AIBU to have criticised estranged H

[strugglingtofindausername]

Name changed for this.

I have separated from DH but he still visits once a week staying overnight to see our toddler and I visit his. He was abusive during our marriage. He would swear at me, call me a C word, break my things, financially not help me, spat at me, wish I was dead etc. Police called once. But for the sake of our toddler we spend this time together. He can't be trusted with toddler and has shown little interest. We have been getting on fine no arguing etc.

DH is a gardener. He didn't do a course so is practically on minimum wage. He is only able to rent somewhere because he had inheritance which propped him up. He did a degree at university but never managed to stay in PR/marketing and just wouldn't make it past the internships etc. He couldn't deal with the office environment and wanted to do his own thing. He is quite lazy though always has been and even in the summer only works about 3.5 days per week.

Anyway I am a professional earning around £50k. H never pays maintenance. I don't ask him as he can't really afford it. I am barely managing given the full time nursery fees I have and the fact I have to try to buy him out of this house.

He is in the process of getting a loan from his parents to buy a £15k car!!! I drive a banged up hand me down that has done over 100k miles and is 19 years old. He is talking about going on holiday. He is only able to do this because his parents have enabled him and I have but he will be in for a shock once this stops.

We were talking today and H said something along the lines of I hope toddler likes gardening and he can be a self employed gardener like me. I said I didn't want him to be and he shouldn't encourage him. When pushed I explained that he isn't even able to support his son because of this and is having to rely on parents or me historically. He accused me of being a snob but I explained I want toddler to do better in life than both of us as we both are struggling in one way albeit me temporarily I hope for now. He got so angry called me the C word etc and shouted etc and I am now hiding in the car for a bit of breathing space.

Am I a snob? How do I encourage H while we coparent to try to want the best for toddler. H's choices and opportunities are limited in life. He is in a basement ground floor flat, can't get a mortgage and when his inheritance runs out can't afford to rent.

I don't want him wanting that kind of life for toddler.

You aren't a snob, but I really don't think it matters either way. You have much bigger problems. Why are you allowing someone who has repeatedly assaulted you to stay overnight in your home?

You owe this man nothing. He sounds vile. Might be time to rearrange contact with his son. If he doesn't like it and causes a fuss then you can go through the courts to sort it.

@Iloveyoutothefridgeandback

You aren't a snob, but I really don't think it matters either way. You have much bigger problems. Why are you allowing someone who has repeatedly assaulted you to stay overnight in your home?

You owe this man nothing. He sounds vile. Might be time to rearrange contact with his son. If he doesn't like it and causes a fuss then you can go through the courts to sort it.

Exactly this.

You’re not a snob but gardening is still a worthwhile skill.

Soon your childcare fees will plummet and your ex will still be an asshole bumming around.

"Grey rock". Don't engage. Don't get emotional. Stop having these deep conversations! You say he's there to see the kid, let him do that and nothing else. You don't need to be talking about these chit chat small talk things. It's inconsequential (what he said about the gardening job is irrelevant - the child is still a toddler!).

Stop enabling this man. He's an adult. And he's your ex because he's a twat. Dont try to have grown up conversations. Focus on moving on and getting the house sorted and never letting him in it again.

OP you are going to have this abusive man in your life (and that if his child) for a very long time, so you do need to find a way of dealing with him which doesn't leave you hiding in the car for a bit of breathing space.** ^^ That's not safe physically or emotionally for you. It's not great for your son, either, to be in such an atmosphere.

He can say what he wants his child to do but his son will have his own ideas and will ultimately make his own decisions whatever his parents think.

I think for now you need to take steps to stay safe and also pursue him for child maintenance. The fact that he's lazy should not be a get out of jail card for him - especially if he's already not paying the mortgage.

He is playing you OP. You watch your back. Have you taken any legal advice about your situation? 🌹

Worrying about your toddler being influenced to be a gardener is literally the last thing you should be worried about here.... it’s more likely he is going to grow up being influenced to treat other people (women) like shit and that it’s acceptable to threaten and abuse your partner.

^ 100% this. You appear to accept being called revolting names and your ex’s temper which will be having a terribly detrimental effect on your child long term, but couldn’t let it slide that your ex says he hopes your son takes after him and is a gardener? I mean. I get why you feel that way and I don’t think you’re being a snob as your ex sounds like he’s a sponging wankstain. Also do seriously consider claiming maintenance for your son, even if it’s a small amount. His father should be taking care of him financially. Also stop contact that involves you having to be present. You don’t need to put up with the abuse you are subjected to. If that means he can’t see his child then frankly that’s his own fault due to his own actions and you being unable to trust him. He’ll need to take action for contact and prove himself to be a safe, stable person for his child to be around.

