Infection control doesn’t seem to be working on colds!

[justfinefornow]

I had just assumed that given all the measures we we were taking In schools etc to limit the spread of Covid - colds etc would be limited too but it feels like the infection control doesn’t seem to be working very well against colds - which loads of kids at school seem to be suffering from at the moment.
If colds are spreading freely what hope do we have that the measures we have put in place will work against Covid, especially if we are indeed in the second wave with limited testing and no effective track and trace?

What infection control is happening in schools?!?! NOTHING! Schools are crammed, often windows that won't open, social distancing is impossible, staff are not allowed PPE and no testing if there are cases - fucking marvelous infection control!

@SimpleComforts

I think the thing people struggle with is that none of these measures are intended to stop the spread or to protect individuals, which is obviously hard for the individuals concerned (I'm one of them). They are simply designed to slow the spread to a manageable level, whilst allowing society to continue as something resembling normal.

"They" have decided masks in schools is one step too far from normal and TBH the vast majority of school staff I know agree.

Good point, though of course the message from Government says otherwise, which is why so many people are confused.

I dunno to be honest. A child in DS class had a sibling test positive but didn't himself and no other child in either class have developed symptoms.

They must be doing something right because my son plays closely with the sibling of the boy who tested positive.

but they havent been mixing
colds are to be expected surely?

@justfinefornow you seem to be missing the point made by several PP.

Covid spreads through droplets, so facing forward, covering mouths and noses in high traffic areas and cleaning are measures that help minimise the spread.

Colds are transmitted through the air, short of putting every kid in a hazmat suit with its own air supply there is no way to stop them breathing the air.

The thing is, there’s a huge difference between the measures the school have tried to put in place and the reality of what’s happening.

1. Kids to use hand sanitiser at start and end of lesson. The reality is only about half are doing this properly. The others are either not doing it at all or they’re doing one hand whilst holding their bag or mask in the other.

1. Kids to wear masks in communal areas. Again, not all children are wearing them, they’re carrying them, losing them and some are catapulting then at each other. 🙄

1. Wipe down desk and chair at end of lesson. Some kids are not even trying, others look like they’ve never used a wipe or cloth to clean anything in their life so they’re not being cleaned.

1. Masks on bus go to school. Apparently this started well but there are now less and less people of all ages wearing them.

1. Playground zones to separate year groups.

240 ish kids In the same year group all mixing at break/lunch, many not wearing masks, not social distancing.

I could go on. All these observations have been made by my child and family and friends children at their secondary schools. The measures were put in place to try to help. The reality is, the school can not ensure the rules are being stuck to all the time. People felt better thinking there’s all these measure in place but surely they knew that they wouldn’t be applied very well in schools with so many kids. It was destined to fail.

I thought the same OP. They're falling like flies in my son's school (sore throat and runny noses), and so clearly Covid isn't being stopped either is it?
So why not just say it like it is and let the poor kids have normal in school.

I predict that a lot of parents will start keeping their kids at home quite soon.

As a parent (and teacher)I find the dance school are putting on a bit farcical. They have 30 small children in a room about the size of your living room. Any other measures are going to have virtually no effect compared with that. Had the government either continued with small bubbles of say 10 - 15 children that would have helped or permanently reduced class sizes/increased spending on buildings so they actually match pupil numbers then that might have helped. I seriously doubt the current preventative measures do much more than look good and take a lot of valuable school time and money.

How many schools meet the (now defunct) BB99 guidelines? Tory cuts has made schools even more susceptible than they would otherwise have been.

Because infection risk is higher if they are fiddled with (more can be found on the outside of masks after a few hours), or dropped and touched by others, and they are far less effective if damp being worn for long periods or improperly fitted and worn. So yes, they are highly effective if worn properly for a bus ride but much riskier in a class of young kids

That’s exactly it. You only have to walk down a high street to realise the majority of adults are incapable of wearing a mask correctly. WTF is it with people wearing them on their arm FFS?!

What chance do we stand with kids?

Ah, I just started a very similar thread!

[quote FatGirlShrinking]@justfinefornow you seem to be missing the point made by several PP.

Covid spreads through droplets, so facing forward, covering mouths and noses in high traffic areas and cleaning are measures that help minimise the spread.

