Snack culture = unhealthiness?

[Jourdain11]

I watched the 1950s episode of Back in Time for Dinner on BBC last night and it was quite interesting that, while the young family members hated the food (which admittedly looked grim), they said that they realised that they didn't actually need to have snacks all the time.

I understand that there are a lot of considerations to take into account when "combatting the nation's obesity crisis", but I really wonder if a lot of the blame lies with snacks?

It seems weird to me that, from nursery onwards, we promote this culture of having constant snacks between meals. Healthy snacks, unhealthy snacks, "treat snacks"... much of which is just unnecessary eating. And also, some of the snacks have grown to the size of small meals!

In France, where I grew up, snacking between meals was not and is not really a thing. You are supposed to feel hungry for meals! The only "snack" we ever had as kids was an after-school snack, and that would be, for example, a piece of fruit, or a yoghurt, or a slice of bread and cheese.

To put it into context, the "3 meals, 3 snacks" model is used in ED recovery programmes, designed for aggressive weight gain, i.e. because it is actually dangerous for the person to remain at their current body weight. Yet it seems like quite a large proportion of the population are also following this model!

This isn't intended as a vilification of British eating habits (as I know this exists in many other cultures also) but it does make me wonder if we have collectively got into a warped mindset about healthy eating habits and hunger, and whether this may be a big contributor to the health crises we face in this country, which have made so many people more vulnerable to serious impact from Covid-19.

Intuitive eating seems to be a better model to follow –eat when you're hungry, rather than prescriptively, which I suspect most people do.

I agree this makes the most sense, though it's easier said than done for many. I don't understand the MN obsession with forcing children, even teenagers, to eat breakfast even if they aren't hungry and it makes them feel ill. Why not just give them something that they can eat at break or on the way to school if they really don't want anything first thing in the morning?

@sunglassesonthetable

I tend to agree with you OP.

I agree you are meant to feel hungry for a meal. My mum says ' hunger is the best sauce' and I notice then when my kids are hungry to meals they wolf down a much wider variety of food and are prepared to try stuff more.

I call it "graze culture".

And could you be more pedantic @AllPlayedOut and @hula008 ? Did you just want to close down the discussion? 🙄
Isn't the after school snack for French kids called Le Gouter and much more formalised than here OP ? and not just diving into the nic us when ever you want?

Yes, it is - it is almost like a children's "meal".

@WaffleCash

Don't make the mistake of comparing France 30 years ago with the UK today. I'm 40 and the only time we had a snack growing up was something after school, much like you describe.

France in the noughties - but yes, it could be different today.

I agree with you OP. I was a child of the 70s and we rarely snacked between meals.
My 80s/90s born children had something to eat after school just to keep them going till dinner, and the odd biscuit, but I've noticed my friends with young children feed them all day.
I still don't eat snacks really. I like feeling hungry for a meal. None of my family are overweight.

YANBU

DC get what I think of as classic snacks - a piece of fruit or veg sticks at break time and sometimes something when they get home.

DH thinks he has snacks but in reality he grazes regularly through the day on biscuits - he just lifts one every time he passes the cupboard and will think nothing of eating something 30 mins before dinner. He also has about 3 packets of crisps between dinner and bed. Really boils my piss because he's a very fussy eater which creates trouble at home and I'm sure it is exacerbated by the fact that he has never been genuinely hungry in his adult life.

you crack on doing your thing and likewise we get to comment

I was wondering where that irritating yapping sound was coming from.

😉😂

@Plussizejumpsuit

Ffs yes the past was so much better as is France. Is this what you want from your post? perhaps rather than have all these smug people like you chip in with there opinions on why we (&lots of the world) have an obesity issue we could talk to obese people and form policies and interventions which are led by experience. But I guess in the meantime we'll have people like you popping up on the regular telling everyone why you think they're so fat. So insightful.

Not necessarily what I was saying at all! There are other health issues as well as obesity. For example, there is a school of thinking that eating too frequently causes digestive issues (because your digestive system never gets a proper "rest") and is a cause of IBS.

I’m Brit living in France. The OP is NBU. Snacking, the way that Brits do it, does not happen here. The only accepted time to snack is an after school goûter, it’s strictly for children. Adults don’t snack - no 10am biscuit with a cuppa, no mid afternoon tea and cake, no sitting on the sofa after dinner munching crisps and chocolate. No play piece at school either.

There’s a good programme called The Men Who Made Us Fat. It explores the growth of the obesity epidemic in the UK and the US. In the UK, the marketing / processed food industries focused on making snacking acceptable - through advertising (a finger of Fudge etc) and creating new products. It just didn’t happen in France to the same extent and snacking is not as widespread.

France in the noughties - but yes, it could be different today.
4pm merenda is still a thing for Italian DC now. People at home at 4pm usually have a cup of tea and a few biscuits too.

I think long commutes make people snack more, when I had a long commute I'd have 2 breakfasts - one at 6.30 and one just before starting. I'd also be starving on the train home.

