To think if you rely on a food bank you may need to compromise your vegan principles?

[LondonUnited]

I’m a supporter of our local food bank and am on their mailing list. I received an email earlier to say that they were supporting a vegan family and were therefore asking for specific food donations, including Oatly oat milk, various nuts and seeds, specific types of beans, etc etc.

I may get flamed for this but I couldn’t help thinking that - allergies aside (and I have a milk allergic child so I do get it) - if you need a food bank to feed your family, you might need to compromise on diet slightly? For a start, Oatly Barista is lovely and all that, but Aldi or Asda oat milk is also ok and half the price. And that the odd bit of tinned fish may be easier to access from a food bank than Brazil nuts and chia seeds...

My son has ARFID, and only eats very specific food. His ASD and ED don’t give a shit if I’m broke and need to use a food bank. Who’s to say there isn’t a very good reason for this family’s request.

ARFID is so hard to deal with @OwlBeThere my dd has it and people don’t realise Comments like ‘well only offer what everyone else has she won’t starve herself’
Hmmm yes actually she will ☹️
It’s very poorly understood

Sorry I won't go into a halal restaurant, and I would not buy halal meat. In this case the animal's sufferering is far more important to me than whether someone chooses to go hungry because they won't eat anything that isn't halal. Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so.

Sorry I won't go into a halal restaurant, and I would not buy halal meat. In this case the animal's sufferering is far more important to me than whether someone chooses to go hungry because they won't eat anything that isn't halal. Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so. Best you go vegetarian rright now then!

Just as much of the vegetables we buy are organic, but exceed the supermarket quota so are biught and sold at the lowere 'ordinary' veg prices, a lot of meat is halal. Lots of chain restaurants, most supermarkets, New Zealand lamb.

That you don't know that says something aboiut you, but not as much as your obvious bigotry... that you don't mind saying!

Sorry (not sorry)!

There is usually no nutritional difference at all between branded and unbranded foods, unless there is a specific claim on the tin - and often not even then!

Oatly promises it is fortified with vitamins and minerals - Vitamin D2, Riboflavin, B12 and Calcium, and it's soya and milk protein free.

Provitamil oat milk is very similar but is only 30p less (according to Sainsbury's website). That seems very little to quibble over.

Sainsbury's own brand is definitely cheaper but states it is not suitable as a main milk drink for children and it has ingredients not found in Oatly or Provitamil.

Cheaper items won't always feed a greater number, unless you are expecting parents to compromise the nutrition of their children because after all they are beggars.

I have some CMPA DCs and was surprised to see how much cows' milk protein there was in 'non dairy' beverages, and casein in 'non-dairy' cheeses. It's actually hard to find truly dairy free products and you have to read labels every time you go shopping because manufacturers change ingredients. I don't know how parents with dairy and also soya allergic children managed.

Ooh, I get it. You must be marketing this stuff on the part of Big Oat 😂

I don’t think this comment is quite as hilarious as you seem to think, but good try. I assumed you asked the question because you actually wanted to know the answer, which was my mistake.

But my point was that it’s hard to believe such a new product has become a household staple. I mean, if people want to donate name-brand oat milk, go right ahead, I just find it odd is all.

You didn’t asked about branded oat milk, and my comment wasn’t specific to any particular brand. It applies to all varieties of oat milk. It is a staple in a lot of vegan households because it has advantages over a lot of other vegan milks.

@londonunited totally agree with you. A vegan diet is expensive. You need to adjust if your needing a foodbank

Yes they can have a slightly cheaper brand of oat milk, but it makes me sad when I see the food bank box in Sainsburys full of really cheap cereal, beans, and pasta. It always has a vibe of this is all you're worth.

Sorry I won't go into a halal restaurant, and I would not buy halal meat. In this case the animal's sufferering is far more important to me than whether someone chooses to go hungry because they won't eat anything that isn't halal. Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so.

It always baffles me that some people will object so strongly to one variety of animal slaughter and celebrate another - even though there isn’t actually any evidence that stunning an animal prior to slaughter is less cruel.

Comments like this always smack of bigotry. Did you know that most halal meat comes from animals which were stunned before slaughter, and the only difference between their deaths and those of the animals that provided non-halal meat is that a ritual prayer was said first?

Kosher meat, on the other hand, specifically prohibits any kind of stunning of the animal first. And yet nobody ever complains about the cruelty of kosher the way they complain about the cruelty of halal.

And for the record, if you buy dead animals you’ve almost certainly consumed halal meat. Waitrose, Marks & Spencer, Sainsbury’s, Tesco, Somerfield and the Co-op all sell halal meat (mostly lamb and chicken but also some beef) which is not labelled as being halal. Domino’s Pizza, Pizza Hut, KFC, Nando’s and Subway also use halal meat without explicitly informing customers.

