To ask you to share your ideas for how schools go back?

[FurForksSake]

I've seen lots of good ideas and creative thoughts for how to safely get the kids back.

Am I being unreasonable by asking you to share some?

Maybe schools / teachers might see something that would be helpful to how to get through this.

Hand washing/hand sanitizer station on entering and leaving and before eating. Parents take temperature of children on a daily basis. Switch to a set in place distance learning system once a case confirmed for two weeks.
Schools cleaned properly every day.
I think that's it tbh. Kids are unable to.properly socially distance and there is to much contact in a orima

Posted too.soon.there is so much contact in a school I don't know if it is possible to do it all the time.
And no staff communal mugs...

Definitely PPE for staff. To run even three year groups, particularly in a large school, would mean up to 300 children if the plan is for them to return full time. This would mean around 30-40 adults in school, more actually.
Also more buses running to accommodate travelling pupils and staff in London.
Sinks and toilets must be working.
More cleaners must be hired.
More stationary must be bought so each child has their own set.
Windows must be fixed or made to open more than the 'safe' 5 cm.
Children should bring their own lunch and eat it in their classrooms, otherwise lunch in the hall would go on for hours to accommodate social distancing.

Ideally, schools shouldn't start to take children other than the vulnerable/ KW children until all five of the government's tests have been met. My friends who are teachers and I are extremely concerned. Their schools are not able to allow for social distancing even with just three year groups in. Rotas are already being sent out to staff and they include the vulnerable who were advised to work from home as otherwise there wouldn't be enough staff to teach the smaller classes. These are people with severe asthma, diabetes and liver disease. They are also all over 40. They are rightly worried, not only about the journey to work (no option other than to use public transport), but mixing with children, staff and parents. Another friend works in a small one-form entry school and they have already said that social distancing just isn't possible due to lack of space.

So PPE is vital if this is must go ahead. Then they can say they were protected as much as possible.

Of course there aren't hundreds of temporary classrooms sat around, it would be perfect if there were. But I think we have to think more field hospital. Ok marquees and event shelters aren't going to cut it in October / November but for now, they just might be worth a shot.

I also think a campaign to get teaching assistants and qualified teachers who have left to come back (if they aren't in a vulnerable group, not retirees) might be a goer. I don't think anyone expected so many medics to come back, but they did. Same for using student teachers as teaching assistants. If there are going to be gaps there have to be thoughts of possibilities.

Check every child's temp as they arrive at school

They’ve got the year groups the wrong way round. It should be 10s and 12s first.

The only idea I can think of clearly at this time of night.

Don't open schools to the youngest children

At my son’s school:

Use the three gates as one way entrance and exit
Use teachers car park to facilitate social distancing on entry/exit (supermarket over road from school allows parents use for school so I’m sure would allow teacher parking)
Utilise huge school field for playtimes as well as the playground
Packed lunches from home or sandwich provided as school meal - possibly to be eaten in class (not ideal) or outside (weather permitting)
A lot of classrooms have outside doors so utilise these
Children in school half days - working in small groups. Less likely to be stressful for the children if only half days and no need to deal with issues

Don't reopen schools until September.
That's it!

How do you think things will be different in September? Without a vaccine and with other things opening up our R probably won't be better.

For my sons school which is tiny either each year has half a week and then swap - they are nursery and reception, yr 1&2, Yr 3&4 and Yr 5&6 so Yr 1,3,5 in Mon-wed lunch, clean year 2,4, 6 in Thurs Fri and reverse it the following week.

Shorter day, all eat at own desk etc.

Or half days, no need for lunch and half as above in morning, clean at what would have been lunch and half in the afternoon. No playtime, all dc sit at single desk. Only one at a time allowed to toilets.

If no lunch required could also use hall for nursery/reception to allow greater space.

@maddening

Reception don’t have a ‘desk’ nor do many year 1s. They play/learn in areas of provision.

How do you think things will be different in September? Without a vaccine and with other things opening up our R probably won't be better.

In September there's a chance that there will be enough testing available that you can do enough testing to be reasonably confident of the levels of infection in the schools.

I don't have kids in primary, but have one in Y10. I'm amazed the government did not have Y10 and 12 go back first after the nightmare of this years GCSEs and A levels.
They will need to get quickly caught up with the syllabus as so many schools are not equipped to do extensive online learning, and more hands on courses, like art, music, science, drama and PE, need to be done in school. That age group are mature enough to do social distancing and practise good hygiene.
And colleges - I have a son in one. He has to do supervised training to get his qualification and can not do that now. Likewise for apprenticeships. The long term implications for these two year groups ca not be underestimated.
I think the schools are smart enough to be able to work it out for these older kids. But I can not see how younger children can be expected to keep apart - and where the space and staff are to try and accommodate this.

Schools in Denmark are back next week. 1 metre social distancing.

Half days, so half of pupils in for the morning, half in the afternoon.

No pupils in over lunch time to allow for cleaning between sessions.

Core subjects only in secondary schools, to make complex time tabling easier. Core subjects to be taught lecture-style in exam halls with space out desks.

We need much sticter rules to stop the spread of the virus.

Boys running round coughing in peoples faces shouting "corona" can not happen again.

Staggered drop off and pick up

Small class sizes. If size of school/number of teachers doesn't easily allow for this then attendance can be staggered.

No social distancing for KS1. they won't be able to do it anyway, realistically. Id prefer it if they were allowed to mix in small groups (maybe 5 or 6 children) that don't change.

Handwashing

Children outside as much as possible

I hope mine are able to go back. It's a small rural school with more than enough space to manage this. That wouldn't be the case if all year groups returned though.

Not half days though. That would be annoying and disruptive, and wouldn't leave sufficient time in the middle of the day for cleaning.

