Would you go abroad by plane over the summer?

[Sundiamond]

Assuming that the government will do yet another U-turn over travel quarantine on return to the UK, would you get a flight to say, Portugal for a holiday over the summer? I'm just curious how many would etc.

I've had Covid, lost an immediate family member, have family abroad, am juggling work and home schooling. I would love to see family and support each other after what we've been through but I don't think it's safe to do so yet and we couldn't take anymore illness/bereavement.

I understand that some people have compelling reasons to want to get away and will take the risk but the evidence is everywhere of the numbers of people who will abandon safe behaviour in order to get back to normality. To have spent months isolating and minimising risks only to put yourself in close proximity to people who don't see any need to stay alert and SD just seems crazy.

Hell no. Sitting in close proximity to total strangers for several hours has to be just about the worst thing anyone could do.

I'd happily drive, though of course that forces an overnight stay somewhere if I'm going any further than northern France/Germany/Benelux. I'd happily take the ferry, that's a reasonable option for northern Spain. Of course that may be more expensive.

I can’t get my head around the fact that I can’t send my children into school but could potentially take them abroad - it doesn’t make sense to me and makes me think the decision to allow travel is not really rooted in safety.

Well no, it's not is it? It's all about the economy and airlines and travel companies lobbying the government to throw them a lifeline. In all areas of life we're being urged to keep our distance from others and open windows to keep fresh air flowing in, but that's not possible on planes. So in order to travel on them we're basically being told to take a risk, to put on a mask and hope for the best. It's got nothing to do with our safety - it's about stopping businesses go bankrupt. So are you willing to let them risk YOUR health to protect THEIR bottom line?

No. I've always worried about germs while travelling and I'm very shaky about it now. That combined with environmental concerns I feel like it won't ever be an option.

No we moved our Greek holiday to 2021 last week which was a massive relief
I don't think it would have gone ahead anyway (3rd week of July) but u didn't want to risk it

I would travel to see family (I haven't seen my parents since October) but not leisure.

Yes I would

I don’t believe the research saying it is safe to fly. IMO sponsored by the airline industry.

My stepfather is a 79 year old ex-pilot and is confident about the air filtering on planes. He's less confident about sitting next to someone who might have Covid and sneeze/cough.

Can you imagine how you would feel if someone next to you started coughing, it's not like you can get away from them!

Most of us have actually been exposed to this virus, it’s been doing the rounds in the uk since November. Pretty much everyone I know and have Spoken to over the last few months have all shared the same symptoms which then weren’t COVID, but now are recognised as symptoms

With the uk govt lack of knowledge, the inertia, the herd immunity path, the u turn our government has zero idea of what’s going on.

Nevertheless They’ve scared the population witless and turned ordinarily rational people into gibbering wrecks.

This has to stop!

This was an I know virus which led to China closing down a city. It had to be taken seriously.

They now know more about it and are working on cures, medicine, vaccines etc

Remember how it started rather than look back with fresh eyes

Not this year no.

If Covid keeps appearing for years (say 2-3) what would you do if you genuinely believe we are told crap on a daily basis and actually it is a lot worst but scientific community are simply too far behind the discovery and knowledge curve?

Would you think more about flying then or still prepared to hold off new normal life for say 2-3 further years??

Just hypothetically as obviously no one knows actually that much about this disease despite the mixed messages sprouted out daily worldwide!

Yes.
We have a holiday booked in August to Portugal and I can't wait.
We are all very long risk so I'm not worried

I Would go as long as I'm not forced to wear mask

Yes.

No because my DP just cancelled all his leave as he’d been brought back of furlough. I don’t think I’d enjoy it like I normally would with all the restrictions

Most of us have actually been exposed to this virus, it’s been doing the rounds in the uk since November

I completely agree mz I had covid I am one hundred per cent sure, my GP was convinced (I could not have a test at the time because they were not available unless you were in the NHS) Now I have taken the antibody test and it is negative. All of our friends that tested positive for CoVid in the NHS with a swab test, are now being tested for antibodies, and a very large majority of them are coming back negative as well, even though the tests are 99.9% accurate. So why is this happening well it is one of two reasons

1. Either there was not enough exposure at the time (viral load) to create enough antibodies, this is extremely hard to imagine as many of these people worked with covid patients day in and day out.