Stop having him come to stay over, and start claiming money back from him regardless. Your toddler could be anything when he grows up, silly to argue about it

Get this twat the hell out of your life and report him to the CMA. End overnight visits.
Its about time this loser grew up.

I totally agree with @GabriellaMontez.
It's up to him to take responsibility for contact with his son, and ensuring that he has a suitable place to take him. If he hasn't, then suggest a contact centre or that he takes him out for a few hours on a Saturday morning etc.
I suspect that he won't bother so much when he has to take responsibility, and you stop making it so easy for him. It's not neccessarily a bad thing to find this out while your son is very young as it can avoid a lot of emotional upset when he's older.

Is the problem being a self employed Gardner or being a not really working Gardner who has no intention of supporting his family like him the problem? I think that will define if you are a snob. However, I do think it was a bit unnecessary to bring it up with this man.

That being said. That is the least of your problems. PP's have some great advice, you need to think of a new solution on moving forward.

The point is that he earns so little money through his own fault - not getting qualified and being lazy - that he cannot afford to support his son, but at the same time he is happy to take hand outs from his parents for nice cars and holidays. It doesn’t matter where the OP earns a million pounds an hour. It matters that her child has a father who will not contribute to his upbringing and who is abusive to boot. No, you’re not AIBU, this is about your frustration at having to do everything and getting shat on in return, and I’m guessing that was probably the reason you split up too.

@Beldon

Sorry but you do sound a snob from that comment. Also £50,000 is a more than a majority of couples with a child (including me with 3 children) are living on so not sure how you are struggling on it. Doesn’t take away from how he treated you or the name calling though and perhaps you need to come up with another plan to reduce contact between you two as it doesn’t sound like it’s working.

50k earning for one person is far less than 50k for 2. Where 2 people earn 25k each, NI and tax is spread over 2, not one. Plus they would get 100% child benefit. Additionally, those 2 people would potentially be able to save on childcare by one working early, the other late.

Op does not sound like a snob.

Thanks for all the advice. This is the first argument we have had since separating so I thought we could have a peaceful environment for the toddler when he does visit.

I'm just so concerned he will have overnight contact that I am agreeing to this as the lesser of two evils.

If he's that lazy then I doubt he'd want more than one overnight. But I'd stop him coming over.

One thing your child will follow on with courtesy of his father is treating you, & other women, abusively. Get a residency order for the house & if he wants to see his son, he needs to go to court & you need to insist contact is supervised (NOT by you). Well done for getting away from him, now please safeguard your child by staying away from him. No father is better than an abusive father.

I can't believe you let him stay over night! Seriously?? Your ex is your ex so start living like a single person.

At which point are you expecting him to get his life together, you'll find a new partner and have to explain that your ex still pops round.
He's a grown up he's just had an argument with you about how he's a great role model. Send him a text that you've underestimated him and from next week you're happy for him to take Ds, that you know he won't use his flat due to ds asthma. And that you'll be following through with your maintenance claim.
Even if you don't need it you can put it in a savings account for ds.

"But for the sake of our toddler we spend this time together."
You are separated. Your child needs to get used to it. Stop spending this time together.

"He can't be trusted with toddler"
What do you mean? Why can't he be trusted with his child?

"H never pays maintenance. I don't ask him as he can't really afford it. I am barely managing given the full time nursery fees I have and the fact I have to try to buy him out of this house."
Irrespective of your H being on minimum wage, you should claim CM. You are facilitating your H to not take his responsibilities seriously.

"He is in the process of getting a loan from his parents to buy a £15k car!!! I drive a banged up hand me down that has done over 100k miles and is 19 years old. He is talking about going on holiday."
So? This is none of your business.

"He is only able to do this because his parents have enabled him and I have but he will be in for a shock once this stops."
So why do you choose to enable it? You can't criticise his behaviour whilst, at the same time, enabling it.

"He accused me of being a snob"
You are a snob. Your DS may grow up loving the outdoors and gardening. There is nothing wrong with being a gardener. My DH and I are both professionals. I also love gardening and, if I had a child who wanted to be a gardener, I would have no problem with it. I would want them to do something that makes them happy.

