To SCREAM from the rooftops that furlough needs to be extended at least 6 more months

[Marg33t]

Furlough saves jobs and saves people's health. Why is the extension not announced today?

People are losing their jobs at a rapid rate as it's near to the 30-45 days for consultations for redundancies. It needs to be extended or more people will lose their jobs. Other counties are running it until next year and it makes me feel sick that we aren't protecting and saving jobs!

@dairyfairies

“lack of childcare was one reasons to request furlough.”

Ah right. Does this still fall under staff being furloughed due to circumstances related to lockdown rather than the company abusing the scheme?

@dairyfairies

”I really hope those worried about furlough ending people extend the same compassion to those already on UC or living on carers alloeance. £67.60 a week for proving 35 hours a week care”

that is my point. if it is good enough for carers and families with disabled family members (no outrage there on MN), why is UC below those without disabilities/caring responsibility??

But isn’t the point actually that it’s not good enough for carers?

Speaking as someone who has always been against UC, who isn't facing it and who wouldn't be eligible anyway, I think it's worse now because a shit system affecting more people is a bigger problem than a shit system affecting fewer people.

@OpenlyGayExOlympicFencer

Speaking as someone who has always been against UC, who isn't facing it and who wouldn't be eligible anyway, I think it's worse now because a shit system affecting more people is a bigger problem than a shit system affecting fewer people.

Exactly the same problem as the virus in the first place. The sheer numbers involved

But isn’t the point actually that it’s not good enough for carers?

As a carer I can say it is dire. But from the POV of society it is. We are not contributing and looked down at as a drain and should be grateful for the handouts The only who ever raise it are those at the receiving end. It is of absolutely no concern to the rest of society . Or do you honestly care how carers are treated?

The furlough money would have been better spent modernising UC. I’ve heard of so many SME’s who’s businesses have tanked as a result of the virus, who then have not been eligible for any support for various reasons since march!

@dairyfairies

dairyfairies

”But isn’t the point actually that it’s not good enough for carers?”

As a carer I can say it is dire. But from the POV of society it is. We are not contributing and looked down at as a drain and should be grateful for the handouts The only who ever raise it are those at the receiving end. It is of absolutely no concern to the rest of society . Or do you honestly care how carers are treated?

Yes, I do. I think it’s shameful that as a carer you are so undervalued by the system (and literally monetarily undervalued). It’s wrong. I disagree that carers are a drain – it’s social care, it’s vital for our society (what’s the alternative to caring for the infirm and disabled?), goes beyond full time work, and should be properly supported by the government. They rely on goodwill from relatives who they trust will not leave their loved one in the care of the system.

£67.60 per week carers allowance for 35 hours of care is wrong – absolutely disgusting – and should be unlawful.

It exploits the goodwill (and labour) of those providing the care. I hope if nothing else, more people experiencing this part of the system for the first time will have their eyes opener to the reality of many people’s lives.

I hope it will prompt reform and can understand where you are coming from in wanting more people to experience this for themselves.

I think ultimately it is carers that should be treated (and paid) better and standards raised.

I'm surprised at the amount of "meh, businesses fail all the time" type of responses.

Yes they do, in pre covid times, and of course more will close in post covid times. However lots (not all) fail because they are mismanaged, not profitable, not offering relevant services any more, or are poorly run.
This is not the case here. Thousands of previously successful and profitable businesses are closed because they've been told to. How many business realistically can survive on no income for a year....? A lot of businesses have really tight margins. Yes some will make huge profits and pay fat cat wages, but not many business models would be set up to allow for a year of not trading.
If course some will be able to diversify and slightly tweak what they offer to fit new guidelines (eg cafes doing only take away etc) but not all. That may work for some types of customer facing businesses but is harder for manufacturing and non customer facing trades.

I think a lot of smug key workers are going to be very sad when they realise just how many industries are basically going to be ashes by the end of this. Theatres, concerts and cultural spaces are on the verge of total collapse. Charities like Marie Curie and Macmillan are about to have mass redundancies and that'll get worse, and will affect the services they can offer. Putting everyone on UC will lead to a massive drop in spending and that would impact on things like the shops key workers use (who may go under). Just because you haven't been in an industry which had to stop due to lockdown doesn't mean you won't be affected. Furlough was the only thing holding up a lot of industries and it going is going to be far more painful for everyone than I think we realize.

@greengreengrass14

Sell a couple of nuclear warheads and that is that debt sorted...

Eh? Momentum HQ is missing a drone today.

@NameChange9824 but furlough is only extending the inevitable. Those industries you have listed are unlikely to go back to the numbers seen before for a long time. A pro active government would perhaps be looking at how to support people back into education, what other industries can be stimulated to increase jobs, a different method of keeping businesses afloat other than paying staff they'll likely let at least some go of afterwards.

