AIBU to ask what you think about the protests?

[Raspberryberret]

Genuinely interested in opinions. For those who are vehemently against schools re-opening because of the risk of coronavirus, what is your view on the BLM protests and the risks of infection across the country due to these mass gatherings?

@mbosnz

And peaceful protesters are still getting beaten up by police. It's a fairly charged situation, I imagine, trying to figure out whether you play by the pacifist hymn book (on either side), or whether you think 'fuck this shit' and go in all guns blazing.

That may be the case in the US, but it most certainly is not the case in the U.K. No British copper would dare to lay a finger on a black person who was protesting peacefully because they know that if it was caught on camera, their career would be over, and rightly so.

Any message they were trying to get across has been completely overshadowed now

Unfortunately so. How is attempting to burn the flag at the cenotaph really helping to progress the cause? Also confused why the police just stood and watched him. I know that it is a tiny tiny minority, but you just know what will dominate.

I also don’t understand exactly what the protesters are hoping to achieve. There doesn’t seem to be a clear message as to what specifically they want to happen.

I abhor racism but is it about the treatment of BAME by police, is it about the media or is it about pulling down statues?

There have been no riots here.
Some scuffling with police which I completely condemn but they are a tiny minority òf the people attending.
There were thousands at the protest I attended and no violence at all it was very peaceful and respectful.
I didnt see any police there at all in fact.
Not protesting so racists dont use it as an excuse to be more racist is not a good reason not to protest.
Racists need to know that their views and outlooks are outdated, irrelevant and will be drowned out, thats why i added my voice.

I support the protests because I think what has happened in the states is horrifying and I know that the UK is guilty too. I know that this has been centuries in the making and that I'm extremely privileged that racism isn't something that personally affects (or is targeted at) me every single day.

I'm also very pro-lockdown and concerned about any and all mass gatherings- people will die as a result of mass gatherings; even if the heart of the gathering is in the right place.

I do not know how to address this cognitive dissonance. I know that I personally would not attend but can also understand why people would protest something that has affected their WHOLE lives, particularly if they see the pandemic as a passing phase- HOWEVER some people who attend will experience serious illness and deaths in their family from Covid as a result (and sadly the protests will also increase the rate of infection).

If my family were nurses/doctors working in Covid wards I would be more against the protests; if I was personally targeted by racism daily then I would support them even more- if both were the case then I don't know.

Ds went to the protest in our City yesterday, he wore gloves & mask, put all his clothes in the wash & showered as soon as he came home. He said it was very peaceful, lots of people there & only 4 police observing but did not interfere. The only thing I think is that the whole George Floyd event & the protests has totally overtaken Covid on the news, playing straight in to Boris Johnson's hands to deflect attention away from everything to do with Dominic Cummings & how far popularity towards the Tories has fallen.

Plenty of people don't dispute the reason for the protests but plenty dispute the timing. BLM have chosen to protest at a critical time for the UK. Not once but again and again. The consequences could be dreadful for family's up and down the country and the NHS could be overwhelmed with a 2nd wave. I really hope not.
I feel very sad, that the nation as a whole, it's different communities, the elderly and the vulnerable DON'T matter.
And Yes the people crowding onto the beaches and beauty spots are selfish too.
Society is all about me Me, Me, Me, Me, I want, I need, I must have, SOD everyone else.

Peaceful protests = fine.
Violence and throwing bricks at police and horses = inexcusable.

I agree with midsomar. Also think the timing was despicable for an organised protest.

What do these protests change?

There have been people protesting about racism throughout my life and nothing has changed!

Yes, let's all mark our diaries with dates when we can protest. In the meantime, let my husband be stopped by police for driving a car "that couldn't possible be his", let my drunk white neighbour fall off her face bleeding to death and yet refuse help from my teen son because "don't touch me you n word", let my daughter be call poo in the playground...yes, let's wait. It can bloody wait.

I know that some are more angry that there are people who have dared to go out and protest in large crowds while the world is trying to deal with a deadly disease that thrives in large crowds.

Perhaps, take a moment to think how much one can get to a stage where their life, can seemingly feel so little and unimportant either way that surrendering to Covid feels a less risk.

Also confused why the police just stood and watched him

Because they must be absolutely terrified of doing their job. I've seen numerous videos online of police detaining people, trying to be made out to be racist attacks, when they're just doing their job. It's awful that they are having to think about the fact that every second they're terrified they may lose their job and become the victim of some horrible, horrible abuse.

Peapod29 you make good points. I am white and am very aware of social disadvantage in general and in particular around race and disability having worked in social policy / the third sector for years. I also realise that I am still mostly unaware of my white privilege on a day to day basis. I also have an undisputed working class regional accent which I get judged on the minute I open my mouth when outside my home region, and have been mocked about on many occasions, so I do understand a bit how it is to be judged negatively on things beyond your control...)

