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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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To feel like parents aren't allowed to criticise teachers anymore?

562 replies

velaryon · 19/05/2020 19:32

I have the utmost respect for the teaching profession, especially the hard work and dedication of many teachers despite a pandemic and nationwide lockdown.
But at the same time, I've seen a lot of parents genuinely concerned about the teaching & communication at their DC's school who were immediately accused of 'teacher bashing' and being too lazy to teach their own children.
AIBU to think this is absolutely ridiculous?
I don't see anything wrong with questioning the level of teaching a school is providing, provided it's done in a sensitive and understanding way. IMO it's ridiculous how quickly someone is accused of teacher bashing for asking a legitimate question.

OP posts:
DamnYouAutoCarrot · 20/05/2020 11:10

@fripp where has anyone said on this thread that they have no raised it with the school? It's a gross generalisation to assume that parents have not contacted the school to address the perceived failures. 9 out of 10, where do you get your figures from? Would it be fair to say 9 out of 10 teachers aren't doing their job right now? because that's what you're saying about parents.

CherryStoneTree · 20/05/2020 11:11

I don’t understand the call to ban all the threads. It’s a parenting forum for parents of people worried about things. People only post when they have questions are angry etc. People don’t tend to come on and say hi I’ve ha d a great day today, carry on. Asking MN to bam these threads is also asking them to ban people complaining about MIL, surrogacy, trans issues, childminders and complaints about healthcare. People come to vent and seek answers and the people asking for discussion to be banned is making the rest look crazy.

We’re told to not post about our own experiences with schools as it is generalising. But then told to not talk unless we have direct experience? Surely someone saying what is going on with their child’s school is accurate?

stopcock · 20/05/2020 11:18

Surely someone saying what is going on with their child’s school is accurate Yes it is, but the gf that pop up with "What are teachers all doing?" and "Let's stop their pay, then they'll get back to work" are the ones causing the dissension.
And I've noticed, through my lurking, that it is usually the same posters who rock up, drop the grenade, and watch the bunfight unfold. Constructive discussion can be helpful, getting all your (not you specifically) information from the Daily Mail and then coming on spitting bile is not helpful.

echt · 20/05/2020 11:20

We’re told to not post about our own experiences with schools as it is generalising

No. This has not happened. Posters are wrist slapped for:

  1. Posting about their own experience and calling it "teachers are", etc. i.e. generalising from the particular.
  1. Posting about how they don't like what's going on at their child's school but not having lifted a finger to contact the school. Astoundingly common.
stopcock · 20/05/2020 11:23

Or just actual goady thread like:

OP- Why are schools/teachers/unions doing this?

MN Teachers- They aren't. they are questioning Govt guidance.

OP- But i don't understand why teachers/staff/unions are doing this?

MN Teachers- But they aren't. Here's a link.

Random gf- Fucking teachers get over yourselves!!

This is what teaching staff have a problem with. Not constuctive discussion about parental concerns.

FrippEnos · 20/05/2020 11:23

DamnYouAutoCarrot

You should be a politician. Well done.

Calabasa · 20/05/2020 11:25

"Let's have a thread where teachers discuss the inadequacy of parents."

Oh.. try being a 'special needs' parent.. we get that enough already.

Sick of (the) teachers (i've had contact with) judging me for how I raise my SN children.

Might actually be nice for other parents to get a taste of how it fucking feels for your kids teachers to constantly make you feel like a goddam failure and a shit parent.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 20/05/2020 11:26

And I've noticed, through my lurking, that it is usually the same posters who rock up, drop the grenade, and watch the bunfight unfold

I bet they are the ones who are the parents of the first year uni students I teach who crumple at the first sign of criticism and howl over poor grades.

teacherteacher1 · 20/05/2020 11:37

Okay, sorry I have to add my bit:

-first, if your child's class teacher is doing less than the other teachers in the school absolutely criticise them and make sure you do so to the Head but also bear in mind there may be things going on at home, maybe someone has Covid and that is why they are not doing what the other teachers are? Of course it is also possible they are just lazy. I work in a school where both cases are applicable - one teacher has just gone off the radar and their parents are kicking up a fuss (the Head is now dealing with it), in another class a parent kicked up merry hell because a teacher hadn't replied to an e-mail within the morning, kicked up a fuss and had to be told by the head that they had just got off the phone with the teacher who's father had died from Covid - the parent at least had the manners to apologise profusely.

