiate conversation even if it's just "what a horrible rainy day". Chat while the kettle boils if someone you work with comes in the kitchen. Same if you're at the copier. Ask who wants coffee of those who sit by you as you're making one anyway. Ask how people's weekends were/kids are. I know it's difficult but after a while it becomes habit & much easier.

You are playing the role of victim, it sounds like. Seek therapy.

@pandarific

Was there a similar pattern at school? If so, repeatedly struggling socially can be a sign of ASD.

Or if not, you might be unconsciously displaying victim behaviours after your initial traumatic experiences. This is sort of the equivalent of blood in the water - not great people tend to scent it and can't seem to help themselves.

What's the culture of your workplaces in general? What are the people like? Any obvious differences between you and the majority?

How old are you?

Thanks for your comments. No, no asd although I definitely identify with some traits. I think your bang on the money with me giving out victim behaviours though. - no matter how fake confident i try and be, people seem to pick up on my vulnerability and see straight through the facade. Then open season! I've worked in public, private sectors and this has happened across the board.

@Cassilis

OP, whilst I don't doubt you have been bullied, and having been through it (exclusion, catty comments etc) I understand how horrible it is.

However, being bulled in every single workplace indicates there could be a different issue at play here (possible paranoia). How many places have you worked?

I want so badly to believe this - that I'm being paranoid, but it's not unfortunately. I'm some cases it's been very subtle if you could call it that, i.e conversation going dead when I enter a room, but I've also had people try and convince me to leave jobs to my face!

@HyaluronicHippo

I wonder too if once you’ve had a bad experience, you’re hyper alert to any hints that something might be going in that direction.

I think being the new person in any workplace can make you feel ‘vulnerable’ but it’s about having some resilience that most people aren’t that bothered by external stuff because we’re all wrapped up in ourselves. If you come across as cold/aloof people will treat you accordingly.

Hyper vigilance - I absolutely am this. I'm so sensitized to bullying now, that I'm constantly on edge waiting for the next blow to strike. I've honestly never had good boundaries or resilience (since a child), but my last work place has wiped away any last shreds of self esteem. As the years have gone on, I've got weaker and weaker and less able to bounce it off.

@DontTouchTheMoustache

I'm like this op, I just dont seem to be very likeable. I think I come accross weird and I try to over compensate which comes accross fake. I've always been this way and I've just accepted that's who I am. If only we worked together and we could be the weirdos together 😊

Oh gosh, you too?!?Haha. I don't think you're a weirdo at all though. You sound kind, compassionate and caring. wish there were more of you around!!!

@lastnightthemooncame

Hi MapieHearts, I perceive bullying as part of the more brutal but everyday, aspects of the society we live in.

So it's not your fault in any way. But you know that! :) People may advise you to toughen up or something, but I don't believe we should have to debase ourselves in attempts to cope with situations that are not fair, logical or sane. (Even if you could, it's not really like deciding to lose weight or dye your hair! So toughen up is a silly cliche anyway)

I'm so sorry that you have to deal with it. You sound level headed and decent, and a few of us are the very small minority that demonstrate very clear values, are often introverted, hate hierarchies, cruelty, injustice.
I was also often bullied from age around 8 to mid 40's, Ive had & several burn outs etc.

But- a tiny number of environments were fine, even great. Unskilled work was the best. Diverse background of people doing it, all sorts of ages, ethnicities, drop outs, all sorts. The worst environments were small office settings with people that were competitive, but not that competent, and poor Management that were useless at practicing inclusion, didn't tackle stress, and skilled work in the public sector was the worst too.
That's my experience, anyway.
Where are you? Public or private?

I had to move to a big (inner) city in the South of UK to find a place where I fit in/didn't get hassled.

I also used review sites when searching, & treat job interviews like a 2 way process, grilling them on Management style, workplace culture etc. That doesn't always work, but can. Finally, I've been contract, short term, & times off sick in order to try restore better mental health when at its worst.
Oh, and workplace counselling (via HR) couldn't prevent it happening, but we're amazing & helped my self esteem & feelings of value so much.

Oh, & finally, I did start having a go at someone that relentlessly undermined me at work, being sexist, nasty, etc.