2. The antibodies simply do not last very long - this is the most likely reason, and this is the reason why the antibody testing is being quietly dropped along with herd immunity. The whole country could be infected by now, right, but how helpful is it if the antibodies only last for a short period of time and people are then reinfected with the next wave, and the one after that.

So be mindful of the facts when you share sweeping statements about mass hysteria and brain washing and it is stopping people from resuming normal life. It may be that some people are simply better informed than you or are seeing things from a different angle.

Pigeon999 that's very interesting. I'm very unsure about the antibody tests. However I know a number of people who think they've had it (including a couple who have been in hospital). Those who think they've had it since late Feb have all tested positive after antibody tests. Those who thought they had over Xmas or in Jan/Early Feb haven't.

I don’t believe the research saying it is safe to fly. IMO sponsored by the airline industry.

....and a lot of it isn't - let Google be your friend and you will be able to find a substantial amount of research from outside the industry

For example a random paper here, plenty more available:

jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/195131

I suspect there might also be some misunderstandings about the idea of being in "recycled air". An airliner is not sealed airtight in such a way that you breath the same "bubble" of air as it goes around and around perhaps for hours on end ...

A percentage of the air leaving the cabin is recycled (that air goes through HEPA filters prior to being sent around the cabin for another lap), but not all of it, a large amount is simply dumped through control valves to the outside world and it is replaced by fresh air taken in from the outside environment. The percentage of recycled to fresh varies but it's reckoned on an average airliner you'll get maybe 10 or more complete changes of cabin air per hour ,probably better than you'll manage at home/in the supermarket.

No way. Sitting in a crowded plane just to go somewhere stifling hot where pools will be closed, and beaches regulated.
UK it is for me, much more relaxing.

stella I wish they would publish more information on the immunity of positive covid patients that are now testing negative for antibodies, we need much more data.
Assuming this is true from what I read, then we have a (much) bigger problem than before, because everything is now hanging on the vaccine working - it is literally our last line of defence.

I am sure it is being buried for the sake of the public confidence, and progress is being made on the vaccine - which should be ready at the earliest in October (Times today)

The idea that we can safely travel thousands of miles sitting next to potentially infected people in an enclosed space for hours and hours, is really unfathomable. Those that are understandably desperate to get away are doing so by disregarding the significant risk, the risk is still there of course. Flying now feels to me a little like a casino, the safety of it will be based on pure luck.

Out of interest, how would a vaccine work if having it doesn’t give you any form of immunity?

I would/I will.

I’m not particularly at risk, so I may think differently if I had a health condition or someone in my immediate family did.

There is a risk from flying but it’s possibly not as high/not for the reasons that a lot of people think. Research suggests that if an infected person is on a plane, it’s really the people immediately near them at risk and those who touch the same surfaces (which can obviously be mitigated somewhat by cleaning hands regularly/using gel, not touching your face).

Yes, planes use recycled air but it is filtered.

www.bbc.com/news/business-52822913

And the risk of contracting Covid once you get to another country may well be about the same or in fact a lot lower than getting it at home. I’m not sure I’d go to somewhere like the US to be honest, but somewhere like Germany, or Portugal? Yes.

And to all the people saying that restarting air travel is putting finance ahead of health, do you think the same about opening cafes, restaurants, pubs, museums, cinemas etc? There’s got to be a balance between keeping the economy going and limiting transmission surely? Otherwise we’d expect to just shut everything down until the disease is eradicated in this country. Also you need to consider the impact of a downturn in the economy on public health - a recession could have a real long term impact on the health of the population. It’s not quite as simple as some PPs seem to think.

driving and there lies the problem with the vaccine, and probably why 18 years were wasted trying to find one for SARS.