to think that it's wrong to have the pubs open and theatres closed

[bettsbattenburg]

twitter.com/markgoldthorp/status/1279680026791882752/photo/1

Theatres aren't allowed to open (why?) and yet pubs are? This kind of scene is ridiculous, it should be the opposite.

Oh, I agree with you. I started a similar thread this morning. It feels like pubs are valued above everything else in this country.

I think if cinemas are open then theatres should be. With distancing between parties. The only reason I can think of is the performers might not be able to distance and obviously can't wear masks. If there's lots of singing/voice projection, that is what will expel droplets into the air.

@Fairenuff

I think if cinemas are open then theatres should be. With distancing between parties. The only reason I can think of is the performers might not be able to distance and obviously can't wear masks. If there's lots of singing/voice projection, that is what will expel droplets into the air.

I agree about the voice projection but the same is going to happen on a much larger scale with people in pubs.

I do feel for the arts industry. I also think theatres would be able to manage social distancing much better without compromising social distancing. Surely they could open at reduced capacity to allow for spaced seating.
I suppose it boils down to industries that can rapidly prop up the economy. I'm sure many people can afford a pint but perhaps not theatre tickets.

@Notcontent

Oh, I agree with you. I started a similar thread this morning. It feels like pubs are valued above everything else in this country.

I didn't see your thread, sorry!

I was also going to say that it's about voice projection and sweating under the lights etc, which will cause an exchange of body fluids. Costumes, makeup and wigs would need special care.

Theatre casts vary in age and many would be more vulnerable, unlike most pub staff.

For their protection, it's too soon.

'I agree about the voice projection but the same is going to happen on a much larger scale with people in pubs.'

But people in pubs go there voluntarily. They don't have to expose themselves to risk if they don't want to. The pub employees all have PPE.

Performers are employees. If they are not allowed/able to use PPE then they should not be put at risk.

YANBU, of course. It's all about trying to pump as much money back into the economy, rathervthan what's safe.🙄

@CremeEggThief

YANBU, of course. It's all about trying to pump as much money back into the economy, rathervthan what's safe.🙄

But surely that would mean that theatres would be open as they are part of the economy too. How does it help the economy to keep them closed? I do think, in the case of theates, it has to be because of workplace risk assessments.

I don’t think pubs and theatres are comparable. You can SD in pubs (whether people will is another matter) and staff can where PPE. Theatre performers can’t do either, realistically. And whilst not discounting the importance of theatre (I’m desperate for them to return myself), in terms of the economy (jobs, spending etc) then pubs are more ‘important’.

Again, I’m not saying either pubs SHOULD be open or that theatres SHOULDN’T be, just that I don’t think it’s one or the other.

@Fairenuff

I think if cinemas are open then theatres should be. With distancing between parties. The only reason I can think of is the performers might not be able to distance and obviously can't wear masks. If there's lots of singing/voice projection, that is what will expel droplets into the air.

But it's not for the audiences' protection that theatres are closed. You can't do theatre without very close contact.

Make-up and costume is done in cramped conditions.
So do quick costume changes in the wings.
Most theatre involves close physical contact/touching.
People sweat under the lights very easily.
You have numerous people touching sound and light equipment and it's impossible to clean it between uses.
Cleaning props and stage equipment without damaging them.

And on top of that, you'd need to socially distance the audience. They'd make a loss just opening the doors.

You can choose to leave a pub if it's busy (in fact, you don't need to go at all if you don't want). You can choose to wear PPE. Performers can't wear PPE or walk out mid performance if they're not comfortable. They're really not valid comparisons at all.

On this basis, I think it's nonsense that schools are expected to welcome all children back but theatres must stay closed.

I get the close proximity thing but schools have basically been told to follow guidelines that absolutely won't work (SD with over 1000 children moving around a site regularly? Nah, SD won't happen...) It seems to be OK for 30+ children / teens to all breathe & talk in the same cramped space for hours every day but performers can't do it in a much larger space?

I have a lot of friends who work in theatre and they, quite frankly, are fucked. If we don't reopen theatres soon, there won't BE any theatres or people to work in them. Yes, it's a risk but seems to be that SD in any real sense has been abandoned by opening pubs, non-essential shops, etc. anyway.

Absolutely

I understand why cinemas and not theatres. Theatres are less able to function with reduced capacity, performances are often prebooked months in advance, if you need to drastically reduce tickets who gets to go and who has to miss out? Difficulty in performers and crew social distancing during rehearsals and performances. People don’t tend to nip out of a show to go to the loo so everyone is trying to go in the interval whereas in a cinema it’s more acceptable for people to go as and when.

But I think the only reason for pubs to be reopening before theatres is leverage and money. The pub industry has more leverage than theatres, and brings in more money from tax. Yes they will have reduced numbers of customers but drunk people don’t social distance well, there’s a big cluster in the US that has been traced to one particular bar. And there’s far more risk of anti social behaviour and impact on the police and nhs, especially when it’s billed “super saturday” ffs.

The big problem theatres have is that they can't afford to play to socially distanced audiences; it costs too much to open to have 1/3 of the audience there. Big Pub - 10 staff for an evening, as many pints as they can pull. Theatre - performers, backstage crew, lighting and sound technicians, front of house staff... a smallish provincial theatre probably has 40+ people employed per night. They need the bums on seats to justify the performance.

It feels like pubs are valued above everything else in this country

I think football is valued above everything. I just don't get it.

'But it's not for the audiences' protection that theatres are closed. You can't do theatre without very close contact.'

Yes I know. That was my point above. That's why I said I thought it must be more to do with workplace risk assessment.

It's a sad reflection on where our priorities lie. Of course, theatres can find ways to implement PPE and social distancing. But getting drunk is much more important to Brits than some 'highbrow' theatrical stuff. Sadly, it will also impact our death figures, as drunks don't socially distance.

A woman on the radio this morning said thatre seats ar smaller and closer together. With the minimum social distancing it would be uneconomic. Also no singing or wind instruments.

Schools have to be open mostly for childcare I think. People need to go back to work. The risk is having to be balanced against the gain. It's not ideal but there is really no other option other than saying those that are able and willing to home educate do so.

I agree but I thought there was evidence was live performances are higher risk. :(
West end theatres were offered to open at a certain reduced audience capacity but declined due to costs. It’s unaffordable.

Many theatre staff are objecting to having to be closed though, surely they know the risks that they are facing?

@Jaxhog

It's a sad reflection on where our priorities lie. Of course, theatres can find ways to implement PPE and social distancing. But getting drunk is much more important to Brits than some 'highbrow' theatrical stuff. Sadly, it will also impact our death figures, as drunks don't socially distance.

I disagree. I think implementing PPE onstage and backstage would be very difficult indeed.

Imagine going to the theatre where all the actors wear masks and/or face visors and there are no costume or set changes. Many performers do not want to return to work under those conditions.

I'm in Scotland.pubs open Monday but offices are still shut!

Really, you have to ask why theatres are closed?

Actors have to be intimately close with each other; they’re signing, dancing, projecting - it’s not possible to keep them safe at the moment.

Not only that but theatres simply can not operate at the 25% capacity social distancing would ensure.