It didn't go well, I came across as someone just losing control (I was) but I think it made him think I was unpredictable & possibly therefore to be given a wide berth, and the world didn't end, even though I had the worst anxiety attack if my life afterwards.

It also increased my confidence no end doing that for the first time!

Also search out anti bullying social media, charities too, if you haven't already.

Please be well & I wish you all the luck in the world, sorry I can't be more help.

Oh my gosh, thank you, thank you, thank you for this. I got teary reading it because you have literally too k the words out of my mouth and explained my situation perfectly. I'm just sorry that you've had to deal with such crap too - like a pp mentioned i wish there were a job where all of us empaths/non sh it stirring/decent/equalutarians could work together without being torn apart, ridiculed and exploited for our values. I have been in situations where other perceived 'outsiders" have been bitched about behind their backs and it's disgusted me. I've always fought their corner , in my own very quiet timid wat and made it known I'm not on board. I'll never understand why people delight in tearing others apart???

I've worked in similar environments - small, gossipy, target driven office s mainly although the most overt bullying came from within an education setting ! I too am thinking about finding part-time unskilled work , after the last battering i can't cope with anything else.

I love the idea of interviewing the interviewer but I don't think I'd have the balls! I can see why you do though - who cares if the salary and bonuses are fantastic when you're going to have to work with toxic colleagues who'll destroy your mental health , so you'll have to leave anyway!

You should be so proud of yourself for standing up to your colleague - I bet you felt amazing after!!!

Thank you so much for your words - don't think you'll know how much it's helped me, just to feel validated and understood.

I hope you continue to find your way and fight your corner.

@Beaverdam100

Some people get off on targeting what they think is a weak person. Tell them to fuck right off as kindly as possible. New workplace and a fresh start.

Yes, I'm definitely perceived as the "weak" one. The bullying types soon sniff it out! I know all the things I need to do and stand up for myself, but it's putting it into action that's the probkem. After years of this , the little confidence i did have had gone and I'm a big ball of anxiety. Thank you for getting it though!

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

A usual assumption if someone commonly experiences this kind of situation is that they are the common denominator, ergo they are the problem. This isn't necessarily the case. Nor should it be assumed that it's down to paranoia on the part of the bullied person. I want to pick up on a point made by a PP:

you might be unconsciously displaying victim behaviours after your initial traumatic experiences. This is sort of the equivalent of blood in the water - not great people tend to scent it and can't seem to help themselves.

This is true, even if you're upstanding, outwardly confident and outgoing. Abusers can see straight under that façade whether others don't. It's as if you're emitting radio signals only they can receive. If you've previously been bullied or abused - and the younger the abuse started in life the more of a problem it's likely to be - you tend to attract it in the future. It's also unfortunately a predicament experienced by victims of sexual abuse.

I was abused as a child and experienced my fair share of bullying in school. It's happened occasionally in the workplace too, although there was a gap of about 10 years when I thought it was a thing of the past. A diagnosis of cPTSD and intensive EMDR therapy has helped enormously and these days I'm better equipped to deal with it and am no longer a people-pleaser. I had a case of sexual harrassment against me upheld only a few years ago, but the vibes it's left in my department are very unpleasant: certain colleagues are unable to look past it (believing of course that he was innocent and I'm a liar) and I'm unable to look past their behaviour of choosing to side with a sex pest.

A friend (and senior of mine at work) gave me some good advice a long time ago, in four words. 'Head down, mouth shut'. It's served me well. And because most people are happy to talk about themselves, it's easy enough to give the appearance of listening whilst giving away nothing personal about yourself.

Look into your past, OP, and see if something similar could apply to you (people who were traumatised in childhood go through life without necessarily realising they're traumatised, as I did). If it isn't, and your natural shyness is an issue, you might want to think about making some changes to your career and find something more suited to your temperament. In the end I go to work to work, not to make friends, but unfortunately offices and their politics can be nasty places. Arseholes are ten-a-penny and you'll find them in most if not every workplace.

Excuse the cynicism. But IME this has not been unwarranted.

for you.

Yes, yes, yes!!!! Thank you for your words and wisdom. Your advice is phenomenal! And everything you have said, resonated with me.

