Non-payment of fees

[stressedandpregnant]

NC for this as it's probably outing. DH is owed three months' worth of tuition fees for private instrumental lessons by parents of a child he taught. They have always been rubbish at paying on time and I'm cross with him that he didn't charge them in advance (which is standard practice anyway) but he was too nice to refuse to stop teaching the child until they'd paid. Child stopped lessons in January and now parents are refusing to pay.

Their reason is that child was learning a piece for his GCSE exam that turned out not to be suitable. DH sent the piece to the school teacher in Nov and got no feedback that it wasn't suitable until the end of Jan. Parents are now saying that it was DH's fault child had to learn new piece and it was stressful for them. It is definitely not the instrumental teacher's responsibility to check what's being submitted - GCSE stuff is entirely the school's responsibility (they're the ones who know what the exam board wants) and it's their mistake. In any case, child had four months of tuition (and three years previously) which has helped them to get better at the instrument.

If they don't pay we're going to have to get the union involved and then probably small claims court - we cannot afford to lose this money and I'm amazed they're trying to not pay it. They never complained once before - it's a bit like eating at a restaurant, leaving without paying, then four months later saying that they weren't happy with the meal! I'm due to have a baby any day now and the stress over this hanging over us is keeping me awake at night. I lost a family member last week too and we just really don't need this.

DH had to send an 'official' letter giving them one last chance to pay, and their response was the first time we'd heard that they weren't happy and were refusing - they've basically said 'if you want to send us to the lawyers then bring it on'. I'm considering writing to them separately in a less formal way to appeal to their better nature and ask them to please reconsider before it gets to that because it's just not fair to not pay him! WIBU to do this or should I just leave it to the union legal dept? I tend to always see the best in people and some of me thinks that they must be nice people really and surely nobody could be this unreasonable?!

I’m a lawyer so I’m not generally adverse to legal action, but in these circumstances maybe your husband could write that letter?

It sounds that this family believes, albeit wrongly, that your DH has not done what he was paid to do. I’ve been in situations in the past where I have felt a supplier of goods and services have done me wrong, as they dig in so have I.

However I’d be mortified if I received a letter pointing out the detrimental affect my actions were having on a young family and that’d make me far more likely to back down (regardless of whether I felt I was really in the right) than the threat of legal action.

So in these circumstances I’d probably go for it. You’ve got nothing to lose and if they don’t respond then go straight to small claims.

OP - its not nice and is stressful, but what you have to accept is that with self employment, chasing invoices and dealing with the occasional & thankfully rare ‘bad egg’ is part and parcel of self employment! If your DH worked for a firm, this would probably happen too - but it would be a lovely person in accounts having to chase the payment. Please stop personalising it immediately, stop blaming and getting pissed at your DH (just vow to change practise moving forward, without exception). Chase the debt in a cost effective, cheap way (because it is a small debt in the grand scheme) and take the matter to the best conclusion that you can. Go to bed at night and allow yourself to rest over this matter, safe in the knowledge that your DH is doing all he can.
At the end of the day, in the world of self employment, this shit happens and it happens a lot. Some cheeky fuckers will spout any shit they can think of to avoid payment, end of.

I've just come on here as a counterpoint to all those asking if he had a contract, and suggesting if not then he cannot claim.

This is nonsense. He had a contract - whether written down or not is irrelevant. All he has to do is prove how much the agreed fee was, and how many lessons they owe for.

I know OP has said that there may in fact be a written contract. That will help - even if the parents haven't signed it. If it was sent out at the start then they are deemed to have accepted the terms and conditions by arranging the lessons.

Civil claim - small claims track - is the way to go here.

If you have the facility to get a free solicitor's letter, go for it. I suspect your union's solicitor has heard all the excuses and will be able to set out why their argument won't get them anywhere.

...for those suggesting Small Claims (and I’m a huge fan and user of it!) I think the OP needs to check the fee before pursuing v the 250 debt owed. You can check the fee online before submitting (which is quite easy).. Small Claim tends to jolt people into action because it will show up on any future credit checks (for a mortgage etc).