There simply isn't the money but the gvt needs to be making these decisions and communicating them Earlier

@NameChange9824

I think a lot of smug key workers are going to be very sad when they realise just how many industries are basically going to be ashes by the end of this. Theatres, concerts and cultural spaces are on the verge of total collapse. Charities like Marie Curie and Macmillan are about to have mass redundancies and that'll get worse, and will affect the services they can offer. Putting everyone on UC will lead to a massive drop in spending and that would impact on things like the shops key workers use (who may go under). Just because you haven't been in an industry which had to stop due to lockdown doesn't mean you won't be affected. Furlough was the only thing holding up a lot of industries and it going is going to be far more painful for everyone than I think we realize.

There's a big difference between continuing to support those industries who cannot open yet (theatres, arts, nightclubs) and just keeping everyone on furlough indefinitely.

I used to work retail and lots of my old colleagues are still furloughed even though the shops they work in re-opened back in June. They're only on furlough because that support is available. Unfortunately, once furlough ends, they'll be made redundant - for thousands of people, it's just prolonging the inevitable, which is job losses across the board.

It's just not feasible to continue to pay hundreds of thousands of people 80% of their salary indefinitely, while they just sit at home and do nothing. Lots of industries are going to be making people redundant because of COVID - those people will just have to claim UC, like all the self-employed had to do in March.

People are only kicking off now because they're facing the reality of life on benefits. Nobody gave a fuck in March when loads of self-employed sole traders lost their entire income overnight. UC is considered good enough for thousands of families - why is it not good enough for people who are currently furloughed?

People are only kicking off now because they're facing the reality of life on benefits. Nobody gave a fuck in March when loads of self-employed sole traders lost their entire income overnight. UC is considered good enough for thousands of families - why is it not good enough for people who are currently furloughed?

This. One of the very common experiences of those of us who've been excluded is friends and family not engaging with us about this, maybe it's embarrassment or guilt, I don't know, but people have just backed away from the issue whilst some of us are feeling suicidal. To make it worse a lot of self employed people have been told it's all our own fault because we're tax avoiding fraudster scum. We've already had six months of what people are now fearing, and it's a shock to have always done "the right thing" to find yourself completely abandoned. No idea what Rishi will do, the whole thing seems one big mess.

It's just not feasible to continue to pay hundreds of thousands of people 80% of their salary indefinitely, while they just sit at home and do nothing.

Bit of a diversion, but actually a universal basic income has been shown to be economically viable and there are strong arguments for it.

UC is considered good enough for thousands of families - why is it not good enough for people who are currently furloughed?

This sounds a bit like schadenfreud/bitterness. UC is inadequate at the best of times. We’re in the situation where there will be very much reduced opportunity to secure employment, so UC will be a long-term prospect for many and I suppose (for those that are that way minded) this undermines the justification of “well, get up off your arse and find a job”, “it’s a choice”, etc.

Under the current circumstances raising UC might be prudent and a more sensible solution than artificially extending the lifetimes of businesses and roles that are no longer viable (and almost certainly cost more to sustain than paying a higher rate of UC).

I was on furlough for 6 months got made redundant last week. As I am 27 weeks pregnant if I go and get another job now I won't be entitled to maternity pay. The government are going to be paying for people to live regardless of if it's on furlogh or on benefits! I have never claimed in my life but now both me and my partner have lost our jobs it's something we are going to have to do to make ends meet. Hopefully he'll get something soon!

We’re in the situation where there will be very much reduced opportunity to secure employment

that is the situation for carers . And has been long before Covid and it is not a long term but a lifelong thing for most. Why do you think those on furlough deserve better than so many others in society?

@dairyfairies

Why do you think those on furlough deserve better than so many others in society?

I don't. I think carers deserve better, and I think you agree?

I don't. I think carers deserve better, and I think you agree?

I do. but somehow many express deep concern for those on furlough yet there is no such noise about the treatment of carers. That is my point. People only express care for carers when challenged but it is nothing but lip service. I think you will agree!.

No, furlough needs to stop, the country cannot afford it. A lot of ripple on furlough will sadly lose their jobs when it ends anyway. It’s a very horrible situation and I’m so sorry for anyone in it.

I work in public service and have never felt so grateful to have the job I do right now. And in a more controversial opinion, I don’t think that any public sector workers should have had a pay increase this year, including NHS staff, when the economy is in such a shit state. I have had a pay increase, albeit a relatively small one, but it doesn’t feel right when so many are losing their jobs and I’m just pleased to have a secure one.

People! Not ripple....

It needs to be targeted - at specific sectors eg - hospitality, entertainment, businesses need to prove they are viable, and it needs to be flexible and combined with a commitment to provide re-training during non-working hours.

One reason why no amount of trying to convince us there is no money will ever succeed.

245:1 ROI - not bad eh ?

Bit of a diversion, but actually a universal basic income has been shown to be economically viable and there are strong arguments for it.

Yes, but a universal basic income is not partially funded by struggling businesses, plus it's unlikely to be as high as 2.5k per month, per person.

There no fucking money sadly
I wish we could