It's so strange you've picked up on the link to childhood trauma/abuse. I too, never thought I had been traumatised until very recentky, but I've been unpicking lots of early memories and I definitely am! I had a horribke, dysfunctional childhood with a bulkying, overbearing, critical mother and abusive, violent sibling and I was basically left on my own to cope, with no other family members stepping in to support. If I tie it all togetger , it's been trauma after trauma after trauma. There has definitely been a pattern. And the bullies smell my vulnerabilities.

I am also a people pleaser and although it's served me well at times to get the bullies off their radar, by helping them in some way, as soon as they don't need anything anymore /or I can't supply it, it's back to their ways. So nothing changes. Infact, in my personal life I've been trying to assert some boundaries , but it hasn't gone well and I've lost a friend who couldn't understand why I no longer wouldn't jump to attention when she demanded help with something.

Your situation at work sounds horrendous - your colleagues should be supporting you, not bashing you and supporting your work place abuser! I wish I still believed in karma, but there's too many horrible things that continue to happen to decent people, that I just don't anymore.

I will heed your advice of "heads down, mouth shut" - it's good advice. But in the past when I've done this, it's less to accusations of being too quiet. Can't win really!!!

I posted on something similar the other day. I am quiet and sound similar to you although I don’t feel like I’ve ever been bullied to the same extent. Sometimes I do, but not very often. I generally think I work around decent people but I can sense when people are the bully type and just stay well clear. I’m also not in an open plan office which I have been in the past, I definitely felt more vulnerable.

Just wanted you to know you’re not alone. I struggle to accept my personality sometimes but always remember to never give anyone else the power to make you feel bad about yourself. You are enough.

I actually feel like I’ve been lucky with my workplace as I don’t feel bullied even though my personality would make me the target in many settings.

If I did feel bullied to the extent you describe, I would defiantly seek advice from management / HR.

@Custardcream67

I actually feel like I’ve been lucky with my workplace as I don’t feel bullied even though my personality would make me the target in many settings.

If I did feel bullied to the extent you describe, I would defiantly seek advice from management / HR.

Sorry to hear you've gone through similar experiences . Honestly at times, I do question " what's wrong with me" and why I can't seem to be accepted for who i am.

I left my last workplace due to this, so no hr to go to now!

Great to hear that you found a place you feel comfortable - gives me hope that they exist

There's nothing wrong with you!

Scapegoating narcs who use other people to make themselves feel better are the problem, but they will never wonder what's wrong with them.

@MuserOwl

About to go to sleep here so just quickly, my advice is to research ''over coming the role of the scapegoat'' as much as possible. It is not your fault that this has happened to you repeatedly but there can be things that scapegoating narcissists pick up on that make you a target for this kind of crap. Eg, two overtly aggressive colleagues lock horns and you smooth it over. Passive aggressive scapegoating narcissist witnesses that and sees how attuned you are. How you are the Emotional Filling Station for others' emotions.

So, research this inside out and back to front to equip yourself.

Also, get a couple of books about consolidating your own values. I found this really helped me. It's a tough process, or it was for me because I have not been raised to sit around thinking about who I am or what I feel or what my wants and needs are and what I'm prepared to do/not do. The opposite

But it's a process that really helps you distance yourself from what's going on.

There are techiques online for distance yourself from what's going on. You observe it and consciously distance yourself from the feelings flooding your amygdala. You try to calmly identify what you're feeling with a bit more distance. NOT easy but if you look online there are much better explanations of how to not react

Thank you for your replies. I've honestly had some of the best advice, I've ever seen in mumsnet!. i think you must be the expert on scapegoating!Everything you said makes complete sense and I've had to do a lot of processing ttodsy and looking more in depth at my childhoid, and it's possible effect on the rest of my life.

I know a lot about scapegoating unfortunately. I was the scapegoat growing up within a very toxic family dynamic, with my eldest sibling being the golden child. Couple this with a violent, aggressive, narcissist of a sister and a critical, bullying mother and I guess the pattern was set for life. Until your post though, I haven't really joined the dots at how my scapegoat role has followed me into the work plave. Obviously, I've always known my self esteem and confidence is less than zero, but I hadn't realised I was still following the narrative.

I'm going to read up a load more on this to try and develop some of the tools i need to cope with the bullying. The parts you mention about distancing myself and observe at a distance especially . I had been getting really bad panic attacks every day along with heart palpitations, leaving me with the worse anxiety I've ever known, that I had to leave in the end. Moving forward i really need to start learning coping methods before I put myself back into work again.

