Is spending to help the economy not tank on your mind d?

[EinsteinaGogo]

Hi all,

We had people round for a bbq last night - really, really nice to see people properly again.

We got to talking about how we've been very lucky to work from home, saved on commuting costs, Prets lunches and coffees etc, and I talked about how I've been glad to stop spending on frivolous things and would try and continue to save where possible.

I was kind of a lone voice, as the general perspective was that (if you could afford to) you should be pumping your cash back into the economy right now. Use it or lose it.

Also started talking about pension schemes etc., and how we need to spend to ensure investments don't crash.

Do you have the economy on your mind too, and have a 'spend to support it' mindset?

I'm more scared about being laid off in future so want to build as much buffer as possible... am I in the minority?

I’ve always been quite frugal in some ways (watching people spend £3 on coffee a few times a day bewilders me). However I have a weakness for beach holidays so I save the pennies to have a splurge now and then.

IME people who tell you to spend to bolster the economy are poor at saving and they don’t want anyone else to save either.

I am consciously spending money in our village shops and cafes, it’s vital.

If they close, those people stop spending too, and then more businesses close and their redundant employees stop spending.., it spreads, like a virus.

Small regular business goes a long way just now. You don’t need to go and buy a Porsche but you should go to your local gift shop and buy a candle, get a bacon roll from the cafe, that kind of thing.

Nope. I cant really offord too. Plus I don't feel like I need to buy nice clothes etc anymore.

I'm trying to buy for the life I need right now not the life I want / had.

YY Bilzo Agree with that.

Spend to support the economy...

I don't think anyone saying this, is saying 'spend what you don't have, on shit you don't need.

I certainly am not.

However IF you are going to spend, consider spending it locally, or with small businesses rather than giants.

If we all do that, things will not be so bad - if those of us who can afford to that but instead hoarde all our shiny pennies to ourselves, well, thats gonna be fun down the line, those shiny pennies will drop in value and you'll end up spending more of them on the basics.

But its up to you, it's your money.

We were saving for a house deposit pre covid so not commuting/socialising has been really helpful to add to that fund. However it’s looking like getting a mortgage at the moment with a 10% deposit is proving really difficult so who knows if we’ll just be sitting on it.

But we are trying to spend cash in local businesses - takeaway cafes and small shops etc - to help them get through.

One reason why people are reluctant to spend is because they dont trust the Government. Especially after ten years of austerity and cuts and are nervous about what they will cut to pay for all this,

Spend to support the economy...

I don't think anyone saying this, is saying 'spend what you don't have, on shit you don't need

The OP’s friend is I.e. he is saying spend to save the economy (not small businesses)

@ItWasTheBestOfTimes

”and think our country would be much better placed to recover from economic crisis if we had better out of work benefits like Germany. If we did, people wouldn’t worry so much about spending and some of the redundancies would probably be avoided.”

As well as, I have read accounts on MH where people have been saving a deposit to get on the housing ladder and now unemployed. Those savings are now being used to survive because with savings over £6000, UN is reduced.

Lockdown has highlighted how much we spend on “stuff”, our outgoings have been significantly less and I don’t see us being in a rush to start spending in the same way again. I’m not about to spend to save the economy - the economy has been fucked long before coronavirus, I’d suggest politicians and big business can sort out the mess they’ve made.

Most people have stopped spending, yesterday I went to a very large shopping center one of the largest in the U.K.
pretty dead
Also bit worrying really for the economy and how we are going to get out of the even bigger debt this country in now in

We're saving for a house deposit too so no commuting or nursery fees has helped lots.

I do feel bad I haven't managed to help local businesses much (apart from our local bread van) but it's nearly impossible to just browse these days with a 4 year old and pram in tow, especially if the first shop doesn't the right size/ingredient then you have to start again.

I do miss shops though, I hate online shopping for clothes (needed new summer stuff)

Both I guess. I went and frittered some money away in the local independent bookshop over the weekend and have been buying online during these months but have also saved a bit too. I am concerned that if everyone stops spending that is going to be much worse for everyone involved especially those already on low incomes and no savings.

If you take a step back and look at the bigger picture you realise it’s all one large vicious circle really. Yes everyone seems to prefer supporting ‘local’ businesses to large multinats but those awful multinats are huge employers. So it’s great that you’re supporting your local baker, butcher...candlestick maker but then you forfeit the right to tut and complain at the news when another multinat chain collapses and X thousand U.K. jobs are lost.
‘Local’ businesses tend to be run by the people who own them and staffing costs kept to an absolute minimum. Women should also consider that multinats are the biggest source of ‘odd hours’ jobs. Evenings, nights, weekends...etc let’s face it an awful lot of young families (or those with caring responsibilities) rely on jobs outside the usual 9-5 mon-fri.

I think everyone has the right to save their money, I 100% support that but you don’t have the right to boycott large companies then whinge when they inevitably shut down!