-if your class teacher is doing the same as the rest of the teachers in school then don't criticise "teachers" criticise "schools", "school managers", "the government", "the system" or a million other nouns rather than "teachers" who are doing what they have been told by the Head/LEA/government (note the government has given 0 guidance on what schools should be doing during this)

Also please remember not all teachers are 'sitting at home getting paid to do nothing'.

I have been going to school 3 days a week since lockdown began, I have to get in earlier than before because the morning drop off staff are not in and I am taking care of children from 7.30 until 3.30pm, there is no break cover other than what the three of us in sort between us. I teach 3 year groups in one, whilst answering emails and our communication app message from parents. After 3.30 I stay to record videos for online learning, scan resources to post online etc.
On the two days I am "working from home" I phone all the children in my class, speaking to both the child and parent, each call takes about 20mins and I have 21 children. The majority of each call is taken up talking to parents basically as a counsellor as they tell me how they are struggling to cope, some even end the call saying they are sure I'm enjoying the good weather outside as if I'm not about to call another 19 parents. I mark work sent back digitally, post daily challenges, outdoor activities and PHSE related tasks (yoga vids, mindfulness colouring etc) to stop everyone going mad. I have a weekly staff meeting via zoom, plan next week's work, mark more work sent it, update SEN provision plans. I'll be the first to admit I probably take an extra half day to myself in "school time" but that makes up for spending Sunday afternoon putting together the next week's resources and posting them onto google classroom for the week (parent's didn't want daily updates so they now get the weekly one they wanted plus a daily update on our comms app). I am also writing reports, grade cards, ordering stock for next year and going out to buy cleaning products and hand wash to use if/when all pupils return out of my own money.

Also don't forget the 3 days I am in school I am increasing my risk of getting ill because despite what the government thinks I won't stand there arms folded when a child falls over and cries, or cries because their parents are key workers and are working so much and they miss them or cries because a relative has died from covid. I have to break the 2m rule to tie shoe laces and change kids after toilet accidents.

I am just a regular class teacher in an independent school, I am not a manager or head, I am probably paid less than most other teachers as most have been teaching more than me.

If your school is doing all this and you think it is not enough then criticise the school and demand they do more but I hope you are aware that everyone has their limitations. I can fit all that because I have no kids, but I now rarely see my partner (a doctor working daft shifts because of all of this) and don't see other family because between us both we feel the risk is to great of passing something on to parents, grandparents and siblings. I haven't held by new baby nephew since he was born a month ago.

If you think I am sitting at home getting paid to do nothing than please do tell me, and tell me where you think I could do more! If you think I'm doing my bit than please stop saying "all teachers" and either be specific about certain lazy teachers (there are plenty I know!) or criticise the school or LEA for not expecting more from teachers but don't criticise the teachers for doing what is asked/expected of them. Also bear in mind if you are struggling its likely teachers are too (they have families and kids to home school as well).

Also think about this, what does it say about society when people will happily go out and clap for NHS staff, care workers, postal workers, refuse collectors, supermarket workers, gas and electricity workers but not the people looking after their own children. (I 10000% support clapping for everyone who has to still work outside of their own home during this).

DamnYouAutoCarrot · 20/05/2020 12:01

@teacherteacher1 what a well thought out and meaningful post.

Thank you for the objectivity and insight into all you are doing. I agree that mass generalisation isn't helpful and that's evident from what you have posted.

I would hazard a guess that some parents are genuine in their desire to discuss these topics for the right reasons and as ever, some are out to wind people up.

@FrippEnos 🥂

mumsneedwine · 20/05/2020 12:10

@teacherteacher1 well said (much better than me).

FrippEnos · 20/05/2020 12:11

@DamnYouAutoCarrot

Wine
starrynight19 · 20/05/2020 12:25

teacherteacher1 fantastic post Flowers sounds like your doing an amazing job

Port1aCastis · 20/05/2020 12:30

teacher teacher brilliant post

maddening · 20/05/2020 12:38

No one is criticising you teacher1, surely you understand that.