I never understood this as if I give my children snacks they don’t eat a meal. I had WL surgery lost lots of weight, due to speed was advised to have snacks and I stopped losing and gained weight quickly

Every bit of research shows that poverty and obesity are linked. This applies to, the UK, France (shock horror, there's also fat French people) Italy and EE.

People need something to look forward to and to make feel good hormones. Fat and sugar do that and are affordable.

Since the Tory party got into power, poverty and child poverty has, been on the rise. Austerity has hit hard and deprived areas have got fatter.

Snacking is one of the things that has increased, but it's just part of the need for something good, in many cases.

There's a few GPs off the program 'GPs behind clised doors' and they call it 'shit life syndrome', they hand out pills to try to help, but can't remove the causes.

Where is the evidence on this re ibs? All my other points still stand as your op was about snacking and obesity so not sure why you are bringing ibs into it?

I agree. I work in a nursery and we feel like we feed the children, particularly the toddlers, all day long. We have breakfast open between 8-9, snack 9.30-11, lunch 11-12.15, nap, snack 2-3, light tea 3.30-4.15. It feels so constant. The preschoolers have free flow self serve snack and we find that most don't have it, they seem to go on their appetite more, but the toddlers eat and eat, then pick at tea.

I see no need for it, but parents complain if they haven't had it, even if it was the child's choice not to. Most then give them another dinner once they get home!

My own children never had constant snacks at home, still don't, perhaps an apple or orange after school, but nothing else apart from meals.

Poverty and obesity are linked but look at numbers.
Adults in poverty about 20%
Adults obese or overweight 60+%
Poverty is one factor but not the biggest one

The men who made us fat is worth a watch.

As I watched it I thought - well yes I knew most of this. As time passes I have become more annoyed at the complacency, slyness and financial greed that have ended up with the overeating of junk we have today and the belief that we need to eat frequently through the day.

I still enjoy a biscuit but freeing myself of the idea that you have to eat frequently for spurious metabolic reasons has been very helpful for me.

I was a kid in the 70s and teenager in the 80s; I don't remember snacking between meals. But constant snacking has become the norm (and I'm as guilty of it as everyone else).

I needed to lose a bit of weight so have been doing intermittent fasting for 4 weeks (roughly 16/8). I've gone from 3 big meals a day plus snacks to 2 smaller meals and no snacks and don't get hungry in between despite being active (I start every morning with a run or a workout and have my first meal between 12 and 1.30).

It's made me realise how much of my snacking was out of habit or boredom rather than out of hunger.

I agree with a pp who quoted Michael Mosley about the dangers of constant eating for insulin levels etc. The Low Carb MD podcast has useful info about this.

Also, many people don't realise it, but some behaviour from kids is pretty much simple sugar rush. My friend babysat a hyper ten year old nephew for 3 days and didn't have any (and didn't want to buy) sweets. He was much calmer when he was leaving and slept ok👀

I personally don't care what other adults choose to eat but I don't understand the kids snacking culture at the moment. My DS has just started nursery for 3 hours in the afternoon right after lunch and I cannot understand why they need a snack in that period. Theres a whole risk process with covid where they have to all have hands cleaned/single serving snacks etc. and I just don't see the point. I see all the mums on tiktok with snack boxes for their kids day during lockdown and everytime I go out with other mums they have 3x Tupperware with rice cakes and grapes. It drives me mad because my son obviously asks for a snack when he sees other kids have them but at home he would never snack. Surely you can head to the park for an hour without a snack.

@SchrodingersImmigrant, there's more than 20% of adults in relative poverty. I think you've got to split the obese and the overweight.

Of course it's eating patterns and drinking habits that fuel the numbers, but there's complex causes behind it. Individuals have got to see the effects as something that they don't want and replace food with something else. With the free and cheap sports centre offers stopping, other costs, increasing, that's going to be difficult to implement.

My mum also used to say, "you don't need a snack, it's not long till dinner" if we asked for food. I don't think it is child abuse!

I totally agree with you. If we all stuck to three meals a day and nothing in between I’m sure many of us would lose weight. I’m not sure I have the will power for that (unless I’m busy and distracted) so I try to stick to fruit only. Some of those protein bars you get are extremely rich in calories which is great if you’re climbing a mountain but not so great if you’re sitting in an office.

If you eat more calories than you burn, then you'll get fatter. Snacking is increased calories in so if course it's likely to lead to people becoming overweight unless your meals are smaller to account for them.

I reckon I need around 1600 calories a day to maintain my weight. A reasonable breakfast, lunch and dinner would account for that on a normal day with maybe 100 calories to spare - an apple, or even a very small chocolate bar would be about what I'd have room for.

The snack box for kids had just become ridiculous.

We've had situations in sports groups where 15 / 20 mins in water break was becoming snack break and it took the instructor to say "No snacks please!" Thank goodness or it does become odd to be the "neglectful" parent NOT giving a snack.

@AllPlayedOut

I'm not being obtuse. It's like saying that you don't do cycling but that you travel to work on a two wheeled pedal driven framed vehicle.

Regardless I just saw the OP's name. I hope that things are going a little easier on you Jourdain11 .

Anyway, back to the debate.

Thank you, I appreciate that! And yes, back to the debate...