...to think there's more to this re 17 mo with skills loss?

[Worriedcoronamum]

Posted in behaviour yesterday and had some v kind support and put it from my mind. Woken up this morning feeling worried again, discussed with a dr friend who can't, ethically, advise me on my own children but advised to speak to GP which - amazingly - I managed to do this morning on the phone.

I am worried because our previously v babbly, smiley 17mo girl with 6 or 7 words has lost some, no longer responds to name, won't wave or say hi or bye and is making much less eye contact.

I know from here and friends about regressions like this being a red flag for asd but also know it's hard to judge and it could well be the impact of lockdown, loss of routine, missing nursery and fact that she's regrettably watching more TV - going to stop this as much as we possibly can.

GP was kind, said wait and see which I guess is best they can do now but also said can't diagnose asd before aged 5 which am sure is not right. I'm wondering if am being unreasonable worrying about a child changing during a time when it's difficult for everyone, and that it's anxiety making me question the GP's advice or whether I should trust my instincts and have pushed for a referral..

Feel so unsure of myself and like I'm letting her down. I don't imagine a referral opens any magic door to support or advice but it might help identify some things we could do to help her if she needs it.

Has anyone else seen changes like this during the lockdown?

OP my daughter had a regression too. Over the course of a few days she lost all of her previously held skills and could no longer wave, talk, smile or clap. I took her to GP who checked her ears and temperature etc because her loss of skills was accompanied by a whining noise. She advised that I return the following week if I was still worried. I did just days later and GP referred to a paediatrician because she acknowledged that the child she had seen just two weeks previously who waved bye bye and clapped and smiled was not the child she was now seeing.
Paediatrician tested for chromosome abnormalities and metabolic disorders and at seventeen months referred her for a multi disciplinary assessment for autism. She got her diagnosis just a week after her second birthday. It would be a full year since she lost her skills before she made another sound.
Dd is seventeen now still autistic and at a specialist school but she is bright and kind and funny and a joy to be around. Yes there have been hard times but we got there.
Return to your GP and ask for a referral to a paediatrician, your dd needs blood and urine tests at the very least.

Not too sure. I've heard when they're really concentrating on learning something new, other things can go to the way side? Has there been something new she has been trying to do?

Mines ignore me half the time now. Shes similar age and just exercising her new found right to ignore me.

Fingers crossed that the HV can signpost you somewhere.

Ime regression is easier to spot in hindsight as it tends to occur in early stages of development. I found it useful to consider speech sounds rather than whole words. DS2's (ASD) first word (at around 11 months) was 'dog' but he lost the ability to say 'd' or 'g'. He stoped speaking altogether then and we communicated using baby sign for some years. He began speaking again but was referred to SALT at three as speech sounds made him difficult to understand. He was still receiving speech therapy to say 'g' 6 years later.

He also had his hearing checked (no problem) as this is the first step when a child does not respond - eg to their name.

Try not to worry - these things took an age prior to CV. In the meantime I would recommend easy signing with reward to promote shared attention. Eg using the 'more' sign when feeding between each mouthful.

What sort of time scale has this been happening over OP? Have there been any other red flags for you in terms of her general health / skills etc?

Well children can and do get diagnosed with autism before five,my son was diagnosed a three and a,half but has the GO not referred to the paediatrician?And yes definitely push for a,hearing test .

Hi thanks all for the advice - @hiredandsqueak that sounds terrifying, I am so pleased she's doing so well, you all sound like a fantastic parent, you all do.

There's no other red flags at all really and it's been happening for a few weeks we think -definitely a couple and probably more just really noticed it recently.

HV is sending me some activities to do with her. Says the fact she normally has good eye contact and laughs and smiles and interacts means we shouldn't think about asd which sounds a bit questionable to me. She did also say let's see how we go for a few weeks so will just stick to that and see if there's progress.

We did just have a really really lovely play - raspberries and lots of feet tickling and she was laughing and laughing. I don't think that's entirely inconsistent w asd though from limited training on this.

Yes your HV is wrong. My son has always shown some eye contact, usually when he wants something from us! But he does do eye contact and laughs and interacts and has a great sense of humour. Even as a young child he liked making us laugh. He is 12 now and still has these skills but is still autistic.

Your HV is wrong.You must bear in mind that HV's have no specialist knowledge of child development and in fact I attribute dd's early diagnosis to the fact I refused to have a HV and so didn't have to battle the ignorance as well. Dd has never had any noticeable difficulties with eye contact, she has and always has had a wicked sense of humour and laughs and smiles very easily once over the regression so your HV would have probably missed the autism in dd as well.
Keep a record of your concerns, later on you might need them for a paediatrician but if nothing else in a few weeks or months times if matters resolve you will be able to reassure yourself that your worries were unfounded.

Thanks for confirming what I thought. Just went to pick her up from park where she was w her dad and she turned to me when I shouted her name and ran over beaming. She also waved bye bye when he left to go start dinner albeit about a minute after he’s gone and we had been saying bye for ages :) first time I can rememebr her waving in weeks and weeks or turning to my voice! Christ knows if regressions can be stop start or she’s going through a phase or what but it was nice to see and going to do the exercises and generally hang out as much as possible - thanks so much for everything on this! X

Health professionals seem to want back/white, always or never for tick boxes but real life is very often different and more messy. The amount of times I heard 'but he does do this sometimes so let's just wait and see'.

The view is that it is normal for the social/the external to always be primary but for my DS, sometimes, and more often than for NT DC, the internal is primary. So you might think that really diagnosis of neurological conditions like ASD are irrelevant. Of course you should test for alternative conditions that can be treated but this is not the case for ASD.

It's never too young to promote mental well being.

I found good mental health starts with who you are. No one likes to be judged for things that feel alien to them. Einstein said something about judging a fish on its ability to climb a tree.

Hi op, I diagnose asd and whilst of course it could be this there are lots of other things at play here. Your most recent update is encouraging, though children with asd can be inconsistent dependent on the situation.

It could be due to the change in her routine, not seeing a range of people, feeling comfortable in her environment and therefore not feeling she needs to communicate that much to get her needs met.

You could try and 'tempt' her to communicate- for example can she make a choice between two things like apple and banana? If so try and encourage her to increase her need to interact. If she can't don't force as she might become overwhelmed.

Like others suggested I would get her hearing checked, stay calm, lots of opportunities to play with interesting things. Bubbles and anticipation toys are great for encouraging joint interaction. Blow a bubble look at her then say 'more' and accept any communication attempt- nod, eye contact, pointing etc.

Btw children can and are diagnosed with asd from age two, but in these cases it's usually very obvious.

Good luck and I hope your dc continues to make progress.

Totally agree with all of this - she loves bubbles and anticipation games actually - and that quote about Einstein so good too. Going to get out of her face and make things more focused on her being happy not tested by a maddo mum repeating her name 40 times! It’s interesting and heartening to me that she turned when she was out and pleased to see me and ran to me - means she knows who she is and I am in the way that matters and whatever happens she’s still there. Think that’s what has scared me - a sense of losing her or her changing beyond what I expected but that’s daft, she is who she is and I love her. Thanks all for being so so kind, mumsnet is the best

Hi any update please ?❤️ my dd going through the same