My own success with small claims - I tend to send a blunt 5 liner titled “Final Notification to pursue Small Claim” Pay in 5 days etc which tends to produce a response. In tandem, I kick off the small claim form by prefilling and saving but I only submit if they don’t pay in 5 days. I run my own small business.

Letter before action with a defined timescale for payment, then small claims.

You're right to be annoyed with him for not taking payment upfront. Letting the kid carry on for three months without payment is ridiculous, and while their behaviour is awful he has been very naive here.

This is what you should do;

    Stop being angry with DH.

This is what your DH should do:

     Free letter from the union. 

     Find the “contract” . It will help. But is not essential. 

     Then small claims court. It is cheap and easy for a debt of £250. 

     But don’t agonise over it. It’s annoying and a worry. But some bad debt is a cost of self employment. 

     Always take half a term upfront in future.

I understand your worry OP
I too grew up in a financially struggling home but DH and I are now solid earners.
However, I’m now off on Mat leave with tiny DS and due to covid DH (high earner and bread winner) who was supposed to transition seamlessly from one stage of training to another (specialist Dr) can’t. He’s now facing being jobless for at least 6 months with no stable income.

Did I mention we moved house and took on a larger mortgage at the start of the year?

Honestly it’s a mess. I think you might need to accept that most of the country are facing financial insecurity and loss of income right now. It sucks but I imagine a lot of self employed people will be facing invoices not being paid. My parents lost their business in 2008 for exactly the same reasons

Tell him to remind them that statutory interest if 8% applies from date payment should have been made - he needs to add that and tell them that they will probably also be responsible for court fees if he issues proceedings and wins

It is definitely not the instrumental teacher's responsibility to check what's being submitted - GCSE stuff is entirely the school's responsibility (they're the ones who know what the exam board wants) and it's their mistake

I'm sorry but there is something here called professionalism. If you are taking on students and supporting their GCSE work then you absolutely have a responsibility to be reading up on the specifications and understanding what is and isn't suitable for exams. The specifications are all freely available one exam board websites. You don't email busy teachers yourself, you ask the parent to get confirmation from the school that your interpretation of the spec is A so you will do A piece of music and leave it at that. I am a teacher and I also tutor - and tutoring involves working in my subject area with different specifications because different schools use different exam boards. It is basic professionalism to have an eye on what you're supposed to be delivering.

That said, I don't tutor a second lesson if the first one hasn't been paid. If you have some evidence of contract, small claims court is your best bet.

The lawyer poster up thread did suggest a more appealing toned letter outlining the personal and financial impact etc - and I too just wonder if this might be worth trying as a step before small claims? small claims is good but a blunt instrument. I also think maybe it’s worth in this letter acknowledging mis-communication between various parties over the taught pieces (that kind of thing happens all the time btw - with schools often being at fault) however the agreed teaching / tuition services were provided in full and this constitutes no grounds to withhold payment! Just a thought?

Actually I think it's your dh's responsibility to ensure that the piece was correct. I'm not surprised the parents are annoyed. When he didn't hear back from the school he shouldn't of assumed all was ok he should have chased but also corresponded with the parents to pass the responsibility for checking onto them.

Actually I think it's your dh's responsibility to ensure that the piece was correct.

No, it wasn't. It would be his responsibility if it was a grade exam, but this wasn't. If it was anyone's responsibility, it was the parents'.

Well if the only reason that the piece was unsuitable was that it was different enough from the ensemble piece, the school teacher and the child are the only people who would have known that. I don't remember that being an issue when my children did their music GCSE, but they both did it under the old system.

The child (or parents on his behalf) should have been checking that their school teacher was happy with the piece that had been picked and that was being practised

He did actually check exam board requirements himself too when the teacher didn't reply and couldn't see how it wouldn't be counted, and neither could I (and between us we have entered a lot of kids for GCSEs as we've both done classroom teaching, so it's not like we don't know what we're talking about). I just don't see how it's grounds for not paying for so many lessons! His services were employed as an instrumental teacher, which is what he did, not specifically for the learning of the GCSE piece.

It's reassuring to know I'm not the only one who thinks the parents are CFs.

but you have left yourself (or you husband has left himself) open to blame by not getting the parents to take responsibility for the piece of music being practise. I'm sorry, but it's a massive professionalism issue if you go for months doing something unsuitable.

