Which neighbour is right here?

[BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz]

Two neighbours live in a pair of flats (like a converted house). Two flats only. Two neighbours only. I'll call them Up and Down.

Up has access to a private yard to the right of the property. Down has access to a separate private yard to the left of the property.

Down has windows which overlook both their own and Ups yard. Ups windows overlook both as well but from above.

Up has repainted their yard, it was white along outer walls previously which have been repainted white, but in addition, Up has painted the walls which belong to Down. So outer walls of Downs property, meaning all walls facing into their yard are now white.

Up thinks this is reasonable as Down cannot see these walls, cannot access them without permission of Up, and the paint is an improvement.

Down thinks this is unreasonable as the walls do not belong to Up and to do so was not on, and that Up should pay to have the walls stripped of paint.

So....who is right in this situation?
YABU - Down is correct, paint should be removed
YANBU - Up is correct, paint should stay

Hang on, so going off the legal info posted. If the 'leaseholder' wants to undertake changes to the building they still legally need to consult the other flat occupiers? So potentially they can't just go painting walls, drilling holes, hanging gates willy nilly?. They'd still have to gain consent to undertake a change?

@Lalala205 Both the leaseholder and freeholder have legal obligations to each other as set out in the lease.

Tbh it's the potential future problems that would stick for me. Neighbour and I share unpainted garden party wall. However other side semi detached neighbour and I don't share their extension wall, but it borders my garden iyswim. I asked if I could paint it as both rendered houses are painted cream, but extension is not. They said yes, no issue! I then had second thoughts as if they then developed damp issues they may try to state it was due to me painting their property and being liable for the cost of repair? I've left it as was because its not worth the problems that could arise. The moral of the story is don't mess with the neighbours property as it may look 'legally right', but if it all goes tits up you're looking at fees for small claims or above 😕

Up is wrong

Ohhh so up has essentially painted the outside of downs house which is the boundary of their garden.

I dont see downs issue, they can't see the paint.

Obviously technically you shouldn't paint a wall that's not yours, however they're both being absolute fucking twats about it. Get a fucking grip, who gives a fuck! Down, who is in the right legally and technically (so I voted yabu) is being particularly twatty. It's a fucking wall they'll never see. What a complete wankstain. Tell up to lie to down that the paint has been stripped, everybody's happy.

Downs right. He/she did not want their property painted. Up needs to sort out their mistake.

The us neighbour shouldn’t be painting other people’s properties without asking.

Am i the only one that thinks a brick house painted white, BUT ONLY TO THE HIGHT OF THE FENCE (so still brick above it) is going to look horrifically ugly?? Did they do it themselves? is the top line wobbly???

As per the photo. If that's the 'yard' UP uses and DOWN cannot see And UP has done a good job of it (as in the photo) then DOWN needs to be told they're being an utter twat!

Though it looks nice as it was (if it's like yours anyway) so it was possibly a daft move of UP's.

DOWN needs to stop being so pathetic.

Disclaimer - if it looks like it's been painted by a toddler then UP needs to pay to have it removed.

Are you UP or DOWN in your house?

Up painted the side of Down's actual house? U is being massively U to have done it without asking. They should've asked permission because it could affect the value of Down's property. If I were Down, I'd have said no.

Unless DOWN agrees to stop being a twat (assuming as I said before that it's painted nicely -and with the correct paint) they're going to have to get the lease looked at by a solicitor to determine who is in the right legally.

AmelieTaylor Why is Down being a twat about it? OP said they have windows on that side that overlook Up's yard, so not only has the exterior of their flat been painted without permission but they can see it too. I'd be grumpy if someone did that without my permission.

OP, you didn’t really explain the key point in your OP, which is that Up have painted Down’s house wall.

Which they definitely should not have done without permission.

You don't paint anything which doesn't belong to you. Done. Remove it else you could have a massive problem going forward as legally totally in the wrong.

Both are being unreasonable here.

If Down has painted Up's house wall already then they are being hypocritical. But Up should have asked before painting Downs house wall.

On another note, who the fuck paints walls? It looks terrible over redbrick!!!

@ScottishStottie

No, youre not!!!

They should paint their own sides however they want, just like you would do to a garden fence.

And to those who said you can't paint a fence if you don't own it - rubbish. Yes I'd paint my side the fence regardless of who owns it. I'd also give them the attractive side if I owned a fence and accept that they'd paint their side of the fence too. I thought that was normal.

@Qgardens it's not a boundary wall we are talking about here it's the actual house. Someone else's house.

Nope, still stands. The up people won't be able to see it unless they are literally hanging out of the window then. Still not a problem to paint it.

If I had a bare brick house and someone painted it up up to wall level I would be very annoyed. I don't think it's petty at all. Especially if it was similar to the gorgeous brick in your picture.

Surely if up holds the lease the down they're able to paint it?

@Longwhiskers14

AmelieTaylor Why is Down being a twat about it? OP said they have windows on that side that overlook Up's yard, so not only has the exterior of their flat been painted without permission but they can see it too. I'd be grumpy if someone did that without my permission.

Up thinks this is reasonable as Down cannot see these walls, cannot access them without permission of Up, and the paint is an improvement

DIWN cannot see or access these walls.

I'm not convinced they are DOWNS walls either. No one can be unless you see the lease agreements.

It depends what it actually says on the leasehold. Normally with flats the external walls belong to the freeholder not to the leaseholders, so Up and Down are probably both in the wrong.

Honestly, I can't see why everything is so outraged by this. The only issue, from my perspective, would be if painting the wall has some kind o negative impact on the quality of the wall or puts it at risk. But surely a bit of paint makes no difference?

As far as I'm concerned, it is exactly the same as the fencing situation - our fence is brown on our side and our neighbour painted his side green. I couldn't care less. As its our fence, I WOULD be annoyed if he started hammering in nails and weakening the panels but a bit of paint?