None of us have seen our relatives either due to lockdown, don't see why that is relevant.

How do I know if what my son's teacher is doing is representative of the school? I don't have a clue what other teachers in his school are doing.

However, You are doing fabulous, I wish that you were my son's teacher. However you aren't and by raising my concerns about my experience I am in no way criticising all teachers, it is great to hear that there are dc out there getting far better support.

Please understand that having issues with 1 teacher is NOT criticising you.

mumsneedwine · 20/05/2020 12:41

@maddening can you see how maddening the headline in the Mail is though. It doesn't mention specific teachers it mentions teachers. All of us. One or two of these would be ok but we have had weeks of it. So thank you for acknowledging some of us are working hard. Some of the press and politicians don't think we are.

IfNotNowThenWhenever · 20/05/2020 12:45

I do think it's hard for parents sometimes to realise just how much teachers do what they are told within schools. I have a few teacher friends and it's obvious that the type of management they have massively impacts how they work.
I do feel a bit frustrated by constant moaning about 0 guidance from the governments though. I would have though if you are a secondary subject teacher you might be able to think of some lessons to send to children without specific guidelines from the government?
Or is it that teachers are actually forbidden to create their own lessons by the school management, even when they are not being held to teach the actual curriculum?
I am genuinely curious about this.
And by all means, teachers, please start a thread on shit, feckless parents if you want to vent. I'm not one so it really wouldn't bother me.

maddening · 20/05/2020 12:53

This thread was not about the daily mail though.

However, yes if the daily mail are telling the people that read their shit hole of a paper that teachers are not working that is shit. Can totally empathise with how that would feel. I work in banking so you do get used to your industry being criticised, don't take it personally though.

Please don't conflate parents having issues with their own children's teachers on an individual basis with a reporter in the daily mail writing such a pile of shite about all teachers.

Perhaps this is a conversation that should be happening within the teaching profession - what does good and bad look like, how can school heads and governors ensure that they are aiming for the good etc, as an industry / profession how can they work out this problem? Perhaps it is, perhaps the teaching profession can address it through the union if that would provide a common platform to come together and provide positive solutions rather than barriers and arguments.

It is a tough one for sure.

mumsneedwine · 20/05/2020 12:53

Not teachers. Some teachers not doing it. Some. Not an entire profession. Some. Not all. Some teachers. Not teachers. Some teachers. Hope that helps.

Mistressiggi · 20/05/2020 12:59

@OhCaptain I beg to differ. Threads are regularly deleted for "not being in the spirit of the site" and not being supportive of parents.
@Rosehip10 thanks for basically telling me, and every other affected teacher, to get off mumsnet if we don't like the goady posts and threads. I doubt MN would actually be pleased if we all did.

Wilberforce1 · 20/05/2020 12:59

What I don't understand is why do teachers get to choose if the schools re-open or not? Doctors, nurses, supermarket worked, office workers don't get to choose they just have to go to work. My kids are desperate to get back (year 1 & 6) and are so excited at the prospect of having even two days at school after half term but now it looks like that might not be happening. I work in a pre school so if that reopens I don't get a choice I just have to go back to work.

My kids school have sent out what seems like a great plan for all involved so what's the problem?

mumsneedwine · 20/05/2020 13:03

@Wilberforce1 er teachers get no say at all. Zilch. Nada. Heads get that joy.

Livingoncake · 20/05/2020 13:03

I'm a teacher. I don't live in the UK, but have done in the past. This much I know: teachers are despised and disrespected in Britain. I found it horrifying as an outsider. Your government and your media encourage the endless barrage of criticism from parents and other members of the public who think they know what the job entails, but haven't a clue.

Parents aren't allowed to criticise teachers? In my experience, everyone in the UK is not just allowed, but encouraged to do so.

Crimsonnightlotus · 20/05/2020 13:09

If they are really concerned, it's better to post on education board about education, not in AIBU. Reactions are different, I think. Less people posting/reading, more genuine comments rather than goady ones.

echt · 20/05/2020 13:15

If they are really concerned, it's better to post on education board about education

That's some "if". So many OPs are "new" to MN and faux-naif. They want the clicks on AIBU.

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