I think they’re being unreasonable. If they’re vegan, that’s fine but accept whatever vegan items there are and plan their meals accordingly, not requesting named brands or pricier options (ie type of nut)

If you loose your job this month and need to use a foodbank, think about the comments you have posted here

@TheHappyHerbivore

Sorry I won't go into a halal restaurant, and I would not buy halal meat. In this case the animal's sufferering is far more important to me than whether someone chooses to go hungry because they won't eat anything that isn't halal. Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so.

It always baffles me that some people will object so strongly to one variety of animal slaughter and celebrate another - even though there isn’t actually any evidence that stunning an animal prior to slaughter is less cruel.

Comments like this always smack of bigotry. Did you know that most halal meat comes from animals which were stunned before slaughter, and the only difference between their deaths and those of the animals that provided non-halal meat is that a ritual prayer was said first?

Kosher meat, on the other hand, specifically prohibits any kind of stunning of the animal first. And yet nobody ever complains about the cruelty of kosher the way they complain about the cruelty of halal.

And for the record, if you buy dead animals you’ve almost certainly consumed halal meat. Waitrose, Marks & Spencer, Sainsbury’s, Tesco, Somerfield and the Co-op all sell halal meat (mostly lamb and chicken but also some beef) which is not labelled as being halal. Domino’s Pizza, Pizza Hut, KFC, Nando’s and Subway also use halal meat without explicitly informing customers.

Yes but most muslims are brown therefore islam is bad. Where as ignorant racists seem to think all jewish people are white so they fit in their narrow definition of ‘okay’.

How do you know that they are vegan due to their beliefs around animals? Myself and my husband are on a strict vegan diet because he has a severe heart condition. The recommended diet for people with heart conditions is normally plant based. As soon as he eats meat for a few days he begins getting symptoms again (palpitations, breathlessness, chest pain). So for us, switching back to meat could really effect his health.

Yes but most muslims are brown therefore islam is bad. Where as ignorant racists seem to think all jewish people are white so they fit in their narrow definition of ‘okay’. So true!

@happinessischocolate

Yes they can have a slightly cheaper brand of oat milk, but it makes me sad when I see the food bank box in Sainsburys full of really cheap cereal, beans, and pasta. It always has a vibe of this is all you're worth.

I place an item for 2 in every time I go shopping. The cage in my local Tesco is normally a mixture of branded and unbranded stuff. At Xmas a lot of Cadbury selection boxes and chocolate coins are also in it.

Item or 2*

The type of nut is very important.

Brazil nuts provide selenium which is a vital nutrient. Most UK adults are deficient in selenium. Everyone should consider a couple of Brazil nuts per day to bring levels of selenium up to where they should be.
www.plantbasednews.org/lifestyle/selenium-what-is-it-and-why-do-vegans-need-it
Selenium deficiency can increase the risk of infection and disease and is linked to a number of neurodegenerative diseases, such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's disease, and mood changes, cardiovascular disease and cancer.

Deficiency has also been linked to reproductive problems, including male and female infertility, miscarriage, preeclampsia, foetal growth restriction (undersized unborn baby), premature labour, gestational diabetes and obstetric cholestasis (a liver disorder that can occur in pregnancy).

Brazil nuts are probably the best plant source of selenium available in food. Other good sources are shellfish and organ meats.
ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Selenium-HealthProfessional/

It turns out the cheeky fuckers know more about nutrition than those sniffing about special nuts...

Brazil nuts are probably the best plant source of selenium available in food. And are also the most dangerous to those with nut allergies. Some of the stories about them are terrifying!

Pros and cons....

I don’t think this comment is quite as hilarious as you seem to think, but good try

Yeah, you really don’t seem to have much of a sense of humour 🤷‍♀️

You didn’t asked about branded oat milk, and my comment wasn’t specific to any particular brand. It applies to all varieties of oat milk. It is a staple in a lot of vegan households because it has advantages over a lot of other vegan milks

Yes, but presumably they were drinking something else before the big boom in oat milk. How could a product that became super popular just last year suddenly become a household staple?

Like I said, I really don’t care what individual people donate. They can donate name-brand oat milk or Brazil nuts or whatever (even if this is against the advice of a lot food bank managers). That’s their business.

I just find the concept of oat milk being some sort of staple product very odd.

Yes they can have a slightly cheaper brand of oat milk, but it makes me sad when I see the food bank box in Sainsburys full of really cheap cereal, beans, and pasta. It always has a vibe of this is all you're worth

A PP mentioned that a food bank manager said it is better to buy more product with your money than to buy a name-brand.

I tend to agree with that assessment, it seems like it would serve the most people in the most efficient manner, which should be the basic consideration here.

Besides, in a lot of cases, store-brand is just as good if not better than name-brand. You are just paying for branding and marketing.