Colds are transmitted through the air, short of putting every kid in a hazmat suit with its own air supply there is no way to stop them breathing the air.[/quote]
The common cold is spread either by direct contact with infected secretions from contaminated surfaces or by inhaling the airborne virus after individuals sneeze or cough. Person-to-person transmission often occurs when an individual who has a cold blows or touches their nose and then touches someone or something else. From Mednet - I feel so much better now - Covid's not similar at all!

As I understand it (very happy to be corrected by a GP if there are any here), most of us carry all sorts of nasty bugs around in our nasal passages and throats all of the time, most of the time they’re latent and harmless. Given a change in conditions though, temperature, humidity etc. they can become active as it were (I don’t know the correct term) and we effectively infect ourselves.
If we never encountered another soul
for the rest of our lives, we would still contract the occasional bacterial and viral infection.

I think it’s a bit different because people aren’t self isolating for cold symptoms, so they’re still out and about in the community spreading germs.

That said, there are clearly lots of colds suddenly about so I do think we’re inevitably going to see a rise in Covid cases. But hopefully testing and self isolation will help stop it being a rampage.

I'm amused by all the talk (not just MN) of kids always getting lots of germy colds every single autumn. I have 4 DC and never noticed that autumn was that bad for kids getting colds. I have no data points to refute it, just puzzled.

Norovirus fair enough, that never happened over summer break.

DS 2condary has lots of measures that other posters are saying are not happening to their DC. Eg.: strict seating plan all day (in one room), adults have small space to move in, all homework submitted electronically, kid must wear face covers in communal areas, classroom windows are wide open. So the kids are freezing all day .

It's in the air though you cant realy sanitize the air in a school environment.

Is it possible to open windows in schools these days or are they all bomb / jumper proof?

Yeah I’m working in a nursery - zero social distancing there as the children are too small obviously— 6months old - 4 years old - we have to Carry them round/give them cuddles, play with them - they play together obviously in very close contact - there’s nothing we can do really - we all have constant colds 😂 it’s only a matter of time id say til there’s a Covid case - gonna be a fun winter 😩

Pesimistic

It's in the air though you cant realy sanitize the air in a school environment.“

I’d like to know what’s in them first, might do more harm than good for people with lung/possibly skin issues? But those fogging machines look promising.

Failing that, goldfish bowls like Sandy

@FiveGoToLidl

I wish more people were aware that other things kill too they appear to see death rate say 12 and want the whole country lock down again - clearly forgetting the overall deaths is important....

'FiveGoToLidl Thu 17-Sep-20 04:26:49
I had a look at the stats this morning and there are still more people dying with flu/pneumonia on their death certificates than Covid 19
So a lot of other bugs/things circulating and doing the rounds!
www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending4september2020'

Infection control 😂

I had to fight for special permission for my DC to even be allowed to wash her hands at school!!!

This is about bullshit Gov measures to apparently prevent the spread of Covid - which are completely ineffective, costly and probably exhausting to enforce - if something doesn't work why waste energy on it? Illness spreading, kids & teachers forced to isolate, missing two weeks of lessons at a time, as no tests available - exams for Year 11 and 13 going on as normal.

And that's not even mentioning the people who become very unwell.

I have been visiting elderly and vulnerable people at home and the loneliness and isolation has been awful for a lot of them.

Quite a few have said that they would rather die or have taken their chances with covid rather than enduring life as it is.

Their quality of life has been totally forgotten in the measures to extend it.

There would be a huge mental health crisis among the elderly in the community right now, if only the GPs were going out to identify it.

All these measures put in place to "save" them and yet I fear all we did really was abandon them.

@justfinefornow

This is about bullshit Gov measures to apparently prevent the spread of Covid - which are completely ineffective, costly and probably exhausting to enforce - if something doesn't work why waste energy on it? Illness spreading, kids & teachers forced to isolate, missing two weeks of lessons at a time, as no tests available - exams for Year 11 and 13 going on as normal. And that's not even mentioning the people who become very unwell.

Who told you the measures are intended to "prevent the spread"? That has never been the case, even with the full lockdown, it was only intended to slow spread.

It's part of the plan that there will be cases in schools, how could anyone expect that there won't? The hope is that they will be quickly contained and occur in manageable numbers, not eliminated. If that happens the reopening of schools will have been a success.

@SimpleComforts agree I might have been a bit slack with my language - I doubt the measures in school will slow it down either!