Better to do whole days, I reckon.

No one has properly thought this through at all beyond 'opening schools = getting people back to work'

Lets have a think. In secondary (Scotland) if we take back the exam years (S4, 4, 5) which are really the only ones who kinda need to go in - that's half the school. Current thinking is no more than 20% at a time.

Classrooms are generally small and packed. Current thinking is no more than 6 pupils to a classroom (to allow for 2m social distancing)
If the teacher has a class of 30.. that's 5 sessions of 6 kids to deliver ONE lesson. Who will clean between the classes coming in? what about corridors? Toilets? Canteen?

School lunch. Our canteen can hold roughly 1/3 of the school at a time if packed in like sardines. Do we start lunch at 10am and continue through til 3pm to allow for social distancing? Who will clean between groups of kids coming in? how long will that take?

If I am in school teaching one class over 5 periods of 6 pupils each - who will be delivering E-Learning to my other 5 classes that day?

Who will take the classes of the teachers who were here from overseas and went back home just before lockdown and now can't return without quarantine?

Who will take the classes of teachers who need to shield? Or isolate?

Who will take the classes of teachers who can't get childcare for their own young kids?

Your average school will have at least a third of staff who can't actually come to the building if it did open (for one reason or another).

If the solution is filling a marquee or assembly hall and giving a lecture style lesson to the masses - why on earth do they need to be in school for this when it could be recorded and delivered online?

Your average secondary is 800+ pupils and often much more. 70-100 teachers and staff. Narrow corridors, classroom changes once an hour with all 800+ kids switching room/desks/equipment. Its not an office of grownups where you can each sit at your desk/cubicle/workbench and not move all day. Its kids who will think it hilarious to cough in your face, to lick the door, to touch every desk as they come into and leave the classroom.

Even if every single one of those 800 kids live with a single parent and no siblings, that's 1600 potential 'sources' of infection. 1800 if you include staff. And each person will go home every night with whatever they picked up in school that day to spread it to home. A nasty sickness bug can wipe out a school and see it closed for a few days due to ill staff, and that's highly unlikely to kill anyone.

I have a friend who lives on one of the remote Scottish islands, Covid was brought there by 2 adults who had been on holiday to Italy. They came home on Friday. At the weekend their son attended an 18th birthday with such joys as 'dookin for apples' in a bath of cider and many 'drams' being shared around (one bottle, one shot glass, passed and refilled and passed and refilled).
On Monday they were not feeling so great, phoned NHS 24 and were advised Covid was v unlikely and to carry on as usual. Both adults went to work. On Tuesday night they were very ill and NHS 24 advised them to get tested. Both tested positive for Covid. Less than 2 weeks later the workmate of one of the adults was airlifted off the island by the RAF to intensive care and almost died. For the first two weeks there was extensive trace testing and every single positive result could be traced back to that couple, or their son at that party. Every single one. Infection rate was way above national average/per head of population. Then, the government stopped all testing there. It very quickly spread into care homes where no testing was carried out and throughout the community. Probably the strictest lock down in the UK eventually slowed the spread, but not before 7 people died.

It certainly shows how it only takes one infection source to spread like wildfire in a small, tight knit community.

Schools are incredibly hard to enforce social distancing in, a lot of people in a small confined space, to few toilets/sinks for appropriate hand washing, kids not known for their fabulous hygiene at the best of times and no way to properly clean rooms/equipment between classes. Even something as simple as door handles. Doors must remain shut in corridors as fire barriers. Very few schools have automatic doors (no money). There are 8 (!) doors between the main door and my classroom and that's by no means unusual.

I get why people want schools open, I really do. Teaching from home is a shit substitute, engagement is poor and many parents unsupportive. But at the moment, opening them is really not a great thing in terms of the spread of this virus.

Do a pilot In an area with low infection rate: in a local area, identify staff with low risk factors. Set up surveillance in the population and families of kids - ie people know to contact someone if they get symptoms. Ensure adequate testing available. This way any increase can be closely monitored and restrictions increased again if there is a spike.

Start with SEN and also exam year groups and year before exams (eg year before a levels, gcses, year before gcses). Ensure everyone has cloth masks and knows hygiene procedure. Kids should be warned they will be excluded if they break rules.

Start 1 day per week per year group selected. Preference for English and maths gcses. Halve class sizes so half go in on 1 day and half on another.

If pilot works, then can expand to other areas with low rates of infection. Can try expanding year groups.

Beebie2
I did not suggest nursery and reception were at desks, I suggested they had the school hall as this was bigger.

I was also only referring to my son's school of you read my post and in his school Yr 1 do have desks. They have about 10--12 per year as it is a small school. I would not offer. Solutions for all schools as I don't know them to comment which is why I referred only to my sons school. What can be achieved in each school will obviously vary so case. By case Imo rather than being deliberately obtuse.

I'm intrigued to know how this is going to work. My DD is 5 in reception with an EHCP application in process. There is zero chance she could safely be part of a group of 15 with one adult. She frequently needs 1 to 1 to keep her/others safe. There's already another child in her year with an EHCP and high level of support needed too. There's at least 3 other children in her year who behaviourally difficult. There isn't the staffing.

Ok scrap just reception, year 1 and year 6. Instead have children returning to school as their parents are returning to work with no need to be in for the full five days and children booked in via some sort of booking in system.
Childcare provision only until the majority are back so those being shielded aren't being disadvantaged.
Staggered drop off and pick up times.
Parental right to keep children off until R number is sufficiently low enough.
Don't waste time worrying about social distancing because it's not going to happen anyway.
Suspend fees for breakfast and after school clubs do nobody is having to rely on grandparents for wraparound care.