It always baffles me that some people will object so strongly to one variety of animal slaughter and celebrate another - even though there isn’t actually any evidence that stunning an animal prior to slaughter is less cruel

Also baffling that people are so strongly against Halal meat while being totally ignorant that all of it sold in mass market chain places, so supermarkets, KFC, Dominos etc is killed in exactly the same way as non Halal meat except that a prayer is played while it happens.

You have to go to a specialist Muslim butchers to get non stunned Halal meat, and these are few and far between and only located in areas where there is a demand for it. Most non Muslims will never have seen one.

Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so

Many food is naturally Halal, just like it is naturally vegan. Are you suggesting that we should ban potatoes, carrots and onions?

Yeah, you really don’t seem to have much of a sense of humour 🤷‍♀️

Sorry, I was probably being needlessly snarky there. I just didn’t really get why you would appear to ask a question in good faith, and then treat a good faith response as a joke. I also just didn’t think it was particularly funny / clever, but we all have different senses of humour and no doubt some of what amuses me would be tedious to you!

Yes, but presumably they were drinking something else before the big boom in oat milk. How could a product that became super popular just last year suddenly become a household staple?

Oat milk has been around since the 90s. Oatly specifically has been available in the UK for 3 years. So it’s not quite as new as you think.

It has become very popular because for many vegans, it’s an improvement on previous options. I don’t like the taste of soya milk and it tends to split very easily in hot drinks. Almond milk is very bad for the environment (though still better than cow’s milk) and is harmful to native bee species in areas where it’s grown. Coconut milk is nice for some things but too heavily flavoured for others. Rice milk is watery and tasteless. Let’s not even entertain hemp milk and pea milk, they’re repulsive.

For me, oat milk is the only one which can be used for any purpose you want to put milk to, and the texture and taste are lovely. That’s why it became a staple in my household, and why lots of vegans feel the same.

Think of it this way - vegan milks have always been a staple in vegan households. Oat milk is considered by many to be the best vegan milk. It’s not really that confusing, is it?

Like I said, I really don’t care what individual people donate. They can donate name-brand oat milk or Brazil nuts or whatever (even if this is against the advice of a lot food bank managers). That’s their business.

I don’t think food banks managers are explicitly saying don’t donate brands. They’re saying better to donate more products that are less expensive if that’s what you can afford. For those of us who can afford to donate brands without it reducing the amount we donate, it’s not an issue.

I just find the concept of oat milk being some sort of staple product very odd.

Probably because you aren’t vegan and just don’t know what staples are for people who eat very differently to you. You probably wouldn’t argue that milk is a staple for most people. Vegan milk is a staple for vegans, and oat milk is a common favourite for the reasons I already explained (much to your intense amusement, apparently).

@CuriousaboutSamphire, they probably wouldn't be asking for them if they were allergic.

Yes, but presumably they were drinking something else before the big boom in oat milk. How could a product that became super popular just last year suddenly become a household staple?
@MangoFeverDream, my DCs (cows' milk protein allergic) were drinking oat milk and other milks that I made myself 30 years ago using my blender and strainer, and it was available in health food shops since that time too, with some supermarkets stocking it.

Just because you haven't noticed it until recently doesn't mean it hasn't been a thing for decades. Just because you have made a mental note of it as some sort of smoke and mirrors product designed to part fools from their money doesn't mean it isn't a staple that forms a part of other people's balanced diet.

Besides, in a lot of cases, store-brand is just as good if not better than name-brand. You are just paying for branding and marketing.
No, it's really not, if you are vegan or if you have allergies, especially if you are trying to substitute dairy products for a child or a pregnant woman and ensure proper nutrition.

@BarbaraofSeville

It always baffles me that some people will object so strongly to one variety of animal slaughter and celebrate another - even though there isn’t actually any evidence that stunning an animal prior to slaughter is less cruel

Also baffling that people are so strongly against Halal meat while being totally ignorant that all of it sold in mass market chain places, so supermarkets, KFC, Dominos etc is killed in exactly the same way as non Halal meat except that a prayer is played while it happens.

You have to go to a specialist Muslim butchers to get non stunned Halal meat, and these are few and far between and only located in areas where there is a demand for it. Most non Muslims will never have seen one.

Actually I think that the UK should ban all halal food, and I don't mind saying so

Many food is naturally Halal, just like it is naturally vegan. Are you suggesting that we should ban potatoes, carrots and onions?

@BarbaraofSeville well said!

No, it's really not, if you are vegan or if you have allergies, especially if you are trying to substitute dairy products for a child or a pregnant woman and ensure proper nutrition

What are you talking about? Store labels have to be clear according to government regulations. I’ve never heard of someone dying from mislabelled store-brands specifically. In fact, I find the simple labels of store-brands easier to parse when it comes to ingredient lists. And like I said, often they are just as good as name-brands (often they are made in the same factories, btw).

I’m sorry, I don’t believe that brand-names label things better than store-brands or that people with allergies are at more risk from store-brands. That’s quite a claim.