I was sickened by the George Floyd incident. Regardless of his criminal past, the police grossly over reacted in their behaviour and judging from the footage I saw, officer Chauvin did appear to be not simply restraining him but actually enjoying inflicting massive pain, while his colleagues looked on nonchalantly. They are a disgrace to policing and the impact of their actions not just on George Floyd but on society is devastating.
I hear and see many racist and xenophobic comments on social media from people who really should know and do better given their own education and relatively privileged personal situations. Racism is definitely alive and well in the UK and we have plenty of examples of racist policing too. So there are issues to protest, no doubt. BUT, now is such a dangerous time for mass gatherings given the pandemic. I voiced concern about the protest to friends and was told this cannot wait and is different to going to the beach, the Cheltenham festival or the VE day parties (which incidentally I also voiced concern to friends about given the virus). It seems if you criticise the timing and scale of the protests you are simply showing white privilege and being racist even if you have criticised other mass gatherings during lockdown in the same way.
This feels ridiculous. Mass gatherings for whatever reason risk increasing transmission and deaths, keeping the R up which means lockdown for longer for all of us and nonend to shielding for the most vulnerable. I am allowed to have an opinion on the protests despite being white and therefore privileged and it is not racist or erasing of the issues facing black people to do so because the pandemic affects me too.

I would love to see my elderly and isolated family members. Their mental health matters and given their advancing age they can't necessarily wait but I don't, because it's not allowed and if we all did as we want the R would never decrease.

I truly feel for all those who have been bereaved in this pandemic and yet unable to gather with loved ones for funerals or comfort yet mass protests go ahead with no issue. It's totally hypocritical.

I don’t agree with them and I think anyone attending a protest is selfishly putting everyone else at risk. If there’s a second spike they’ll be to blame.

I think that considering the thousands all crammed in together, we should scrap social distancing now. Get the schools back. It’s laughable that they aren’t after seeing those crowds and nothing being done about it. If there isn’t a second wave then that’s the cue for normality to resume, surely.

@heartsonacake

I don’t agree with them and I think anyone attending a protest is selfishly putting everyone else at risk. If there’s a second spike they’ll be to blame.

They won’t get the blame though. Boris will. It’s the Mumsnet way.

Pointless as far as changing anything for the better.
Convenient for the govt. Will be able to blame the mass gatherings when the infection rate goes up again.

@slartibarti

Pointless as far as changing anything for the better. Convenient for the govt. Will be able to blame the mass gatherings when the infection rate goes up again.

Are you saying the protests, where there are thousands crammed in together, won’t be to blame? Wow. Deluded comes to mind.

I don't support the mass gathering of thosands of people in a country where we have one of the highest death tolls of covid in the world. America may have a higher toll in raw numbers but there are large parts of the country less impacted. Seeing 15 thousand people in Manchester where our r value locally is already creeping above 1 is really distressing. It's like the sacrifices of people who couldn't attend the funerals of loved ones or be at their bedsides were for nothing, because of something really important comes up, we'll gather anyway. If I was my friend who buried her mother without her husband or daughter present, I'd be so bitter. And that doesn't mean I don't also condemn the idiots at Durdle Dor and on the beaches and at VE day doing the conga. And it doesn't mean that I don't think we have a problem with racism in this country. Not agreeing completely with a methodology doesn't mean I automatically have to reject the whole premise.

Are you saying the protests, where there are thousands crammed in together, won’t be to blame? Wow. Deluded comes to mind.

No I'm not saying that.
I said the govt would be able to blame the protests. IMO they'd be right. Although some may argue that the R number started to go up just before the protests so it would have happened anyway.

The thing that annoys me about the 'you can't blame protestors when there is anything spkke because people were on the beach last week' argument is that NO ONE, that I've seen anyway, has agreed with people sitting on a crowded beach. It has been condemned along with all other breaches of lockdown by everyone I know and it's been on the news regularly. My local, rural town, was on Sky News just the other day because people were coming from all over the place. Look at how many threads alone there have been on MN about various lockdown breaches and how furious everyone has been with neighbours etc... Over the last few months. People haven't just sat by and not said anything about the other breaches of lockdown that have occurred and are only now saying it because it's BLM.

I am not comparing the two in the sense that one is obviously a very important issue however, the reality is, protests likely will have an affect on terms of CV. Deflecting that because people sat on a beach and pretending people weren't also outraged at that as well, doesn't change the fact.

BOTH are irresponsible for the same reason which is CV. It doesn't mean I think both are the same or comparable in every sense.

Another spike**

It annoys me the way some causes become the latest ‘thing’ and others get ignored. Domestic violence has soared since lockdown - where is the anger for those victims? Surely all lives matter.