"I explained I want toddler to do better in life than both of us as we both are struggling in one way albeit me temporarily I hope for now."
Snobbery showing again. If you measure "doing better" in life as how much you earn then you are seriously deluded.

Your ex shouldn't have shouted and called me the C word but you shouldn't have insulted him by basically telling him what he does is not good enough.

"Am I a snob?"
Yes.

"How do I encourage H while we coparent to try to want the best for toddler."
Your H probably does want the best for your child. Why wouldn't he? You differ in what you believe is "the best" for your child. You are only responsible for yourself. You cannot control how others think.

"H's choices and opportunities are limited in life."
IF they are, and I don't see why they are any more limited than yours, this is none of your business.

He could be the Head Gardener for a NT property, a gardener designer, a landscaper, work in forestry, a Horticultural Specialist amongst other roles. He could write books about his trade, present TV gardening programmes, be famed at flower shows for his gardens.

You need to stop trying to control others. You are only responsible for your own behaviour. Your h is responsible for his.

I'm a snob too, if I want a better life for my kids than sponging off others and not taking responsibility in a minimum wage job.

I would love my kids to have a passion for the outdoors and to gain skills that allow them to follow an interesting career path. Neither are academic... However, this isn't what he said, he said part time, self employed gardener. He meant to be like him and justify his life choices then took it personally and as an excuse to abuse you. The argument was engineered - he just wanted to shout at you about the chip in his shoulder...

You evidently can't see it, but your priorities are all wrong here.

1. Finances need to be sorted properly, including claiming the CM you're entitled to for your son. Think of it as your sons money and you're doing him a disservice by not claiming it for him.

1. Stop all the back and forth visiting with your ex. It isn't normal and isn't going to work in the long term, because as time goes on you'll be constantly living on a knife edge of having to maintain the peace in order for the arrangement to continue and that will sometimes mean not saying things that really need to be said.

1. If you have genuine concerns for your child's safety if he was to start spending time with his dad alone, you need to explore these concerns through the proper channels, including legally if necessary. If you don't believe he would hurt him, but he's not shown himself to be a great parent practically because you normally step in, he may well improve when he has no other option. It's very unlikely a court would grant supervised visitation unless there's evidence your ex would be a danger to the child.

1. Pick your battles, as others have said. It really doesn't matter what your son grows up to be at this point and there really is nothing wrong with gardening as a career choice. His work ethic is what will matter in the future and he can learn the positives of that from you, if he spends the majority of his time in your home. These aren't the types of conversations you need to be having with your ex when, ultimately, it's completely up to your son what he does in terms of his future career.

1. I can see why £50k wouldn't go all that far practically when factoring in childcare costs as well as regular outgoings, but I think this comment in your OP "I explained I want toddler to do better in life than both of us as we both are struggling in one way", is the one that makes you seem snobbish/disparaging. You must see that as a professional earning £50k a year, you're struggling through the life choices you've made, not because of your actual income level, which a lot of families would be grateful to have. Your son's future will also be influenced by the life choices he makes and they may not align perfectly with what you'd want for him; that's all part of parenting and is something you'll have to come to terms with sooner or later.

You really don't need to ne worrying at this stage about what career choices your toddler will make. Ignore all the remarks about whether you're a snob or not-it's pretty irrelevant whether you are or not really.
You do need to be concerned about sorting out your current domestic arrangements and contact. Do you really want to continue with the current setup? It seems wuite untenable in the longer term and isn't even working well in the short term.
Now seems a good opportunity to tell him that he can no longer stay overnight, or even come in the house. Let him take the lead with suggestions and solutions about how he can arrange his contact- all you have to do is say whether you're in agreement with them. Let him know what you're truly comfortable with.If you don't agree with his suggestions, then he is free to seek legal advice. As I said in an earlier post, test out his committment to his son. Also, tell him if he can afford to repay a 15K loan, then he can certainly afford to make child maintenance payments. Stop indulging him and start thinking as a single parent and what is in your and your child's best interests, both emotionally and financially.
You should seek legal advice too, more about the house at this stage.

Self employed gardeners can earn a decent amount of money if they work hard, I do think it is snobbish to say you don't want your child to go down that route.

Slight aside, but as you are struggling financially consider sharing with your DS and get a lodger in.

Sorry your ex is so abusive

I see what you were saying - not so much that you don't want your DS to be a gardener, but you don't want him to be a slacker like your ex who has fallen into gardening through luck and is still a slacker not through hard work and deserved effort. As pp have said, stop the stop overs. I doubt he will go to court over it.