There also needs to be recognition that most people with reliable employment were struggling to get by before CV happened. So raising taxes will force many into poverty/further into poverty. My DH is a ‘high earner’ but due to the area we live (job is dependant in this) we wouldn’t be able to pay our mortgage/utilities if taxes were raised. We’d get much more financial help on UC (I’ve done the calculations and we’d have no other choice really if taxes do increase significantly)

One reason why people are reluctant to spend is because they dont trust the Government. Especially after ten years of austerity and cuts and are nervous about what they will cut to pay for all this,

Exactly I don't trust them at all. I'm in my 30s will I ever see the state pension? will the NHS exist in its current form when I'm 65+? i'm thinking no & thought this before Covid. I have to look after myself.

I see where they’re coming from in a way, but like you I’ve saved money and am in no rush to start spending on things I don’t really need. I was in the clothes area of M&S the other day and also in Debenhams and H&M. They all looked like jumble sales with lots of stuff from last season mixed with this season, and up to 50% off. I didn’t buy anything, but it occurred to me that if everyone does the same we won’t have these shops in the future. I’m not sure what the answer is to be honest. I think a lot of businesses will go to the wall unfortunately and even if people start spending, it might be a case of too little, too late.

I think everyone has the right to save their money, I 100% support that but you don’t have the right to boycott large companies then whinge when they inevitably shut down!

My problem with a lot of the big companies is when times are good the profits are taken out & not saved for a rainy day. The rainy day comes & it's not the 0.01% who own these companies that are affected but their staff or who often pay tax. Plus many staff work particularly in retail work in crappy conditions & the tax payers have to boost their wages but it's not enough to live on.

I agree with you about tax. I don't want to pay anymore income tax

Unfortunately inequality in this country is so stark that most of us will be desperately saving.

It would really help the economy if our leaders properly taxed their friends eg amazon

It's made me think about how I spend my money. During lockdown I have made arrangements to spend significant sums on buildings works, so that sector will do nicely out of me but I don't think I will go back to the impulse buying of clothes and takeaway coffee.

I think it will be a long time before regular eating out returns for me, just because I don't think it will be enjoyable, likewise visiting tourist hot spots where people (perhaps a minority, but a vocal one) have made it clear we're not wanted.

I've also become much more aware of what we waste and how much of what we normally buy, whilst cheap, doesn't get used very much before it's finished with. I will try not to return to that.

I'm spending in my local coffee shop to get my takeaway coffee but I have no plans to spend any further. I can afford it but I don't actually need anything. Holiday was cancelled. I've no occasions to go.

I think a lot of people are prioritising their local businesses over Debenhams and so on because they genuinely care more about local business survival.

The British high street was in terminal decline long before this.

Ultimately we need to be less reliant on shopping and the service economy. If the U.K. started to make more high value stuff to export, that would be smarter in the longer term.

I can't afford to, honestly.

My income pretty much halved. I'm just buying the necessities. Haven't even had a takeaway during all this. Couldn't justify the expense.

While I feel sorry for small independent retailers, family-owed restaurants and the like, it's not my problem or responsibility to make sure they stay afloat.

The British high street was in terminal decline long before this.

Yep

Ultimately we need to be less reliant on shopping and the service economy. If the U.K. started to make more high value stuff to export, that would be smarter in the longer term.

Completely agree, much more sustainable.

We've been saving over lockdown and have been intentionally spending or giving away (charity donations) the extra money. We're trying to direct the spending towards small indy businesses. We're lucky to be reasonably financially secure (not affluent but able to meet our needs) in the short to medium term so feel we should try & do our bit to support others. I know this is going to sound preachy too but if you've got spare £££s please consider setting up a direct debit to support something like Doctors Without Borders. Covid & the resulting economic pain is going to be devastating for the developing world.

@Pumpertrumper

If you take a step back and look at the bigger picture you realise it’s all one large vicious circle really. Yes everyone seems to prefer supporting ‘local’ businesses to large multinats but those awful multinats are huge employers. So it’s great that you’re supporting your local baker, butcher...candlestick maker but then you forfeit the right to tut and complain at the news when another multinat chain collapses and X thousand U.K. jobs are lost. ‘Local’ businesses tend to be run by the people who own them and staffing costs kept to an absolute minimum. Women should also consider that multinats are the biggest source of ‘odd hours’ jobs. Evenings, nights, weekends...etc let’s face it an awful lot of young families (or those with caring responsibilities) rely on jobs outside the usual 9-5 mon-fri.

I think everyone has the right to save their money, I 100% support that but you don’t have the right to boycott large companies then whinge when they inevitably shut down!

There also needs to be recognition that most people with reliable employment were struggling to get by before CV happened. So raising taxes will force many into poverty/further into poverty. My DH is a ‘high earner’ but due to the area we live (job is dependant in this) we wouldn’t be able to pay our mortgage/utilities if taxes were raised. We’d get much more financial help on UC (I’ve done the calculations and we’d have no other choice really if taxes do increase significantly)

So even though your dh is a high earner you'd rather go on universal credit than pay higher taxes???

Bloody hell.