The lesson is that you need to clarify always what it is the parents are expecting of you. If they want GCSE practise then you need to put that in writing and what you need for them to be able to do deliver that GCSE practise - in this case, they needed to check with the teacher that he/she was happy with the piece being practised.

Otherwise, just delivering genric 'music' lessons when GCSE was approaching is just not cutting it, is it? They are paying customers who expect a service. If there is mis communication or mis understanding, the onus really was on you to prove to them that they are wrong and that you have been doing what you said you would.

They should pay for your time and I suspect you will win outright in small claims but really think carefully about how you are managing your business as an unhappy parent could cause you a lot of problems.

If he’s in the MU, he should contact them in the first instance. Do this ASAP... as an aside I believe he can claim a paternity grant from the MU also. Thought that might be helpful!

Just go on line and fill out the paperwork for a small claims court action including both vista and interest on there, print it out and send it with a 7 day letter before action telling them if the money isn't in your account, details enclosed, by day 7 you will push the button to submit the claim. They're just trying it on and your husband shouldn't put up with it. CFs Dint give it anymore headspace. You owe them nothing.

Vista ? Costs !!

@Lostmyshityear9 They're not generic music lessons, or extra tuition for the exams, they're instrumental lessons which is a different thing. Obviously if they were geared towards GCSE it would be different but that was never the agreement - they were simply for learning the instrument, which has been fulfilled as the student learnt a lot during that time (and the previous three years). Many GCSE students don't even take their GCSE pieces to their instrumental teachers, they just choose something with the class teacher.

And it was clear that this was the agreement - they're just trying to wriggle out of it!

My dh has taught singing for years but since he stopped classroom teaching he has diddly squat knowledge of the GCSE exam board requirements. Not his job. Even our own children he advised what was suitable for their stage of development but not on what fulfilled exam requirements.

OP, don't get involved. These letters have to be worded in a specific way for legal reasons and you could jeapordise things. Let the MU advise. My friend has used their services several times to collect unpaid fees and they know what they are doing.

but the point is, he did take his GCSE piece to his instrument teacher and that teacher agreed to work on it with him, at the same time as taking on the responsibility of checking with the teacher that the piece they had chosen was OK. You are wide open to it all being your fault.

I am sorry to have a go - I have worked many years as a tutor and seen it all and so my terms and conditions are tight and I do my best to be clear on what I can and can't deliver (miracles!). I always, always turn it to the parents to be responsible and make it clear what I am doing and taking responsibility for. There is no way on earth I would have agreed to contact the school teacher - that would absolutely need to be on the parent/child's head every single time. I always agree to have my details passed on, however, and if there is any contact with a teacher, I always copy parents into a response and/or clarify in writing what has been agreed afterwards.

If it has been a while since you worked in school, you could probably do to speak to someone currently in school about the demands of the new specifications so you are clear moving forwards what the pieces need to look like. I am very clear what other specifications than the one I work in school with demand and if I don't know, there are professional groups on Facebook that can clarify any points I need. As a parent, I don't want to pay my hard earned money out on tutoring with a tutor who is not clear what is required of the exams.

I agree that they are absolutely cheeky fuckers trying to get away with it and I suspect you wouldn't have much of a problem in small claims but do re-think how you work in the future so this doesn't happen again. The easiest thing to do is a conversation at the start - discount a small amount for 10 lessons paid up front and pencilled into the diary, no cancellations unless with 24 hours or more notice, and if no up front payments, no next lesson until the previous one is paid. It is very clear and at most, will only ever leave you with one unpaid lesson.

They are absolutely awful people and definitely small claims, don't let them get away with it! £250 is a lot. To state the obvious, payment up front in future, we have to pay a term in advance for my son's trombone lessons and I imagine they would stop immediately if I didn't pay and hadn't contacted them about the reason why.
I would be brooding about it too, more because I would be fuming that they were such CFs. Thank goodness you have the backing of your union. Please update if/when you get the money out of them and good luck!

You need help from the MU or ISM. Is he a member of either? They’re pretty good with these situations.