Thank you so so much.

OP there's nothing wrong with you but you are catnip for bullies.

You can learn how not to be. Bullying is never the fault of the victim but there may be patterns in your behaviour that make you more of a target than others.

I really recommend looking up scapegoating because all scapegoats have similar ways of behaving. Get some psychodynamic therapy which will help uncover these patterns and hopefully change them.

I also recommend finding a more gentle environment. I've worked in really alpha environments which was like working in a den of scorpions but also, really gentle, nurturing places.

Bad management allows bullying to thrive. Get yourself signed up with a union as soon as you join a place. Get some therapy and uncover these patterns of behaviour. Perhaps look at doing an assertiveness course so you learn non passive ways of asserting yourself.

@Chantelli

Dear maplehearts you've had some of the most wonderful advice I've ever read on MN, thank you *@lastnightthemooncame and @MarieIVanArkleStinks*, so much wisdom and insight.

I agree you sound decent and level headed and it's happened to me too - bullied in pretty much every work place except for one very busy diverse public sector job and when I had unskilled jobs. Every professional placement I've had which has been highly qualified and competitive has had horrible bullying, especially
public sector environments involved in care or education.
Ive even see it start against me at the school gate by both parents and head teachers.
I too experienced childhood abuse cPTSD and better for EMDR. But it is like I've got a target on my back and it doesn't start right away but before long I'm being excluded, people going silent around me and I'm being left out of social and or work events.

Its completely stopped now as I work as an independent consultant and I would never ever again work in an office based role - I just won't put myself through it ever again and I deliberately worked towards this for around the past 8 years.
Read about the psychology of bullying work place culture as that really cemented my decision to never set foot back in one of those places again.
All the very best to you op. You sound lovely

Hi chantelli, thanks for your reply - I agree, I've felt such validation from posters, it's been overwhelmingly kind and I'm starting to think that it might not be me whose the problem! You're own experiences have touched a nerve. Especially given that they mirror the types of industries I've worked mainly in - ironically the caring /education/support sectors!

It's such a horrible feeling, being the target - I actually got used to keeping my eyes to the fkoir, to try and avoid any kind of eye contact and to physically make myself as small as possible. Didn't work much though!
It sounds like you've found the answer by working independently, id absolutely love that because weirdly enough, I'm actually bloody good at my job that's never been the problem, it's the teams I've worked in! I'm resigned now thiugh, to moving into something unskilled in a part time basis in the hope that I can avoid bitchy, competitive offices.

Best of luck with everything and keep moving forward !

@username501

OP there's nothing wrong with you but you are catnip for bullies.

You can learn how not to be. Bullying is never the fault of the victim but there may be patterns in your behaviour that make you more of a target than others.

I really recommend looking up scapegoating because all scapegoats have similar ways of behaving. Get some psychodynamic therapy which will help uncover these patterns and hopefully change them.

I also recommend finding a more gentle environment. I've worked in really alpha environments which was like working in a den of scorpions but also, really gentle, nurturing places.

Bad management allows bullying to thrive. Get yourself signed up with a union as soon as you join a place. Get some therapy and uncover these patterns of behaviour. Perhaps look at doing an assertiveness course so you learn non passive ways of asserting yourself.

I like that phrase - I certainly feel like it!

Great advice, thank you. Other posters have talked about scapegoating, and I've reflected a lot on that. I now know this happened in my family, I just stupidly didn't think that this pattern would continue at work!

You are right about ineffective management - in one of my roles many years agi, I was told that my bully had a strong personality and I should accept this was her way!even though, she consistently bad mouthed me, mocked me in meetings and wouldn't respond to my work emails.

I hope one day I can find my place and my peace.

Catnip for bullies! Yes.

I am also joining up dots OP. My childhood wasn't great, although my parents would angrily deny that. Emotionally neglect, scapegoating,my golden child brother was aggressive and fought his corner HARD and there was always pressure on me to let everything go wrt squabbles with my brother and with my parents, to have no needs, to be no trouble, to fit in around everybody else.

In the clearest case of scapegoating I can imagine, after my Dad went to a psychiatric hospital, I got called paranoid, sensitive, difficult, emotional.... but they do not see it!

So a lot of 'dot-joining' going on for me too.

Even three years ago I didn't really understand that I had been scapegoated. I knew there'd been emotional neglect but not that this role of scapegoating could follow me!

The people who don't understand this, people who gently suggest that you're paranoid, the reason that it never happens to them is because when they FIRST sense that somebody at work is being a bitch to them, they might call it. Shine a light on it. ''Hey Babs, you having a bad day?'' They just instinctively put the bullies on notice. They don't even register it. But they have pushed back in a small way that went unnoticed to them, where you or I would have bended with the wind.

ps, I'm in therapy, for the second time, and it's a slow process. So although I'd second suggestions to go for therapy, in the meantime, get your own programme and be your own therapist!

Work through the same of not being good enough. Maybe check out Jonice Webb phd, (on the subject of childhood emotional neglect)

I am not the biggest fan of Brene Brown because vulnerability is not what CATNIP scapegoats need to show, no no no, but, saying that, her first book ''I thought it was just me but it's not'' is good and I listened to it making a notes here and there.

I like Marisa Peer's mediations about feeling enough. Gabrielle Bernstein's book Judgement Detox. (About not judging yourself and having a very kind inner voice).

Then, go over the basics, your rights as a woman. Anne dickson sets these out so well in her book 'a woman in your own right''

And, Nathaniel Brandon's six pillars is on youtube as an audio book.

Books about boundaries, and then feeling the discomfort that follows.

Books about identifying your values. There is a book called discovering your core values. Quite a quick read. But helpful as it's a proven way to feel better about yourself when you've been bullied.
Checking back in with what makes you you.

Books about philosophy for living (Edith Hall's ''Aristotle's Way'' is a good read).

I've loads more books I want to read, in that much maligned genre of ''self help'' but I like them. The ones I've read have been helpful.

@MuserOwl

Catnip for bullies! Yes.

I am also joining up dots OP. My childhood wasn't great, although my parents would angrily deny that. Emotionally neglect, scapegoating,my golden child brother was aggressive and fought his corner HARD and there was always pressure on me to let everything go wrt squabbles with my brother and with my parents, to have no needs, to be no trouble, to fit in around everybody else.

In the clearest case of scapegoating I can imagine, after my Dad went to a psychiatric hospital, I got called paranoid, sensitive, difficult, emotional.... but they do not see it!

So a lot of 'dot-joining' going on for me too.

Even three years ago I didn't really understand that I had been scapegoated. I knew there'd been emotional neglect but not that this role of scapegoating could follow me!

The people who don't understand this, people who gently suggest that you're paranoid, the reason that it never happens to them is because when they FIRST sense that somebody at work is being a bitch to them, they might call it. Shine a light on it. ''Hey Babs, you having a bad day?'' They just instinctively put the bullies on notice. They don't even register it. But they have pushed back in a small way that went unnoticed to them, where you or I would have bended with the wind.

Thank you for being so spot on and insightful with your advice muserowl! I can identify with a lot of the emotional abuse and gas lighting you experienced in your childhood. it's like we were the problem, even though all of the evidence points to that not being the case at all. So you ever think your family will see it for what is was?

I too didn't really have the right to express my needs of have a voice - I was always too sensitive, being silly, getting the wrong end of the stick etc. So I shut down emotionally and learnt not to say anything.

Really interesting point you made about how others push back at the first sign of trouble and put potential bullies in their place - your right, id never do that. It just doesn't come naturally. Instead I'd feel flummoxed, disoriented, confused, anxious and i would be questioning myself - what did i do wrong, how have I upset them, how can I make things right?.Following the scapegoat pattern i guess.

Do you find therapy has helped with the untangling of all this?

Can I say a massive thank you to everyone who has so helpfully offered advice and not once has anyone told me to "just ignore them" .

In rl, often this is the response and ive found it to be so invalidating and unhelpful.

Can I reignite this very helpful thread? I'm also in a similar situation where I've burned out from the latest office job failure where I attracted the attention of a bully who singled me out for targeted low level humiliation for around 2 years, which management were apparently powerless to stop (although witnessed it in person countless times).

People mention gentle, nurturing environments to work that don't attract these competitive, type A individuals. What kinds of sectors and industries/jobs does this cover? I keep falling back into high stress professional environments and the pattern repeats...